Home
Log in / Sign Up
    Private Messages   Advanced Search   Rules   New User Guide   FAQ   Advertise   Contact Us  
Forum -> Parenting our children
Father takes daughter into ladies public bathroom
1  2  Next



Post new topic   Reply to topic View latest: 24h 48h 72h

amother
Babyblue


 

Post Fri, Jul 15 2016, 3:17 pm
I was with my family in the only kosher restaurant in a city that is a common stopping point between various large Jewish communities. There was a family there eating dinner- a mom, a dad and a couple of kids, including a 4-5 year old girl. By all appearances, they were frum.

I went to the 2 stall ladies room and was still in there when I heard the door open and a man's voice and a young girl's voice. I assumed the father was just showing his daughter where to go, until he kept talking as he walked in.

I cleared my throat so he would know there was someone in there. He didn't leave. The young girl started asking "Is this the ladies room, or for anyone?" The father didn't answer, so after she asked multiple times I finally said 'It's the ladies room". The outside door, by the way, is clearly labeled.

The father got the point and called his wife in to be with the daughter instead, but I was still very disturbed by what happened. The mother went into the stall with her daughter- would the father have done the same, which would have put him just a foot away from me in a stall with an open top and bottom- and stall doors that, it happens, did not properly lock?

In what way is this ok- in any situation, by any standards? He could have taken her the men's room, he could have made sure the bathroom was unoccupied, his wife could have taken her.

He knew it was occupied- I cleared my throat at first, to try to tell him politely that they weren't alone. It was only when I made a point that he shouldn't be there that he left.

By the way- I am by no means a prude or unreasonable. A month ago I was at a cemetery in a frum area and a man walked into the ladies room by accident. We laughed it off- mistakes happen. This time it wasn't a mistake- it was a disregard for propriety and personal feelings.
Back to top

ra_mom




 
 
    
 

Post Fri, Jul 15 2016, 3:31 pm
I agree that it was wrong. When dh has to take little dd to the bathroom he takes her to the men's room and watches over her.
Back to top

Zehava




 
 
    
 

Post Fri, Jul 15 2016, 3:54 pm
I take my little son to the mens room. It's easier to use a urinal. Never did it in a frum place though.
Back to top

sky




 
 
    
 

Post Fri, Jul 15 2016, 3:55 pm
I agree it is wrong.
Problem is some mens bathrooms have urinals. I don't want want my daughter going in there either. If its just a father alone with his daughter its a hard call. If the wife was there she should have done it (but its possible she has an issue that you can't see that prevents her from doing so)

(BTW according to the new NY law if a man is asked to leave a women's bathroom I think the site can be fined a lot. )

I would never go into the a men's bathroom because of the urinals, I've taken my boys into the women's bathroom and lifted them when they went so they should make it in, if needed.
Back to top

ra_mom




 
 
    
 

Post Fri, Jul 15 2016, 3:59 pm
Zehava wrote:
I take my little son to the mens room. It's easier to use a urinal. Never did it in a frum place though.


What about the men who are in the men's room and don't feel comfortable doing their business because a women is there or can't use the urinal?

As an aside, do you feel safe in the men's room?
Back to top

Zehava




 
 
    
 

Post Fri, Jul 15 2016, 4:01 pm
If I see a man doing his business I wait outside. And yeah I feel safe. It's a public place. The urinals are usually right by the door and anyone can walk in at any time.
Back to top

imasinger




 
 
    
 

Post Fri, Jul 15 2016, 5:48 pm
Let's be d"lz here and assume the father just experienced major trauma and wasn't thinking straight. Or something.

