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Forum -> Chinuch, Education & Schooling
Lakewood - why is Bais yaakov high school the first choice?
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amother
Cerise


 

Post Tue, Nov 29 2016, 10:35 am
It's so hard to get honest answers. I feel that parents in this town can't admit that they aren't happy in a school and also if they are in a school with a top name then they are afraid to say they aren't happy.

So can anyone tell me why Bais yaakov is everyone's first choice and all I hear is how it is impossible to get in there?

I want the truth. I'm sure other schools are also good but why is this school everyone's first choice?
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Chayalle




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Nov 29 2016, 10:41 am
I'll be straightforward here - gonna totally out myself (I'm not all that secretive anyway). The principal, whom I still call Morah - AKA Mrs. Shechter - is totally awesome. She's an amazing Mechaneches. Hands down. Best high school teacher, ever. I feel a pang that I don't have my girls in her school, though I knew BY wasn't the right school for my oldest, and with my 2nd, didn't want to go thru the process of switching, which is crazy in Lakewood.....

I really feel she is the sum total behind BY's success. It's real and well-deserved. She really gets teenage girls and runs a really well balanced school.

ETA: Beyond that, people who are honest with themselves and in touch with their children realize that it's not necessarily the best choice for their individual child. It's an excellent school. If it's not for me, that doesn't take away from the fact that it really is an excellent school. No school is right for everyone and there are other schools in town that are really doing a great job, and could be a better fit for an individual or a family.
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amother
Ginger


 

Post Tue, Nov 29 2016, 10:55 am
The principal is really great, and they have good academics, but for many girls the pressure there is enormous. There is a certain cultivated image that many girls feel forced to conform to. I think that image has a lot to do with its name.
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Chayalle




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Nov 29 2016, 10:57 am
amother wrote:
The principal is really great, and they have good academics, but for many girls the pressure there is enormous. There is a certain cultivated image that many girls feel forced to conform to. I think that image has a lot to do with its name.


Well said. I think the pressure and conformity is a reason why it's not for everyone, and why some people choose to send to other schools that are a better fit.
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debsey




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Nov 29 2016, 11:12 am
For the same reason BJJ is the "top" seminary - the crowd it attracts. The peer group is an important influence on teenage girls.

I happen to think that Bais Yaakov is not the best HS in Lakewood for many individual children. Shiras Devorah and Bais Shaindel also attract a very "chashuv" crowd, if that's what you're looking for. Oros puts much more into the girls than Bais Yaakov does (I feel like BY counts on the peer group to do a lot of the work) Bais Kailah has the most caring, responsive administration in town.

Bottom line is, if your daughter is a perfectly "in the box" kind of kid, she'll do great in BY. Especially if she doesn't mind blending in to the background for four years. If she's not, BY is not going to be a good match. If you're not a "shoo-in" for BY, then it's probably not worth the effort to try to get in.
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Chayalle




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Nov 29 2016, 11:23 am
debsey wrote:
For the same reason BJJ is the "top" seminary - the crowd it attracts. The peer group is an important influence on teenage girls.

I happen to think that Bais Yaakov is not the best HS in Lakewood for many individual children. Shiras Devorah and Bais Shaindel also attract a very "chashuv" crowd, if that's what you're looking for. Oros puts much more into the girls than Bais Yaakov does (I feel like BY counts on the peer group to do a lot of the work) Bais Kailah has the most caring, responsive administration in town.

Bottom line is, if your daughter is a perfectly "in the box" kind of kid, she'll do great in BY. Especially if she doesn't mind blending in to the background for four years. If she's not, BY is not going to be a good match. If you're not a "shoo-in" for BY, then it's probably not worth the effort to try to get in.


I dunno if I agree so much about the peer group. I don't think that the girls that went to BY out of my DD's grade necessarily had more going for them than the ones that went elsewhere. It was some and some - some very nice girls, others not so. Like everywhere else in town.

