How are we supposed to live??

amother

Silver

Sun, Feb 19 2017, 12:08 am

This entire post makes me want to scream!
If your husband cares anything for his family, he will go out an learn a trade. You live in Brooklyn? Read ads on the subways. There are always ads for vocational schools, for joining the police force, etc. You can do the same. You are BOTH responsible for your family's survival and I truly hope you will teach your children to be prepared for their futures, since your parents clearly did not.
I know I'm being very harsh, but you're both young and you have some tough decisions to make. Sitting on your tucheses and complaining about the situation you're in isn't going to make it go away. You need to act now.

amother

Seagreen

Sun, Feb 19 2017, 12:09 am

And I'm chasidish too and dh is dyslexic but severely bright and motivated and very talented he runs his own business and we moved from Brooklyn because of financial reasons. We couldn't make ends meet. No I don't have family here and no friends. But I had to give myself a decent life. I couldn't afford anything in Brooklyn

My dh was making 20$ an hour and it wasn't enough. Ok it was part time job

amother

Honeydew

Sun, Feb 19 2017, 12:17 am

Maya wrote:

This is not the OP's fault.
No, one's future livelihood is not generally a topic of discussion before marriage in average Chassidish circles. The OP's husband is none different than thousands of his peers. This is normal in her world. Don't blame her for something that's cultural and was beyond her control.

I understand not asking what exactly he's going to do, but not asking if he's geshicht, if he's bright, ambitious, etc? That's what seems odd here.

MagentaYenta

Sun, Feb 19 2017, 12:23 am

amother wrote:

And the men have no English education beyond 6th grade. And if you send to another school that offers an English education then you are shamed.

Well without an English education he's likely not to make it into a legitimate union apprentice program. He will need to be able to read and write English to begin with.

Arh this just upsets me. Basic English literacy is important, heck how do you read the warnings on a prescription?

gp2.0

Sun, Feb 19 2017, 12:31 am

Not sure why everyone here is pushing for him to learn a trade. It's time consuming and expensive and if he's not passionate about something specific, what's the point? Not everyone has the entrepreneurial spirit to start their own business. Working for someone else gives you job security and you "learn" whatever trade you're working in and become experienced at doing that. The idea is to become better and better at your job, until you can ask for a raise or move on to someone else who will appreciate your experience and pay you accordingly.

Warehouse manager jobs tend to have very long hours but it's physical work, usually requires little to no experience and pay is usually $20/hr and up.

Driving a delivery truck also pays well, especially for early morning jobs, and the only requirement is a CDL license.

ora_43

Sun, Feb 19 2017, 12:45 am

amother wrote:

Im not sure about moving.... Question is if you are making $15 an hour at 19 shouldn't you be getting a bit more at 28? I do work the max hours possible for me while caring for my children as well. Why do bosses offer so little to a honest hardworker with a family?

With apologies in advance if I'm too blunt.

- your husband is coming across as a little lazy because it sounds like he's not making an effort to plan a career path for himself. The willingness to show up to work and do the job is great! But it takes more than that to be on a career path where you increase your earning potential.

Maybe I'm reading your posts wrong; maybe your husband just has no idea how important it is to actually sit and plan these things. Dunno.

Is your husband asking this question? Is he open to making big changes?

- what does "max hours while caring for my children as well" mean? Are you saying that having your children go to an afterschool program or after-school babysitter is out? Because that's a big part of how many families make it work.

What's your earning potential? And can you increase it? Another possible solution might be for you to have a higher-earning career, and your dh to take more responsibility at home.

What about ways of earning money while your children are home, eg by babysitting? Are any of these things options?

ora_43

Sun, Feb 19 2017, 12:51 am

gp2.0 wrote:

Not sure why everyone here is pushing for him to learn a trade. It's time consuming and expensive and if he's not passionate about something specific, what's the point?

Because having a trade means you can earn more than $12-$15 an hour.

The point would be to feed his kids. You don't need to be passionate about work, just competent.

I'm not saying learning a trade is the only option, but IMO it's the obvious answer to "wants to work with hands, needs to earn more than minimum wage."

amother

Wheat

Sun, Feb 19 2017, 1:20 am

amother wrote:

If you cant make ends meet in Brooklyn, one of the most expensive cities in the country, its time to move. Many chassidish people have moved to Baltimore, like we did. I highly recommend you look into it. A few hours drive away so you will be able to go for shabbes and yontif. Seriously affordable. Brooklyn is not an option for some people. Its time to move. Just because thats where family is and its comfy there isnt reason to stay if youre struggling.

I'm chassidish and looking to move out of Brooklyn. What schools in Baltimore do chassidish families send their children to?

gp2.0

Sun, Feb 19 2017, 1:26 am

ora_43 wrote:

Right he needs to learn a trade, but many trades are learned by experience instead of in school.

amother

Honeydew

Sun, Feb 19 2017, 5:12 am

I think most of us are compassionate and want to help. The op has made clear that her husband has no education and doesn't want more, and she thinks he's not bright enough to train for a better job. So how would it help her to pretend that they are going to be financially OK under these circumstances? What needs to happen is that she needs to start thinking about how to bring in more and spend less. And unfortunately, it's always going to be a struggle, barring some kind of miracle.

amother

Babyblue

Sun, Feb 19 2017, 7:57 am

amother wrote:

I'm chassidish and looking to move out of Brooklyn. What schools in Baltimore do chassidish families send their children to?