Yes, a ladies' room is never a place for a man.
Back to top

pickle321




 
 
    
 

Post Sat, Jul 16 2016, 1:51 pm
Maybe the men's room was full and the girl couldn't wait so he took her in to the ladies room to avoid an accident. I once had to do that when I couldn't find a ladies room and a kid I was babysitting had to make really badly, it was empty but a man walked in when I was washing the kids hands, he just laughed.
Back to top

FranticFrummie




 
 
    
 

Post Sat, Jul 16 2016, 2:37 pm
I don't get it. What were you afraid was going to happen? Were you going to walk out of the stall half dressed? Was he going to break into the stall and assault you? Was he taking pictures under the door?

He had a little girl with him for pete's sake!

I wouldn't want my DD to see men openly urinating, so I definitely wouldn't want her in the men's room unless it was an emergency. If I were busy nursing a baby, or taking care of a kid who was having a meltdown, and another child needed to use the bathroom, you bet I'd have DH take her to the ladies' room.I trust my DH to keep his eyes averted, and get in and out as quickly as possible.

Maybe the little girl was afraid to go in by herself. Maybe there was no waitress to ask to take her, maybe there were no other people offering to take her in. Maybe the girl was afraid of strange women, too. Maybe the girl had special needs, and couldn't handle going in by herself.

I think the dad was awesome, because he was willing to step in and do his parenting duty, instead of waiting for a woman to rescue him from the big scary bathroom problem. I'm sure he was just as uncomfortable as you were.

If I had to choose between a man in the ladies' room, or a shy 5yo peeing on the restaurant floor, and then dissolving into tears of humiliation, I'll deal with the man any day.

Besides, in most states, bathrooms are all unisex anyway, because Obama says that you can't discriminate against anyone, regardless of how they "identify".
Back to top

Volunteer




 
 
    
 

Post Sat, Jul 16 2016, 10:39 pm
I agree with FF.
This is why we need more family bathrooms.
Back to top

amother
Coral


 

Post Sat, Jul 16 2016, 10:56 pm
Wow. I never knew urinals were dirty words and things to be hidden. And I think it's wrong to say that you want to protect your childs "innocence" (if you can even call it that) so you'll make grown ladies and young girls alike uncomfortable for having grown men in the womens room. Lucky for you though we have obama in office and everyone can use every bathroom. Yay.
Back to top

Notsobusy




 
 
    
 

Post Sat, Jul 16 2016, 11:04 pm
amother wrote:
Wow. I never knew urinals were dirty words and things to be hidden. And I think it's wrong to say that you want to protect your childs "innocence" (if you can even call it that) so you'll make grown ladies and young girls alike uncomfortable for having grown men in the womens room. Lucky for you though we have obama in office and everyone can use every bathroom. Yay.


The urinal isn't the problem, it's the fact that there are men who are using them that's the problem Rolling Eyes
Back to top

amother
Coral


 

Post Sat, Jul 16 2016, 11:06 pm
glutenless wrote:
The urinal isn't the problem, it's the fact that there are men who are using them that's the problem Rolling Eyes

And the fact that there are women using the bathroom with nice size cracks between the "walls"?? Urinals are designed for guys to be covered up while doing their thing. The little angel doesn't have to see anything inappropriate.
Back to top

amother
Gray


 

Post Sun, Jul 17 2016, 1:40 am
maybe he/she identified as a women?!?
Back to top

marina




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, Jul 17 2016, 2:19 am
I am completely not understanding
OP why you just didn't wait for the little girl to finish, instead of embarrassing the dad and engendering all this unnecessary drama?
Back to top

gold21




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, Jul 17 2016, 2:22 am
Zehava wrote:
If I see a man doing his business I wait outside. And yeah I feel safe. It's a public place. The urinals are usually right by the door and anyone can walk in at any time.


