Shabbos candles almost burned house down

Shuly

Sun, Jan 15 2017, 5:13 pm

MiracleMama wrote:

Very good to know. Thank you. Maybe I'll give them a try. Certainly more attractive then the disposable foil.
Are they easy to clean out? Just hold under hot water?

I put a drop of olive oil in each cup, under the candle, which makes the metal wick holder very easy to remove.
I don't clean them every week, since they don't really get dirty, just greasy inside. When I do clean them, I soak them in hot water mixed with some laundry detergent and then I scrub them.

greenfire

Mon, Jan 16 2017, 12:38 pm

my sister got 3rd degree burns on her hand because of those cheap foil liners & a fire that dripped onto the tablecloth that made her panic ... she now only uses tea lights

certainly do not use them a second time & also clean out the metal ones in between uses & have extras for yom tov ... otherwise go the tea light route

it is imperative to have a FIRE EXTINGUISHER that is good for all types of fire and/or BAKING SODA & to know your fire ... because water can spread oil causing a bigger fire ... water can cause electric shock from fires in the wall ...

http://www.femalifesafety.org/......html

Teomima

Mon, Jan 16 2017, 1:45 pm

The foil scares me, foil can burn!
That's so odd about exploding glass holders, though. I use them, as does my mother, and we've never had that happen.
I agree with the poster though who said it'd be nice if there were more pretty candlesticks made to hold tea lights. They definitely feel the safest.

all is good

Tue, Jan 17 2017, 8:55 am

I was once a guest at someones house for shabbos and almost burned down THEIR house - with tea lights! I lit in a beautiful tealight holder thing, one of those things that has two inserts for tea lights, and I dropped the match I used into one of the tea lights. Later, when the fire was very low, it caught onto the matchstick and the fire got out of control. Turns out the holder was just WOOD covered in some thin plastic. The fire was eating up the entire holder, was really scary. As scary as it was, the men in the house said the HALACHA IS YOU CANNOT DIRECTLY POUR WATER ON THE FIRE ON SHABBOS. I know that sounds absurd, but that is the Halacha, sorry op. (And I probably wldve done the same if I was in your place.)
Anyhow, the host ran to get a gentile neighbor and my husband very bravely ( I thought he was crazy shock

) carried the burning candle holder to the sink so at least it cld be contained. The neighbor came and poured baking soda to put it out...whole place was covered in smoke, black sut was left on every surface of their kitchen, I felt terrible. But BH it ended ok.

csfm

Mon, Jan 30 2017, 11:15 pm

I'd love to use the beautiful, traditional Shabbos candles I grew up with, but I'm fearful of what could go wrong with regular candles; e.g., if the wick is too long, the flame could become overly large and candles can tip over. I used to use a set of glass holders (that had been painted on the exterior by an Israeli artist). They looked beautiful...until one of them spontaneously burst! I switched to Neronim and I'm very sure to place the candles straight. I also use tealights in crystal holders, being sure to set them in place quite straight. I place all 8 of my candlesticks on a large marble slab (not expensive--it's supposed to be a cutting board); it looks beautiful while being fireproof. We never go to bed until the candles are out.

studying_torah

Mon, Jan 30 2017, 11:27 pm

I've had the glass cups for oil burst a few times from the fire. It's very scary.
As a kid, I once woke up from the smoke alarm, the wooden table where the candles were had gone up in flames, the wall was already black. It was super scary.

33055

Mon, Jan 30 2017, 11:43 pm

all is good wrote:

Yes, that is halacha. I didn't want to bring that up. You can't pour water on a fire on Shabbos.

I was a guest in a house when the candles got knocked over, and they poured water on the table in a circle around the candles. BH only the table was damaged.

TeachersNotebook

Tue, Jan 31 2017, 12:52 am

I'm sorry to go off topic, but I don't understand the application of the issur of putting out fires here. I understand if you can carry something like a plastic bag to the sink. But if it's an entire candle holder or an entire table that's on fire, it seems to me you are entering the realm of pikuach nefesh. And no, there isn't time to run and ask the rav if this is pikuach nefesh. We are not trained firefighters who know how to professionally control a fire. If there is something large on fire, then it has to be put out. No questions asked.

I truly don't think halacha calls for us to take our lives into our hands here.

Teomima

Tue, Jan 31 2017, 2:27 am

I agree with TeachersNotebook, but for those who still hold you can't pour water over a fire, can you smother it? Like in the example given of a tea light in the sink, can you put a pyrex bowl over the whole thing to deprive the fire of oxygen?

Iymnok

Tue, Jan 31 2017, 2:41 am

To extinguish a flame is a melacha deoraisa. It can only be done if there is direct pikuach nefesh.
Physical possessions, like your house, do not have the din of pikuach nefesh.
It is very worthwhile to take the necessary precautions to protect your shabbos candles. Also to learn how to contain the fire until a [non jew] can be brought.

A trick I heard was to surround the fire with ice cubes. I'm sure there are other great tips out there.

amother

Babypink

Tue, Jan 31 2017, 12:48 pm

TeachersNotebook wrote:

If everyone can run out of the house, then its not pikuach nefesh.

I'm glad someone finally mentioned that its ossur.

amother

Ecru

Tue, Jan 31 2017, 1:42 pm

amother wrote:

If everyone can run out of the house, then its not pikuach nefesh.

I'm glad someone finally mentioned that its ossur.

I was taught by a reputable Agudah-type posek that it is considered pikuach nefesh because we live in houses that are close together, and the fire may easily spread from one house to the next, and perhaps someone in the next house will not get out in time.
He was asked, what about a place like monsey where the houses are farther apart?
He replied, it's a complicated shayla but lemaaseh we pasken that it is still pikuach nefesh and you may put out the fire.

I'm not saying you should abide by my posek- but please take the time to ask your own, don't just rely on the quoted above.