"banning" a friend from your teen

amother

Sat, Aug 18 2007, 6:20 pm

Have you ever told your (teenage) daughter not to be friends with a certain person? Or out and out forbade a friendship? because the girl is a very bad influence? did it work? would your daughter listen, or just yes you, and you know/suspect that she is still friends? do you find its better to keep your mouth shut, for fear of making it worse? is there another solution to this problem? how else can you deal with it?
(as an aside- we are talking about a girl who is openly proud of being mechalel shabbos and when I raised the issue of this girl to s/o who knows her, she said "being mechalel shabbos is the least of this girl's issues", so its pretty bad, and even worse because the teen is also very susceptible and naive.)
Any ideas? asap please and tia.

gryp

Sat, Aug 18 2007, 9:17 pm

Teenagers being what teenagers are, a ban on anything or anybody will make them do the exact opposite. Sure, I was banned from some of my friends. Not that it did anything except make me hang around them more and we laughed at the ban together Rolling Eyes

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If you can talk to your teen and have a light discussion about other people doing things you wouldn't want her to do, be very specific, and explain why, you can get her to have the same sensitivity towards the wrong things that you do.

amother

Sat, Aug 18 2007, 11:20 pm

Similar issue not as bad. The girl dressed like a slut. Not just "not tznius". My dd said, but she has no good role models.True the parents are weird but she has been in a frum school her entire life. The "compromise" was that htye could hang out here. Not at her house b/c by dd own admission there were no good role models there, & never in public. Happily dd ralized that this girl didn't Want to change so she won't. I had to be willing to hear her out & make the compromize. You have to know when & how hard you can push.

amother

Sun, Aug 19 2007, 4:12 am

amother wrote:

(op here) the diff is, it sounds like your teen recog right from wrong and kind of realized on her own that this girl was bad news. she maybe just needed a slight push from you to compromise and I'm assuming, eventually cut it off. in my case, my teen doesn't realize, or want to realize, that this girl is just bad, bad, bad.
should I try to block this girls number from her cell phone (maybe I can do it thru the cell phone co) without telling her?

TzenaRena

Sun, Aug 19 2007, 5:14 am

GR wrote:

GR, who says every teen will react that way. It probably depends on whether the girl will listen to her mother in general.

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If you can talk to your teen and have a light discussion about other people doing things you wouldn't want her to do, be very specific, and explain why, you can get her to have the same sensitivity towards the wrong things that you do.

What does this mean? Confused

OP I 'm not experienced with this problem, though I have teens Bh, so I'm perhaps not in position to advise, but I think it's clear that it can't continue. I wouldn't allow the relationship to go on, and would use any effective measures possible. I think you should figure out a strategy with someone with experience, a mashpia, often someone in the hanhalah of her school (that you respect) can help with advice, if there is a good communication with them. I have found discussions with teachers, menahelim about Chinuch issues very helpful. They are experienced! They may be authority figures to be wary of, for teens with attitudes, but in reality they are working together with you, for your child's sake, and you should not hesitate to use this resource.

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should I try to block this girls number from her cell phone (maybe I can do it thru the cell phone co) without telling her?

Who pays her cell phone bills? Must she have one for important reasons? I don't think kids should have unlimited use of cell phones.

Ruchel

Sun, Aug 19 2007, 5:24 am

Yes my parents banned me from a few friends. Yes it annoyed me. But they told me why and in the end I obeyed. It depends if the teen is only thinking of NOW or aware of consequences. I like to think I was not the only intelligent teen and a good discussion would convince them...

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I don't think kids should have unlimited use of cell phones.

