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Do you want pics of women in the frum magazines?
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amother
Salmon


 

Post Thu, Mar 16 2017, 5:12 am
Debbie wrote:
In my most humble opinion any man who is turned on by a picture of a 4 year old girl ought to be getting treatment!


I agree a 4 year old girl covered up is ridiculous. Im talking about adult women.
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shabbatiscoming




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Mar 16 2017, 5:13 am
Debbie wrote:
In my most humble opinion any man who is turned on by a picture of a 4 year old girl ought to be getting treatment!
Or a woman in tzanua clothing as well.
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amother
Salmon


 

Post Thu, Mar 16 2017, 5:14 am
amother wrote:
You're not looking for no reason. You're getting a sense of someone. Someone who has value beyond her reproductive organs.


That's why I said in an earlier thread that I do think pictures of rebbetzins and maybe some important political figures would be ok because we want to get a sense of that person. The problem would be where to draw the line. Not every author, or every article written about a women are women that are worth getting a sense of.
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shabbatiscoming




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Mar 16 2017, 5:15 am
amother wrote:
I agree a 4 year old girl covered up is ridiculous. Im talking about adult women.
But if they are wearing tzanua clothing? If they are covered as much as possible ?What could possibly be wrong with that?
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amother
Salmon


 

Post Thu, Mar 16 2017, 5:17 am
shabbatiscoming wrote:
Or a woman in tzanua clothing as well.


We have laws of yichud for a reason. Does that mean that if people dont keep it they will automatically sin? Of course not but it's there as a geder. So too, pictures of adult women in magazines that cater to frum men doesn't necessarily mean someone will sin but it's there as a geder. Which is why we have shmiras einayim too.
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shabbatiscoming




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Mar 16 2017, 5:17 am
amother wrote:
That's why I said in an earlier thread that I do think pictures of rebbetzins and maybe some important political figures would be ok because we want to get a sense of that person. The problem would be where to draw the line. Not every author, or every article written about a women are women that are worth getting a sense of.
Why ever not? if someone is important enough to have an article written about her, why not know what she looks like? I dont think anyone is saying you need tons of pictures, just one, at the beginning of an article so you can know what the person looks like.
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amother
Pewter


 

Post Thu, Mar 16 2017, 5:18 am
Look I dont think anyone is getting turned on from seeing a tznius women its just a policy and thats all
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Debbie




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Mar 16 2017, 5:18 am
[quote="amother"]I agree a 4 year old girl covered up is ridiculous. Im talking about adult women.[/quote

I don't see a problem with relevant pictures of modestly dressed women in magazines for Frum women.
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shabbatiscoming




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Mar 16 2017, 5:18 am
amother wrote:
We have laws of yichud for a reason. Does that mean that if people dont keep it they will automatically sin? Of course not but it's there as a geder. So too, pictures of adult women in magazines that cater to frum men doesn't necessarily mean someone will sin but it's there as a geder. Which is why we have shmiras einayim too.
Honey, these magazines are not catered to men. They are for the entire population of HUMAN BEINGS. Thats the difference here.
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amother
Salmon


 

Post Thu, Mar 16 2017, 5:19 am
shabbatiscoming wrote:
But if they are wearing tzanua clothing? If they are covered as much as possible ?What could possibly be wrong with that?


Whats wrong with that is that chazal said that men should not look at women for no reason. Even if they're fully covered.
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amother
Salmon


 

Post Thu, Mar 16 2017, 5:21 am
[quote="Debbie"]
amother wrote:
I agree a 4 year old girl covered up is ridiculous. Im talking about adult women.[/quote

I don't see a problem with relevant pictures of modestly dressed women in magazines for Frum women.


Neither do I if it's only for women
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amother
Salmon


 

Post Thu, Mar 16 2017, 5:22 am
shabbatiscoming wrote:
Honey, these magazines are not catered to men. They are for the entire population of HUMAN BEINGS. Thats the difference here.


