Please tell me there is an end in sight

Chayalle

Mon, Nov 21 2016, 4:15 pm

debsey wrote:

I've tried that. Since DS is my pickiest eater, as well as going through the most difficult adjustment to adolescence, I've tried cooking his favorite foods, at the expense of cooking everyone else's favorite foods. I find he doesn't appreciate it and still asks for money. He is in a class where a lot of the kids routinely eat out and he wants to join them. (He's Mr. Popularity, so I'm not worried about his social standing.)

I don't believe in eating out nightly - it's terrible nutrition, even nicer burger joints are not a place I want my yeshiva bochur spending a great deal of time, and it's terrible training for life. He knows that every so often he will get some money and he can take out the meal of his choice, but he also knows that it won't happen in a week where he came home and made a massive fuss about how "normal" mothers don't make "gross" food like meatballs and spaghetti or chicken.

My "no" is a yes to everything else - you know why you're such a great athlete? Because your mother has always paid attention to nutrition and instilling healthy habits like bedtime. You know why you have a reputation as one of the better boys in your class? Because you're not hanging around pizza parlors every night, which means you have time to learn with your chavrusah. You know why you're going to be a great husband one day? Because you'll appreciate your wife and you won't expect her to cater you a five star meal every night.

I don't have any boys (yet) but I do have teenage nephews...I've heard that's it's a big issue in the tri-state area - the boys like to eat out on a regular basis, and for some it's a "normal" part of life. I totally agree with you that it's terrible nutrition, and is terrible training for life. You are doing a great service to your future DIL I"YH. Stick to being a parent.

Chayalle

Mon, Nov 21 2016, 4:18 pm

dancingqueen wrote:

Debsey can your son make himself a sandwich if he doesn't like dinner?

Chayallah, what do the other 15 year olds in your neighborhood do on sat night? Can she babysit?

I live in a neighborhood full of young couples and low on teens...my DD can get 3-5 calls for babysitting in a single night. It's definitely not her idea of entertainment when she's bored on Motzei Shabbos.

Part of the issue is that DD does not have alot of social choices in our neighborhood, and we are trying to sell and move...in the meantime, I find myself elected president of the entertainment committee.....

tichellady

Mon, Nov 21 2016, 4:22 pm

Chayalle wrote:

can your older daughter give her a ride to a friend's place and you pick her up?

debsey

Mon, Nov 21 2016, 5:37 pm

FranticFrummie wrote:

If he wants to eat out, you need to ask him what chores he's willing to take on to make that kind of money. Ask him to mop, scrub toilets, or any other job you really hate! Then you'll see how dedicated he really is about his pizza.

he's always perfectly free to use his own money to fund this habit. Problem is, he's learning just how fast things add up! He's much less willing to work to earn more money (that's when I hear about all the "normal mothers" who don't make their kids "work like slaves" and just give them money because "mothers are supposed to feed their kids")

He's really a good kid - he's just in a difficult situation because his friends do eat out all the time and are always inviting him along. Their parents do fund this extravagance. I can't police what other people do, but I honestly don't get it. There's one boy in my son's class who literally eats out every night. He comes home just to get Mommy's credit card and goes right on out again.

I have no problem with the occasional schwarma or pulled brisket sandwich that he pays for with his own money (although I don't let him eat out in stores, I'm just not comfortable with that). Once in a blue moon, I will treat him to a bought supper, if I'm really proud of something he did, since I know he really appreciates that.

I'm trying to help him learn that talking in an obnoxious manner is unlikely to convince me, and if he's trying to communicate his frustration, he can do so in a prosocial manner. If he's trying to persuade me, telling me how "not normal" I am is not gonna do it.

debsey

Mon, Nov 21 2016, 5:39 pm

Chayalle wrote:

My daughter is two years older than yours - but when she was 15, she took an exercise class on Motzai Shabbos. It was great because once the class was over she usually ended up in one of her friends' houses. We organized a carpool, which worked for me (not sure that you have that option if her friends don't live nearby)

debsey

Mon, Nov 21 2016, 5:42 pm

Chayalle wrote:

Thanks, Chayalle - It's a really big issue. There's just this peer pressure to eat out all the time. Every night my son gets a call from a different group of kids (between his camp friends and his school friends and his neighborhood friends and his sports friends) asking him to come eat out. We live within biking distance of a lot of fast food joints, so it's not like he even has to ask for a ride. He really feels that I am the only mother who doesn't fund this habit as a matter of course. He knows, of course, that I'm not the only one, but the social pressure is enormous. He happens to be in a wealthier class, so I guess these parents have money to burn? I don't get it. Eating out should be a treat, not a nightly event.

I appreciate the validation of what I'm doing from someone as level-headed as you.

