Cheder made DS write a letter to pardon a criminal

amother

Crimson

Tue, Dec 06 2016, 9:24 am

I would also be upset if my child's school did this but still I want to ask

Question for the OP: did you let the person in the school who told your son's class to write the letters know how you feel before posting on Imamother?

Question for the posters who feel this is wrong: Three years ago had the school told them to write on behalf of Jonathan Pollard would you have felt the same way?

amother

Seafoam

Tue, Dec 06 2016, 9:25 am

Maya wrote:

This guy involved several naive young men in his schemes, most of whom likely had no idea they were doing something illegal, and some of whom served prison time themselves. Does that fall under the category of rodef? If it doesn't, then it should. I see no reason why anyone should advocate on behalf of this man.

A very close family member was one of those young men. He served time in prison and saw his life almost completely destroyed. He has since pulled himself together and has made a remarkable life for himself and his family. Some years ago, Samet sent him a long letter begging for his forgiveness. He has completely forgiven him and is advocating for his release. My relative believes that 15 years is more than enough and he sees Samet as a new, humbled man. If the cheder in question made it clear that Samet is a criminal who has paid the price for his crimes, I see no problem with a letter writing campaign.

SixOfWands

Tue, Dec 06 2016, 10:00 am

amother wrote:

so you want the guy to rot in prison....?

Nice

Watch some documentaries on what prisons look like on the inside

According to OP, they requested a PARDON. That means complete forgiveness for any crimes. Wipe it off the record. Never happened.

Commutation of clemency would mean reducing the sentence.

Eg, I support clemency for Rubashkin. I don't support a pardon.

Maybe OP misspoke, though.

I think that the idea of teaching kids to write letters to the government to advocate for a position is a good one. We had to write letters to members of our city's council when I was the same age as OP's son. Ideally, there would have been a choice of topics -- clemency for Samet. Or Rubashkin. Or Madoff. Or supporting vouchers. Or something. Or if the idea was to raise awareness of Jews in prison, and their plight, they could have been encouraged to raise money for the Aleph Institute.

saw50st8

Tue, Dec 06 2016, 11:20 am

smile12345 wrote:

You're welcome to join him there if you would like.

- I have no idea who Samet is, but I just don't get all these responses.

Otisville is a minimum security prison. I've had family stay there (unfortunately) and it's not a bad place. Of course, being incarcerated is never a good thing and loss of freedom is always restrictive, but it's not "rotting in prison" there, especially when there are minyanim, shiurim, kosher food, furloughs etc. It's not like living in Alcatraz.

I don't personally know enough the Samet saga to comment to intelligently. It was the "rotting in prison" which really should be "detained in Otisville" (which incidentally, many prisoners call "the Hotel").

cnc

Tue, Dec 06 2016, 11:28 am

saw50st8 wrote:

Not commenting anything about the case. This is my first time hearing about it but yes to what you write about Otisville. My father used to volunteer to go visit prisoners there . The place puts some high end summer camps to shame. I literally couldn't believe that this is a prison. (Forget about the minyanim and kosher food... I'm talking about the actual grounds.)

yksraya

Tue, Dec 06 2016, 11:36 am

SixOfWands wrote:

It was actually clemency and not a pardon for samet.

amother

Cerise

Tue, Dec 06 2016, 12:29 pm

amother wrote:

No, there's nobody to talk to at the cheder. The principal supports his teachers no matter what. My son was slapped by this rebbe a few weeks ago and we are staying out of his way.

Yes, I would have felt the same way about Pollard. It's a personal thing, I guess. I just don't want my son taking either side and signing his name to something contrary to our family values.

amother

Seafoam

Tue, Dec 06 2016, 12:42 pm

I'm the amother who's relative was involved in the Samet saga. My relative spent time in Westchester (awful!) and then Otisville (hard to believe it's a prison!). I don't know where Samet is currently incarcerated but he was definitely in a maximum security facility for many years.

amother

Crimson

Tue, Dec 06 2016, 1:03 pm

amother wrote:

No, there's nobody to talk to at the cheder. The principal supports his teachers no matter what. My son was slapped by this rebbe a few weeks ago and we are staying out of his way.

If that is the way you feel you should consider changing schools.

Miri7

Tue, Dec 06 2016, 1:12 pm

Wait, were the letters written just as an exercise, or were they mailed in to supplement the pardon request?

If it was just a writing exercise, then I wouldn't have too much of a problem with it. My children have prepared debate arguments for positions that they do and don't agree with, but they learned from all of them. They have also practiced writing different types of letters as part of learning to write in different formats, to different audiences, and for different purposes.

However, I would be LIVID if my child felt he "had" to write a letter of support in seeking a pardon for a convicted criminal (even if I thought the person was wrongly convicted or should be pardoned) and it was actually submitted without my consent! What? The school administration or teacher is taking advantage of a captive audience to further their own political or personal agenda. That is SIMPLY NOT OK.

Boy, would there be trouble if this was my kid! I would (a) go to the administration and ask that the letter be withdrawn, and (b), if the letter had already been submitted, may decide whether I want to submit my own letter retracting the letter written by my child and explaining the circumstances under which it was written and submitted. Unfortunately, this would likely hurt the person seeking the pardon, so I would sit on that decision for a few days and not send it in a fit of pique.

SixOfWands

Tue, Dec 06 2016, 1:26 pm

amother wrote:

Samet was immediately placed in Otisville, according to this article, http://www.vosizneias.com/1427.....over/

Here's a story about him and Sholom Weiss meeting the Satmar Rebbe in Otisville.

http://5tjt.com/jews-in-prison/

But another story says he's now at Fort Dix

http://www.theyeshivaworld.com......html

So, if you're right, then Otisville is the "bad" original prison, and Fort Dix is the improvement.

smile12345

Tue, Dec 06 2016, 1:26 pm

amother wrote:

No, there's nobody to talk to at the cheder. The principal supports his teachers no matter what. My son was slapped by this rebbe a few weeks ago and we are staying out of his way.

Sounds like there are more important things to be bothered about with this Rebbe than letter-writing.

If you stay out of his way then it's even easier for him to hurt your son.

amother

Crimson

Tue, Dec 06 2016, 1:55 pm

amother wrote:

Reading this thread makes such a warm feeling in my soul of 'who is like Your nation O Israel'

Sorry for the sarcasm LOL

I'm confident you feel that way even without reading these type of threads. You just like the confirmation bias.

marina

Tue, Dec 06 2016, 2:01 pm

amother wrote:

I feel like the letter writing is the least of your problems OP. Stop paying for your children to be abused.