Exactly and since men are part of the population of human beings, we have to take that into account.
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amother
Gray


 

Post Thu, Mar 16 2017, 5:22 am
amother wrote:
Look I dont think anyone is getting turned on from seeing a tznius women its just a policy and thats all


It's a policy that reduces women to s-x objects. That's the problem. So instead of creating a more modest society, you create one that is hypers-xualized.
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shabbatiscoming




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Mar 16 2017, 5:26 am
amother wrote:
Exactly and since men are part of the population of human beings, we have to take that into account.
No, it should go the other way. If a man knows that he is that machmir on shmirat ainayim, then let him not look at the magazines, not take the women out of it.
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Raisin




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Mar 16 2017, 5:30 am
Some of these magazines are specifically FOR women. eg Family first from Mishpacha, Bina. No reason why head shots of women in women's magazines shouldn't be ok.
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amother
Salmon


 

Post Thu, Mar 16 2017, 5:31 am
shabbatiscoming wrote:
No, it should go the other way. If a man knows that he is that machmir on shmirat ainayim, then let him not look at the magazines, not take the women out of it.


I agree if the pictures are in there and there's nothing to do about it they should not look. I don't agree that the magazines should start putting the pics in because since they cater to men too and many men read these magazines it could make it hard for them to stop. The magazine companies also dont want the men to stop reading their magazines since that would cause them to lose a lot of money. So therefore I dont think it's a good idea to put pics of women.
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shabbatiscoming




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Mar 16 2017, 5:34 am
amother wrote:
I agree if the pictures are in there and there's nothing to do about it they should not look. I don't agree that the magazines should start putting the pics in because since they cater to men too and many men read these magazines it could make it hard for them to stop. The magazine companies also dont want the men to stop reading their magazines since that would cause them to lose a lot of money. So therefore I dont think it's a good idea to put pics of women.
Tov. We are going in circles and we are not going to afree with each other, so thats that. Truly. I dont agree with your logic at all, but you dont agree with mine either, so...

Look, I think years and years ago there were women in magazines, magazines of all FRUM kinds. But I guess those times went away with a whole new world that came into being. One that I am extremely grateful to not be a part of.
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amother
Salmon


 

Post Thu, Mar 16 2017, 5:36 am
shabbatiscoming wrote:
Tov. We are going in circles and we are not going to afree with each other, so thats that. Truly. I dont agree with your logic at all, but you dont agree with mine either, so...

Look, I think years and years ago there were women in magazines, magazines of all FRUM kinds. But I guess those times went away with a whole new world that came into being. One that I am extremely grateful to not be a part of.


Yes, we agree to disagree Smile
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fs




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Mar 16 2017, 5:44 am
Salmon amother, shmiras einayim for othodox men is gazing, again gazing at women. Some sects of Judiasm added looking at women. That is where you are getting confused between halachically modest and just chumra or whatever you want to call it. The general orthodox population are not the extreme sects of judiasm. And for the men that don't even look or glance at their cashier, waitress or service women then don't buy the general public's magazine like Ami, Mishpacha and Bina. Chumra's don't come easily. And btw, Issur Yichud is for a male and female to physically be in one room.
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amother
Salmon


 

Post Thu, Mar 16 2017, 7:19 am
fs wrote:
Salmon amother, shmiras einayim for othodox men is gazing, again gazing at women. Some sects of Judiasm added looking at women. That is where you are getting confused between halachically modest and just chumra or whatever you want to call it. The general orthodox population are not the extreme sects of judiasm. And for the men that don't even look or glance at their cashier, waitress or service women then don't buy the general public's magazine like Ami, Mishpacha and Bina. Chumra's don't come easily. And btw, Issur Yichud is for a male and female to physically be in one room.


In my circles (yeshivish but definitely not extreme) its very accepted not to look at women for no reason. Looking at the cashier, waitress, or service women is not for no reason. They are doing a service for you and it's polite to acknowledge that by glancing at them. The people that don't even do that are definitely not reading those magazines and yes I do think thats a chumra not halacha. I wasn't talking about those people. I'm talking about the standard yeshivish or chassidish guy that will look at women that they are talking to, or acknowledge women that are helping them but will not look at women for no reason.
About Issur Yichud I was not saying its the same thing. I was just giving an example of a situation where just because we have issurim doesn't mean without them people would automatically sin, but chazal saw the need for it to be there as gedarim to make sre that people don't sin. Also yichud is not just being in the same room. It's being in the same house....
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