Fiddler on the roof Appropriate for young boys?

amother

Pink

Mon, Jun 27 2016, 10:41 am

would you take your kids to watch this broadway show?
My DH is insisting its good for my 10 & 12 yr old sons to watch this.
We're chassidish, kids we're never by any movies/ shows. DH is currently struggling with yiddishkeit, isn't keeping things, just fakes for the kids. He wants them to have "the best life" whatever he missed out on. He wants to open them to new opportunities, & different ideas.
I don't know what position to take

amother

Mauve

Mon, Jun 27 2016, 11:00 am

Maybe read about the summary of the story. Parts regard pulling down mechitza, leaving yiddishkeit to join communism, etc.
Plus women singing and dancing - its a musical.
I don't think it would be okay.

If you are okay with the singing I would still choose a different story line - not Jewish. Like my fair lady or a disney story. At least it isn't dealing with Jewish philosophy.

I'm sorry it sounds like you are in a difficult situation.

cnc

Mon, Jun 27 2016, 11:37 am

amother wrote:

I might take my daughters, but chasidishe boys to a show with women singing on stage? I don't think so.

I wouldn't even take my daughters to this specific show.

It's funny- because my parents grew up with it and always reference it and I was quite surprised when I recently saw it myself. I wasn't aware that it had certain underlying themes/hashkafos until I saw it.

DrMom

Mon, Jun 27 2016, 11:42 am

amother wrote:

I don't remember this part...
Do you mean when the 2nd daughter marries a revolutionary and they go to Siberia? Who says they abandon yiddishkeit?
Maybe this is something in the play and not the film, because I cannot recall this.

sky

Mon, Jun 27 2016, 12:06 pm

DrMom wrote:

IIR correctly each daughter moves more away from their family's culture. (Maybe the OP's dh relates to the story.)

1st daughter chooses her own husband - going against community norms and what her father wants - her father's choice is shown as very bad.

2nd daughter marries someone who leaves the Jewish community to join communism. (wasn't he the one he tears down the mechitza or was that someone else?)

The third daughter marries a non-Jew.

amother

Cerulean

Mon, Jun 27 2016, 12:35 pm

It's a musical, with women singing and dancing. Not in an inappropriate way, but it's definitely kol isha. I understand your husband doesn't care anymore, but if your kids do, they shouldn't see it for that reason alone.
I don't get the freaking out about the content. Do you never discuss with your kids the history of Jews and socialism? Or the fact that intermarriage sadly happens? If anything, it's a great opportunity to have these discussions. I watched the movie when I was 11 and my mom discussed the themes with me. How that first minor leeway lead to bigger breaches. How Chava starting too close a friendship with Fyedka ends with intermarriage. Etc. There's a lot of valuable stuff to talk about. Again, problem for boys due to kol isha, but the content itself is not actually inappropriate, just thought provoking.

bigsis144

Mon, Jun 27 2016, 12:52 pm

If you're fine with kol isha, I also would vote for "see a show, but not Fiddler".

It's one thing to discuss the history of assimilation with kids, but this musical practically romanticizes it. From "I have no idea why we do this... TRADITION!" to moving the mechitza to intermarriage, Fiddler portrays the shtetl (and along the way, Judaism itself) in a bittersweet "progress marches on, leave the past behind" way.

Never taking my kids to see it, much to the dismay of my Conservative relatives who know of my passion for musical theater and think of Fiddler as the quintessential Jewish show.

--

Newsies is really fun and has AMAZING dancing and music. But be warned that the romance has definitely been punched up from the movie musical -- Denton the male reporter has been replaced with a plucky young female reporter named Katherine, who is the love interest for Jack Kelly and has a number of solo songs as well as harmonies in major songs like King of New York and Once and For All, and a Big darn Kiss at the end of the show.

Also, Medda has a musical number in a flirty vaudeville show with some backup showgirls and a few euphemistic lyrics that would go over the heads of younger viewers.

--

Oy, I just checked and Newsies is on tour now, not in NY anymore. Sad

amother

Papaya

Mon, Jun 27 2016, 12:53 pm

amother wrote:

What "good" does he see in this Broadway production? I can understand feeling the FOTR is neutral but good for your children's Yiddeshkeit?How?

Sounds like your husband is taking them because he is struggling with yiddeskeit and wants them to start struggling too...

There are plenty of other opportunities that aren't so controversial with a lot more clearly positive aspects for for him to start with. Why start with an anti frum Broadway production?

glamourmom

Mon, Jun 27 2016, 12:58 pm

amother wrote:

if her DH is having issues being frum he'll most likely use the story line to provoke questions in his children. he won't use it as a good lesson for them what not to do...

DrMom

Mon, Jun 27 2016, 12:59 pm

sky wrote:

You describe actions which take place in the play without discussing the perspective from which the play views these actions.

1st daughter - wants to marry another man in her community. The family likes the fellow, and then they are in the awkward position of having to cancel the shidduch the father arranged (without consulting the daughter or the mother) to the first fellow.

2nd daughter - Her husband didn't voluntarily "leave the Jewish community." He was exiled by Czarist forces out of the shtetl to Siberia, and she goes joins her DH. I'm sure there were plenty of Jews in Siberia. She writes letters to her family. I don't see her or her DH as poor role models. What's the problem here?

3rd daughter - The father disapproves of her intermarriage and sits shiva. He is willing to consider some concessions to modernity, but he knows where to draw the line. Do you object to his actions, or to raising the topic at all? The father is not learned (which may be why he does not know the halacha of many things), but he strives to be (If I were rich, I'd have the time that I lack/To sit in the synagogue and pray./And maybe have a seat by the Eastern wall.
/And I'd discuss the holy books with the learned men, several hours every day./That would be the sweetest thing of all.)and to do what is best. How exactly is this bad?

I understand the objections to kol isha, and maybe the mixed dancing scene (although it could be a jumping off point for discussion), but I don't understand your other objections.

leah233

Mon, Jun 27 2016, 1:14 pm

DrMom wrote:

I never saw it on Broadway but I did see the movie.

Frum people are portrayed as total idiots practicing a meaningless tradition that Tevyeh makes a point of saying he has no idea how it started it is just a tradition.(IOW this is just cultural)

Simple questions about Yiddiskeit are presented as if there is no answer (I.e the movie leaves them unanswered)

etc.

DrMom

Mon, Jun 27 2016, 1:25 pm

leah233 wrote:

I never saw it on Broadway but I did see the movie.
Frum people are portrayed as total idiots practicing a meaningless tradition that Tevyeh makes a point of saying he has no idea how it started it is just a tradition.(IOW this is just cultural)

Simple questions about her Yiddiskeit are presented as if there is no answer (I.e the movie leaves them unanswered)

etc.

True the main character is not learned, and perhaps he cannot separate minhag from halacha (which wouldn't make him much different from many people on these boards...), but he has reverence for yahadut, and tries to keep to the correct path, even when his ways are being challenged.

He may not understand all the halachic ins and out (he laments not having the time to learn -- his fondest wish is to have the wealth necessary to have the luxury to sit and learn all day), but he knows that halacha and minhag are what has kept Jews alive throughout the millenia, and he strives to preserve these important lifelines to the past and the future even during a period of tremendous upheaval.

No, the film is not perfect, but I am quite surprised by the strong negative reactions here. It's not an idealized biography of a godol -- it's the story of a simple but good Jew.