She can have one that only receives and gives calls to certain numbers

amother

Sun, Aug 19 2007, 7:25 am

Unfortunately, she needs a cell phone, she is in sem.
Ruchel, you sound a lot more mature and intelligent then this teen ever was.
GR, your suggestion sounds nice but won't work.
I think I'll have to show her how she will lose out by being friends with this girl. the question is what exactly can I tell her that will "scare" her into not being friends with her. As Tzenarena said "I wouldn't allow the relationship to go on, and would use any effective measures possible."
However, I don't want to discuss this further with the sem principle, although she is aware of the problem, because she is already telling me that she thinks the sem program might not be for her and that already puts us on opposite sides bec I do think this sem is the only place for her and is very suited to her.

greenfire

Sun, Aug 19 2007, 7:43 am

the more you take the teens away the more they will rebel ... can even do more just to spite the parent ... we all have to learn to live in this world and not allow influences to over power our better judgement ... it would be far beneficial to explain some of these ideas to your dd - that we must take on a character of our own despite any negative surroundings ... take a stand for what we believe ... be respectful to ourselves ... with that you just might have more clout ...

Ruchel

Sun, Aug 19 2007, 7:50 am

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the more you take the teens away the more they will rebel

yes. This is why, for example, the phone thing should have been done from start. "ok I will buy you a phone, IF x, y and z, and it is for YOUR sake because a, b and c". A cell phone is a priviledge and as such comes with responsabilities and can be taken away when it is abused. But the rules need to be there from the start. For example, can call and be called by friends you approve of, and if a friend turns bad, it is known you will forbod him/her.

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the question is what exactly can I tell her that will "scare" her into not being friends with her.

reputation?
shidduchim?
influence on the long run?
people assimilating her with her bad friend?

amother

Sun, Aug 19 2007, 10:26 am

well, apparently the sem principle told her she can't be friends with her bec if she hangs out with her she'll get her in trouble, make her do bad stuff and she'll end up getting kicked out. she sounded like she was maskim, said she doesn't want to get kicked out. we'll see if it "sticks" and works.

gryp

Sun, Aug 19 2007, 10:31 am

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GR, who says every teen will react that way. It probably depends on whether the girl will listen to her mother in general.

I don't know, Tzena, To tell you the truth, I didn't really know too many teens who listened to their mothers.

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What does this mean?

Sorry, I didn't write that as clearly as I thought I did. I meant if you can get her to have the same sensitivity that you do towards wrong things.

Ruchel

Sun, Aug 19 2007, 10:40 am

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I don't know, Tzena, To tell you the truth, I didn't really know too many teens who listened to their mothers.

It really depends. I noticed in traditional families be it frum, non frum but traditional or non Jewish, the teens listen sometimes out of respect and understanding, sometimes out of fear.
Among those, Jew or not, who let go of the values, this unfortunately includes family values and respect of the parents, and it shows.

I also noticed parents who are too lax or too strict encounter much more problems with their teens.

greenfire

Sun, Aug 19 2007, 10:45 am

Ruchel wrote:

greenfire wrote:

nobody in sem is under 18 ... and the way is not to control at that point but to discuss and with wisdom and dignity - try to have her understand ...

I thought it could be a hs sem (basically like a normal Jewish hs but where you also live at night).

no high school is high school - and seminary is seminary ... similar to high school vs. university ...

I think even kids who are fearful of their parents do not listen to their advice/demands all the time - teens by nature explore out of boundaries ...

TzenaRena

Sun, Aug 19 2007, 10:48 am

amother wrote:

sometimes the hanhalah gets the girl to sign a contract to these type of conditions. did they do that?

I'm glad this solution was thought of, and lets hope it works. She will have to have ways of evading/discouraging her friend's attempts to contact her, and keeping her resolve strong.

Ruchel

Sun, Aug 19 2007, 10:53 am

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no high school is high school - and seminary is seminary ... similar to high school vs. university ...

oh ok, in France you may hear sem for hs sem

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I think even kids who are fearful of their parents do not listen to their advice/demands all the time - teens by nature explore out of boundaries ...

Yeah, fearful is not the way to go, you need the teen to understand his parents are on his side. Exploring sure, but they might want to do it in a non dangerous way... or not, depending on if they think of the future and if they want to spare themselves difficulties Sad