Maybe the Bais Shaindel kids were the most refined group....
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debsey




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Nov 29 2016, 11:28 am
Chayalle wrote:
I dunno if I agree so much about the peer group. I don't think that the girls that went to BY out of my DD's grade necessarily had more going for them than the ones that went elsewhere. It was some and some - some very nice girls, others not so. Like everywhere else in town.

Maybe the Bais Shaindel kids were the most refined group....


I honestly think that other than the name and the crowd (and the pressure to be a certain way) are all that BY has going for it. Mrs. Shechter is a wonderful educator, but she has a lot on her plate and she's spread really thin.

Wonderful, amazing principals? Every high school has one. Mrs. Rothschild (Oros) and Mrs. David (Shiras Devorah) are also exceptionally devoted knowledgeable mechanchos. So you can't say that this is BY's advantage that other schools don't replicate.

Great teachers? I can't say BY's teachers are any more amazing than the teachers in any other HS in town.

There is a pressure to conform there and be exactly like the peer group, which can be either a good thing or a bad thing, depending on the kid. I really don't see what the advantage is. Other than that name.
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Chayalle




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Nov 29 2016, 11:32 am
But where did the name start?

I have a good friend who was in 8th grade in Bais Faiga when BY opened. She went to BK, like everyone else in Lakewood up until that time (I think Bais Sheindel actually existed too, but it was pretty small). She told me there was all this hype and pressure to go to the "new" school. They recruited an amazing principal (we cried when she left) and "everyone" was going. Her parents didn't buy into the hype.

The truth is, I've spoken to people who say that it's not the same, having a great teacher, having a great principal. I can concede to your point that she might be spread thin.

But there's still the hype. Where does it come from? I really don't see that the quality of the peer group is all that different than elsewhere.

For myself, the only draw BY had for me in the application process, over other schools in town, was the principal.
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debsey




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Nov 29 2016, 11:56 am
Chayalle- when it was small and Mrs. Shechter was younger, I think that reputation was justified. But now, it's just one of those "facts." You have to look at the school as it is, not as it was.
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Queen6




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Nov 29 2016, 11:57 am
I'm confused at your question.. Do you not know the nature of man?
Bais Yaakov was opened for the BEST, there is an elitist attitude there. People don't care why or how they just want to be a part of it.
That's the explanation.
Same reason why we all cover up most of our lives to look the best, be in the perfect neighborhood, have perfect clothes.... the list keeps going.
Just remember; what's considered the best is not always the best for your child - do what's best for YOU and you will be the best you can be.
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Chayalle




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Nov 29 2016, 11:58 am
debsey wrote:
Chayalle- when it was small and Mrs. Shechter was younger, I think that reputation was justified. But now, it's just one of those "facts." You have to look at the school as it is, not as it was.


Yes, I'm pretty much doing that, and for right now, then, I don't so much see the draw. But probably because I'm (read: my DD's are) comfortable and successful elsewhere - and grateful for that.
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debsey




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Nov 29 2016, 12:01 pm
Chayalle wrote:
Yes, I'm pretty much doing that, and for right now, then, I don't so much see the draw. But probably because I'm (read: my DD's are) comfortable and successful elsewhere - and grateful for that.


Me too. And I say this as someone whose DD got in to BY and chose to go elsewhere (despite many concerned relatives telling me to force her to go) In other words, it's not sour grapes for me. But honestly, I just wasn't that impressed with BY and didn't think it would be a great fit for DD.
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amother
Ginger


 

Post Tue, Nov 29 2016, 12:03 pm
Chayalle wrote:
I dunno if I agree so much about the peer group. I don't think that the girls that went to BY out of my DD's grade necessarily had more going for them than the ones that went elsewhere. It was some and some - some very nice girls, others not so. Like everywhere else in town.

Maybe the Bais Shaindel kids were the most refined group....


I agree - I graduated from high school not too many years ago, and every school had a pretty similar range of girls. There were some minute variants, but most schools end up with an almost interchangeable mixture of girls. I don't think BY has a unique student body in that aspect.

In fact, my sil teaches in a few high schools in Lakewood, and she keeps saying that the all the classes she teaches in all different schools are so similar. Of course, every school has its own flavor, but it has way more to do with staff, curriculum, policy, etc. than the actual student body.

