Does this make me a racist?

amother

Chartreuse

Sat, Nov 19 2016, 6:51 pm

Wow, as someone who is black, this is really sad and a lot of what I encountered when I moved to a frum neighborhood. my kids never made any friends and even at shul my husband and I were constantly questioned, multiple times by the same person wanting to know our life story. people were sooooo suspicious of us and really made us feel not Jewish. so much so that we moved and we live somewhere else. still encountering the same problem but we do much better with Sephardim and now daven at a Sephardi shul.

so while I know most people want to live by people who share similarities with them, not wanting to live by specific people (and you haven't even given a reason why) just because of their skin color or ethnicity is racist. I hope you never have to move somewhere with a very low population of frum jews and have someone say "wow, I don't want to live by jews."

leah233

Sat, Nov 19 2016, 7:01 pm

In relation to the OPs question . If I knew I was getting new non-Jewish neighbors and I knew they were honest decent hardworking people if would not make a difference to me what race they were. Even if I knew a major influx of them into the neighborhood would follow.

However I do not deny being very wary of certain ethnic groups due to repeated painfully bad experiences with members of them. National crime and other statistics back up my perspective. (yes I know it is only because the system is so biased against them) I don't think that makes me a racist . I think for me to think otherwise would make me what is referred to as a "useful idiot"

And I do not think the non-Jews who live in the cities bordering mine trying to keep the "hasidim" (actually not Chasidim)out can only be motivated by anti-Semitism

Last edited by leah233 on Sat, Nov 19 2016, 7:06 pm; edited 1 time in total

shoshanim999

Sat, Nov 19 2016, 7:04 pm

amother wrote:

I hear you. I think the reason why I wouldn't want to live next door to a black or Mexican family is because it is completely unfamiliar to me. I was raised and grew up in a neighborhood that was overwhelmingly frum and had very few minorities. I think a black person who grew up in an all black neighborhood or a Mexican who was raised in a Mexican neighborhood would struggle to adjust if they were forced to live in a all white neighborhood. Does that make them racist? I still would like some explanation why Obama carried 95% of the black vote in 2012. Surely a large % of those votes were by blacks who simply preferred a human with black skin over a person with white skin. Was that racist?

amother

Chartreuse

Sat, Nov 19 2016, 7:30 pm

What does being unfamiliar have to do with anything? What do you think a black or Mexican family does differently than you (excluding religion)? If it's a family, they are probably doing the same things that you are doing. Homework, bath time, going to work, getting kids to school, dinner, etc. I'm a black Jew who lived in an all-white Jewish area and the only reason I struggled was because people were so blatantly racist and suspicious of my husband and I from the get-go. THEY made the neighborhood hard for my family, not the other way around. Most people, I believe, could live anywhere if the people in the neighborhood were kind. Even cordial, at the very least.

I don't understand how you are connecting racism to people living in different neighborhoods if they are the minority? What? Struggling to adjust makes someone racist? Why look at them and not the people around them? If someone is uncomfortable because someone of a different race or religion moves into the neighborhood, then that is THAT person's fault. Not the person who moved in.

And while I don't agree with voting for someone solely because of their skin color, most black people are Democrats. So of course they are going to vote for whoever the Democratic nominee is. Obama being black, Democrat, highly educated, married, and drama free was something very inspirational for a lot of black people. The same way a lot of women voted for Clinton. Sure, she's a woman. But she was also the first (some debate on this though) female Presidential elect. Some countries that are considered third-world by the US have or already have had female presidents/prime ministers.

shoshanim999 wrote:

MagentaYenta

Sat, Nov 19 2016, 9:41 pm

leah233 wrote:

... I knew they were honest decent hardworking people if would not make a difference to me what race they were.

If they could afford a house in your neighborhood wouldn't that be enough? I mean I'm guessing you don't live in a neighborhood where drug lords are buying homes. Why isn't the family's ability to to own and pay for a home in your neighborhood enough? And no I don't want to hear about your crime stats.

Last edited by MagentaYenta on Sat, Nov 19 2016, 9:43 pm; edited 1 time in total

ectomorph

Sat, Nov 19 2016, 9:43 pm

amother wrote:

I agree.

amother

Cobalt

Sat, Nov 19 2016, 9:54 pm

MagentaYenta wrote:

Unfortunately I do, most of my family are racists.

Same, to my great chagrin.

I once sat at a family meal where we were discussing politics. The discussion turned to Obama's policies and a family friend said "But Obama doesn't know how to read!" I looked at her and burst out laughing, "Whatever you might think of our president, he went to Harvard, for goodness sake! Of course he knows how to read! You were joking, right?" With sincerity and candor she answered, "Well, he's a <insert>! S.... don't know how to read!"

I really thought she was joking. She wasn't. While this is an extreme case of absurd racism, sadly, most of my family members believe that they are superior to those with a darker skin color, and say comments which make me have implosions every time I hear them casually make racist comments.

OP - yes, if you are uncomfortable with a neighbor moving in, based solely on their skin color or ethnicity - yes, you are racist.

amother

Babypink

Sat, Nov 19 2016, 10:04 pm

For what it's worth, many insular groups are racist. A Catholic woman I know told me she hates going back home to the southern state she is from because of her family's blatant racism. It's a painful reality in this country and we need to work on this, one person and one family at a time.

An AA woman I know told me that she sees even some relief now amidst all the post-election horror. The explosion of outright racism proved that it wasn't just all in their imagination. Just scroll up and see that the responder to my previous post wanted to know if I can give a example of institutional racism. I don't see it or feel it because I don't face it. But my friend does.

And it makes me so sad that our public discourse is sliding back several decades.

sourstix

Sat, Nov 19 2016, 11:09 pm

If the blacks or Mexicans were upper middle class I'd have no problem with it. It's the ones who are low class that make tons of noise and are disrespectful to everyone and have no menchlichkeit and you can't trust your kids near that I have a problem with.

I had those in my neighborhood they ruined it for everyone. Now the neighbors made sure this doesn't happen again. It's peaceful again. Ahhhhh. It all depend s what type of people. Doesn't have anything to do with skin color. Though I don't think blacks would move into my neighborhood. They stick with their own kind

amother

Orange

Sat, Nov 19 2016, 11:19 pm

I don't consider myself racist, but I freely admit that I am classist. If you're a nice family who keeps your house neat and clean, acts respectfully of others, and are kind and neighborly, then I don't care if you're red, white, black, or purple.

If you are low-class and ruin my neighborhood, then please leave. (And I apply this to both Jews and non-Jews; I've had some appalingly low-class Jewish neighbors.)

I think it's stupid that a nice middle-class black or say, Indian family can bring down property values, just for being a different enthnicity.

But a home that's a mess, with overgrown grass, and loud music, and people in and out at all hours? No on wants that person for their neighbor.

Again, I'm classist. If you act low-brow, I'll treat you as such. Take of that what you will.