There is a new chassidish cheder here that most send to. There are also chassidish people who were here before the new kollel came who had been sending to TI. (There is a chassidish kollel here now). My son happens to go to TA which is not at all chassidish but the boys are very welcoming and he needs supports that are not available at TI or the cheder.

amother

Olive

Sun, Feb 19 2017, 8:32 am

I think it's easy to simply say "he needs to learn a trade to feed his family". The fact is that if his intelligence is below average it will be difficult to learn a usefull skill. Not to mention if he's chasidish it's very possible his reading and writing are on a 5th grade level which would disqualify many possibilities anyway. I think in the same way I cant decide I would like to become a professional singer or dancer even if I put in the effort, people with low intellect are severely disadvantaged with job possibilities. I have a brother (non chadsidish) that is a super nice guy but not very bright. He can't make a legitimate living and my parents have to help him out. I don't think there's much he can do about it. Same with op's husband.

amother

Wheat

Sun, Feb 19 2017, 9:59 am

amother wrote:

Thank you

PAMOM

Sun, Feb 19 2017, 10:02 am

If OP's husband wants a higher paying job in someplace like Costco (or a non-frum store), he may be able to take free ESL classes. Check your local public library for information. Alternatively, do you have friends who teach and would be willing to help him? If he can read and write at an 8th grade level, he should be ok. He definitely has to make himself indispensable --volunteer for things at work, have a good attitude, learn how things work and where things go. it sounds like he's simply not willing to try anything though. Construction and other jobs people are suggesting (including me) take a desire to succeed and success requires willingness to learn. There are definitely unskilled jobs that pay more than 12.00/hour after a short time (or from the beginning). Has he tried janitorial services? Cleaning services? I know men who work at hospitals and nursing homes in food services and janitorial services. They earn more than your husband does and get benefits.
If none of the suggestions we're making sound good to you, then you will need to get a job that pays your bills while he takes care of the children and home. That's a perfectly good option.
If he wants a job, he needs to make an effort. Jewish Vocational Services will help with a resume and job suggestions. Look online. If you don't see it, call Jewish Family Services. They will be able to direct you to the right place.

Ilovemaryland

Sun, Feb 19 2017, 10:13 am

amother wrote:

We don't really know how "bright" or "lazy" or "ambitious" OP's husb is. So I will just tell a story if it applys..

About 10 years ago there was a couple in my town , we'll call them Mordy and Malky. They were really struggling. Nicest ppl you'd ever meet. But Malky was very slow and Mordy wasn't exactly a Rhodes Scholar either. Although he was very conscientious and had an excellent work ethic. Together they made about 30k a year. My shul's tzadoka fund helped a lot, but they really didn't want to be charity cases..
Finally the Rov of the shul arranged for them to move to a yishuv in EY.
Bh they were very sucessful there , and are still very happy ..

OP, you might want to reconsider if the Brooklyn lifestyle is for you. If you need to stay for your kehilla, it behooves them to help you.

CatLady

Sun, Feb 19 2017, 10:15 am

What about working in a hospital? There are plenty of jobs such as cleaning, working in the kitchen, patient transport and warehouse that do not require post-secondary training. If the hospital is unionized, he'll have paid vacation days, statutory holidays, health insurance and a pension when he retires. Since he likes this type of job, he may also enjoy the milieu of health care.

amother

Smokey

Sun, Feb 19 2017, 1:57 pm

I'd say he should take a course that teaches the info needed for CDL. If he can read English, he can read the books himself and save some money by not taking the course. Being a full-time bus driver in the city can pay well. At least 1000/wk plus you may get a reduction in tuition. He will also have free time during the day or at night where he can learn a trade via experience. Or he can take on another flexible part-time job.

amother

Plum

Sun, Feb 19 2017, 2:24 pm

I didn't bother reading all the replies b/c I figured it would just depress me.
Here's my deal: My husband works full time (leaving the house before my kids are up and sometimes coming home after they're in bed!) and he comes home with $710 weekly.
I work from home and make about half of that.
We have 7 children, pay tuition (scholarships all, but still almost half of our monthly income goes to tuition 10 months per year...), we're on food stamps (not getting that much) and get Medicaid, etc.
It is REALLY hard. I don't know how anyone does it. We've racked up credit card debt on essentials, we don't bother 'keeping up with the joneses', we go without a lot, I buy from thrift stores and get second hand clothes.
I used to really stress about it. Nothing makes sense. How dare I even WANT another baby? stuff like that. And then I just thought, I have to relax. it is what it is. Take each day as it comes. What do I want my kids to remember when they think back to their childhood? That I was always stressed and worried about money or that I did what I needed to do and spent time singing and dancing with them and reading to them?
it is hard and I wish u hatzlacha. I know this is not a solution, just a little anonymous hug and reminder to smile from someone in the same boat. please take it in the way its intended - all good. good luck!

amother

Olive

Sun, Feb 19 2017, 3:50 pm

amother wrote:

I wouldn't have the nerve to say this to you to your face in person, but it is reasonable to look at what you describe and think of it as voluntary madness. You clearly say that you have 7 kids and earn a combined $1000 per week. You also say that you are (not surprisingly) racking up credit card bills ON ESSENTIALS. Yeah, many would say that its unfair to your family to keep having babies that you have no means of supporting. You sarcastically say that others wonder how DARE you want another baby? Let me ask you this....at what point do you feel it's to much based on your income? 9 kids? 10? 15? I don't mean to come off as harsh and I genuinely wish you bracha and hatslacha and hashem should help and provide for your family.