Chayalle

Mon, Nov 21 2016, 5:56 pm

debsey wrote:

That would be great. If I knew of a private venue for her - sports would be awesome, she loves sports, or a dance class - I'd go for it. Problem is I really don't want her to go to some of the non-Jewish places on Motzei Shabbos, as the crowd there is not where I want her to be. On a Sunday afternoon, for example, some local ice skating rinks are practically empty, but on Motzei Shabbos they are not an option.

Maybe she could make plans with a friend in time for older DD to do the transporting....

Chayalle

Mon, Nov 21 2016, 6:02 pm

debsey wrote:

I have no problem with the occasional schwarma or pulled brisket sandwich that he pays for with his own money (although I don't let him eat out in stores, I'm just not comfortable with that). Once in a blue moon, I will treat him to a bought supper, if I'm really proud of something he did, since I know he really appreciates that.

Do boys have opportunities to earn money on their own to fund these occasional splurges? My girls have plenty of babysitting opportunities, so for those occasions where a bunch of them are getting together and going out (more like to Sprinkles) - camp friends, or her elementary school friends - it's not an issue (if it was, it wouldn't be such a big deal for me to fund it on that once in a while anyway, but she doesn't even ask, she has her own money).

Truth is, I'm glad that even though they could "afford" it, it's not a "thing" with the girls to do this often. I don't think it would be healthy for them to do that all the time, even with their own money. I don't want them to have that in their lifestyle and maintenance requirements. Eating out should be a treat, and something they may do in the future to celebrate, say, an anniversary or a job promotion....I don't want them to "need" that on a usual basis. Takeout for us is a treat, like on mid-winter vacation, or something like that...not everyday.

We do take the girls out once in a while, like on vacation, just DD with DH and myself for lunch, or something like that...but not usual.

I'm totally with you on this....thanks for the compliment, BTW Smile

debsey

Mon, Nov 21 2016, 6:05 pm

Chayalle wrote:

We organized it ourselves. One of the mothers knew a kickboxing instructor and someone else had the space and it came together. It was great while it lasted (pretty much her whole tenth grade year) I wonder if Fusion Fitness has a M"Sh teen class?

I agree with you about the non-Jewish places on M"Sh. Not really the idea venue for a BY girl.

FranticFrummie

Mon, Nov 21 2016, 6:05 pm

You're doing a great job!

I remember when DD was 5, and she was mad at me for something (no idea what, I can't recall now). She stared at me and yelled "Mama, you are RUINING MY LIFE!"

shock

I'm thinking "Um, you're 5. I didn't realize you had a life!" LOL

My next though was "Wow, it starts earlier than I thought. The kvetch is strong with this one."

You are normal, and he is normal. Stay strong, and when he looks back at this, some day he'll thank you for it.

debsey

Mon, Nov 21 2016, 6:11 pm

FranticFrummie wrote:

You're doing a great job!

I remember when DD was 5, and she was mad at me for something (no idea what, I can't recall now). She stared at me and yelled "Mama, you are RUINING MY LIFE!"

shock

I'm thinking "Um, you're 5. I didn't realize you had a life!" LOL

The Kvetch is strong with this one......LIKE LIKE LIKE! (that should be a t-shirt or a mug) Rolling Laughter

When my first grader was four, she heard that her big brother was going to Florida to a relative's bar mitzvah and she said "I never went to Florida in my WHOLE ENTIRE LIFE and you're letting him go!" Ummm... your whole entire life was all of four years long. Give yourself a chance......

Thanks for the validation. It would be easier if there was no basis in reality to his "everyone else is doing it" argument. Everyone else really IS doing it. We're just not everyone else.

FranticFrummie

Mon, Nov 21 2016, 6:21 pm

I hear you. All of DD's friends have brand new iPhones, and she has a second hand Samsung with a cracked screen. Oh, the horror! Fortunately, she rarely harps on it. She knows that Chanukah is coming, and that she'll get an upgrade. She also knows it won't be the newest generation of iPhone.

Keeping up with the Shwartzes is not something we do in our house.

debsey

Mon, Nov 21 2016, 6:44 pm

FranticFrummie wrote:

As Shmuel Kunda so eloquently put it ..... "HOW the yidden suffered!"

Amalia

Mon, Nov 21 2016, 10:35 pm

This is such a great thread! Thank you everyone for your real-life examples and input! It's helping me so much to see it in perspective, after my son (11) casually put it to me a few days ago, "mommy, you are getting the 'worst mother in the world' award." I laughed, but it really did make me feel bad.
And the "everyone" argument: it is driving me up the walls! And not even "plain everyone" but "very frum everyone", whatever that is...
Oh, and I have to add this one: "why don't you EVER do anything nice for me?" Oy gevald
Thank you again for this thread!