Why dont u just take your son to the ladies room? Im assuming he is a little kid. Why would you go into the mens room?
Back to top

heidi




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, Jul 17 2016, 7:42 am
From the rest of OP's post, it seems the mother was completely able to take her daughter to the bathroom. Which she did. So this wasn't an emergency where there was no one else to take the daughter to the bathroom.
If for whatever reason a father does take his daughter to the bathroom, I would think the woman's bathroom is always preferable. It can be quite traumatic to little girls to see big men urinating. But a loud knock on the door, followed by an announcement-- "HI, I'm a father with a five year old girl who needs the bathroom, can I come in?" would be more appropriate than what this man did.
Not sure why it matters if they/you were religious or not.
Back to top

ora_43




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, Jul 17 2016, 11:22 am
FranticFrummie wrote:
I don't get it. What were you afraid was going to happen? Were you going to walk out of the stall half dressed? Was he going to break into the stall and assault you? Was he taking pictures under the door?

He had a little girl with him for pete's sake!

I wouldn't want my DD to see men openly urinating, so I definitely wouldn't want her in the men's room unless it was an emergency. If I were busy nursing a baby, or taking care of a kid who was having a meltdown, and another child needed to use the bathroom, you bet I'd have DH take her to the ladies' room.I trust my DH to keep his eyes averted, and get in and out as quickly as possible.

I think you're contradicting yourself somewhat. "What was going to happen" - the same exact thing you're saying you'd be afraid of if your dd was in the men's room. A person seeing a person of the opposite gender in a state of partial undress, thus making them (both) uncomfortable.

I don't get why so many posters here are more worried about the idea of a 5-year-old girl seeing a man's back as he urinates than the idea of a grown man seeing a grown woman in a state of partial undress. The latter clearly being OP's concern, as she said. Obviously (obvious to me, anyway) both situations would be uncomfortable, but I think it's more awkward between adults.
Back to top

ora_43




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, Jul 17 2016, 11:29 am
heidi wrote:
Not sure why it matters if they/you were religious or not.

To me them being frum would make it much weirder.

Someone who isn't frum, I'd assume they assumed there was no risk of seeing anything they weren't supposed to see. Like, they thought "no big deal, any women in here will be in closed stalls" (whether OP is right about the stall doors not fully covering is beside the point; most stall doors do block people's view so it'd be a reasonable assumption to make).

Someone who is frum, though - there are plenty of things a woman might do in a bathroom, not in a closed stall, that between frum people would be not for men's eyes. Eg, I know I'm not the only frum woman who sometimes takes off her hair covering to adjust it in the bathroom.

Like you said, I think the whole issue would be a non-issue if he would just knock. It's not going into the women's room that's a problem. But going in unannounced and then not taking the hint and leaving after OP cleared her throat was inconsiderate.
Back to top

cnc




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, Jul 17 2016, 11:30 am
ora_43 wrote:
I think you're contradicting yourself somewhat. "What was going to happen" - the same exact thing you're saying you'd be afraid of if your dd was in the men's room. A person seeing a person of the opposite gender in a state of partial undress, thus making them (both) uncomfortable.

I don't get why so many posters here are more worried about the idea of a 5-year-old girl seeing a man's back as he urinates than the idea of a grown man seeing a grown woman in a state of partial undress. The latter clearly being OP's concern, as she said. Obviously (obvious to me, anyway) both situations would be uncomfortable, but I think it's more awkward between adults.


Aren't urinals completely open?
Women's toilets have doors and locks.
Back to top
Page 1 of 2 1  2  Next Recent Topics




Post new topic   Reply to topic    Forum -> Parenting our children

Related Topics Replies Last Post
Daughter was waitlisted at NJ high schools, what to do?
by amother
11 Today at 1:55 am View last post
My 4 yo daughter is difficult to parent, any advice please?
by amother
15 Thu, Mar 21 2024, 9:13 pm View last post
An outlet that works on my daughter's strength
by amother
20 Thu, Mar 21 2024, 12:48 pm View last post
Can someone please explain laser my daughter wants full body
by amother
24 Wed, Mar 20 2024, 3:36 pm View last post
Selfish married daughter
by amother
13 Mon, Mar 18 2024, 11:19 pm View last post