There are a few exceptions, like Bais Shaindel and I guess Meohn now who are much more yeshivish and cater to different girls to start with. Shiras Devorah has a more distinguishable student body as well because they're looking to attract a balebatish crowd. But Oros, BY, BBY, BK, etc., really all end up with a similar range of girls.
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amother
Cerise


 

Post Tue, Nov 29 2016, 12:43 pm
What is the level of Frumkeit in Bais yaakov? Is it Frummernthan oros the same? I thought oros was the high pressured school and Bais yaakov was chilled? I am so confused about my
Options.
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debsey




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Nov 29 2016, 1:16 pm
amother wrote:
What is the level of Frumkeit in Bais yaakov? Is it Frummernthan oros the same? I thought oros was the high pressured school and Bais yaakov was chilled? I am so confused about my
Options.


Are you possibly confusing Bnos Bais Yaakov with Bais Yaakov? No one would ever describe Bais Yaakov as "chilled". There's academic and social pressure. Oros has a very high standard for academic work, but caters to a different demographic.
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Chayalle




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Nov 29 2016, 1:20 pm
amother wrote:
What is the level of Frumkeit in Bais yaakov? Is it Frummernthan oros the same? I thought oros was the high pressured school and Bais yaakov was chilled? I am so confused about my
Options.


I heard that Oros is a notch more academic than Bais Yaakov, but like Debsey said, neither is chilled.

I've heard that academics are no joke in BBY either, though I think socially it has a more chilled reputation.
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amother
Firebrick


 

Post Tue, Nov 29 2016, 1:31 pm
I find this thread so interesting. I got into BK and BY and chose BK. For some, Bais Yaakov is best and for others, other schools are best. I know people who hated BY (not saying it's a bad school, just agreeing with others that it's not for everyone). I guess it depends who your crowd is. No one I know would call BY the "best".
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Chayalle




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Nov 29 2016, 1:46 pm
amother wrote:
I find this thread so interesting. I got into BK and BY and chose BK. For some, Bais Yaakov is best and for others, other schools are best. I know people who hated BY (not saying it's a bad school, just agreeing with others that it's not for everyone). I guess it depends who your crowd is. No one I know would call BY the "best".


When DD was in 8th grade, she chose BK as her first choice. DH and I did ALOT of research, and spoke to several people in both chinuch and professional capacities, and backed her choice (we didn't just randomly leave that choice to a 13 year old).

Well.

She got quite alot of backlash. Her teacher tried very hard to steer us elsewhere (I subsequently heard that this particular teacher tries to steer oldests to a particular school. I wonder if they pay her....).

Some lovely classmates expressed their shock and surprise that a "girl like her" is going to BK and it's "so not your type". They then snubbed her for no longer being part of their crowd (which made me glad she wasn't going to high school with them). I think the prize-winning comment came from a girl who told DD that her shoes (a nondescript pair of brown ballet flats) were "very BK'ish" and NOT "BY-ish". (We laugh about that one for comic relief.)

The most hurtful were the people at shul who made comments to DH.

There's definitely an image thing going on with regard to schools, and a whole lot of people who make choices based on "type" rather than what might be good for the individual.

However I've met alot of people like ourselves, B"H, and that gave me alot of encouragement. Including someone in our shul who ultimately made the same choice for their DD. I'm not talking here about any specific school, but when I meet people who look past the "name" and take the time to choose a place where their child will thrive, it warms my heart.
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balibusta




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Nov 29 2016, 1:49 pm
Alot of the high-schools have the same teachers that teach in all..b.y and shiras devorah have similar kids..
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amother
Ginger


 

Post Tue, Nov 29 2016, 1:54 pm
Chayalle, it's so interesting... I went to camp and seminary with tons of other Lakewood girls, and so many of the happiest, most balanced girls had gone to Bais Kaila... And they were truly amazing, solid girls.

And I think that precisely because BK is not one of the "elite" schools in Lakewood, they escape a lot of the ridiculous image shallowness that unfortunately many people in Lk are obsessed with...
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