Would you shop online...

amother

Saddlebrown

Thu, Mar 30 2017, 3:27 pm

Here's another perspective. My husband told me when we got married that he really, really didn't want internet in the house. I hadn't lived a day without internet until then, but for some reason I agreed to this. It was ok for shana reshona...when we had a baby it was harder. When we were moving and renovating a house, it was almost impossible because all the workers needed to show me things. I had a neighbor across the hall that had internet, and I regularly used it, she was fine with that. It wasn't that I think it is assur--I don't. But what should I do, pick shalom bayis or being a little inconvenient to the neighbor? (My neighbor received plenty of favors from me, it is not like this was one sided.) Now, we do have internet, but that took a LOT of conversations and convincing and speaking to rabbis to get my husband to be ok with it. I am not using someone as my "shabbos [gentile]," I am just trying to temporarily get what I need without my husband getting very upset. As for shopping online--I'd ask my mother or sister to do that, not a neighbor, because it isn't a necessity.

sourstix

Thu, Mar 30 2017, 4:13 pm

Thing is even worse, how about they tell u they need u to check something for them online and then lie to the whole world that they have no internet?

Yeh, so I know so many who "don't beleive Internet is ok" but then they get a smartphone. And well yes of course you have Internet.

The hypocrisy is astounding! Just yesterday two people I asked what kind of phone they have. Guess what- smartphone. I'm so mad!

Not anymore, you know why? Internet is here to stay. Like it or not. Let's learn how to use it wisely. Stop living in denial.

Did I just go off topic? Oy

amother

Violet

Thu, Mar 30 2017, 6:15 pm

amother wrote:

Sorry, no. If it's a personal thing for your dh and he'll say that internet is fine for other people, that's okay. But if he won't let it in your house because you guys are 'better than that' and he believes your family is on a certain level spiritually because of it, certainly if he speaks about it to others, setting a false standard (since you actually DO need and use internet) then you are part of a problem (even though it makes you sad).

Notsobusy

Thu, Mar 30 2017, 6:18 pm

sourstix wrote:

Lots of people have smart phones and don't have internet access. They have TAG disconnect everything besides a few programs or apps that they need. Just because they have a smart phone doesn't mean they're going online.

I have a sibling who doesn't have internet access in her house, the schools don't allow it, and she doesn't want to have it around her kids. Doesn't mean she thinks it's completely treif. A lot of people realize that the internet can be used for good or for bad, but as long as they don't NEED it they don't want to have the access. So when she comes to my house to use my computer, she's not being a hypocrite. I need internet access at home for work purposes, she doesn't. So when she needs it she uses mine. Big deal.

amother

Saddlebrown

Thu, Mar 30 2017, 6:53 pm

amother wrote:

Sorry, no. If it's a personal thing for your dh and he'll say that internet is fine for other people, that's okay.

Yes to this and not the rest of your assumption. He doesn't want it in the house for his personal reasons, not wanting the influence, distraction etc. He has no problem with other people having it, he just doesn't want it AROUND and tempting us all the time. We did not need to sign anything or tell anyone about this--it isn't a community standard where we are.

33055

Thu, Mar 30 2017, 7:08 pm

amother wrote:

Honestly, your shalom biyas should not be at a neighbor's inconvenience. I have been asked to give rides to ladies because they don't want to bother their husband. In my less assertive days, I did it with a smile while seething.

amother

Violet

Thu, Mar 30 2017, 11:26 pm

glutenless wrote:

If she thinks even the good on the internet is not good enough for her kids, then why does she use it?

amother

Wheat

Fri, Mar 31 2017, 2:43 am

my neighbor has a small appartment and 6 children. she does not want to have inet-access at home, because it would be hard to 'hide' it.
we have one more room and less chidlren. we can easily lock of the pc-room. our children hence also dont have access to the pc.

now she is not totally against internet, she just does not want her children to have acess to the computer (she works full time, the chidlren are often on their own, no dad, they have a babysitter sometimes etc.

of course, whens he needs to book a flight or make an online appointment I arrange it for her.

I understand her position, and we share our views on not using smartpones and not letting the kids unattended near a pc....so...I guess its more grey than black and white.

amother

Brown

Fri, Mar 31 2017, 4:10 am

amother wrote:

Nonsense, she can get a laptop, keep it in her closet, and password protect the internet.

amother

Wheat

Fri, Mar 31 2017, 5:00 am

maybe you are rigt brown, but it just doesnt bother me. I never felt 'less'because I do have internet, whereas some of my friends/neighbors refuse to have it.

dh and I made a decision that inet with many filters (no youtube, no news, no online magaizines etc) is fine for us. I would never judge someone else because he or she does want youtube...thats ridiculous we all need and want different things. maybe my yezer horo is bigger , who knows?

I dont feel like a shabbos [gentile] when I do help them out with our internet.

in return I could ask them for a favor.

maybe I miss something (totally possible).

amother

White

Fri, Mar 31 2017, 10:34 am

Stam a friend or relative, no, any more than I would carry something for someone who doesn't hold by the eruv. But I don't have any relatives or friends that I know of who don't use the net, except for one friend who doesn't have a computer and I'm not sure if it's for religious or financial reasons. My ds is in beis medrash where theyre supposed to have only a kosherphone and he plays by the rules, so he'll call me and ask me to look stuff up for him, make plane reservations and so on. When he's home he shops online himself. I'm pretty sure that when he marries BE"H, he'll prefer not to use the net and ask his wife to do the online stuff for him.

PinkFridge

Fri, Mar 31 2017, 10:51 am

Re the internet: I understand why people are disconcerted. I think that if I had a relationship with the person asking and was a) not feeling that I was being treated condescendingly and b) was not being asked to do this regularly I would be willing to do it. I've booked tickets for people who don't want to start up with internet in their home.

And I guess this means that I shouldn't ask anyone to cut and paste an article my filters won't allow me to open Wink

. Or maybe Twisted Evil

.

Re the eruv: I also understand why people don't want to use an eruv. In our case, we would use an eruv when we went out of town for simchos. As long as the reason is that they would prefer not to use the eruv regularly and not that they don't hold by a certain eruv, I'd be fine helping them out. If I used the eruv.

I think the thought processes to both cases are fairly similar.

Notsobusy

Fri, Mar 31 2017, 11:01 am

amother wrote:

If she thinks even the good on the internet is not good enough for her kids, then why does she use it?

I'm not sure I understand your question. It's not the the good isn't good enough for her kids, it's that she doesn't find it necessary for her kids to use the internet. And she feels that the potential for bad with her teenagers over weighs the limited good that she would get out of it. So the few times when she wants to shop online she comes to my house. She doesn't think she's more special or I'm less frum, just that she usually doesn't need it and now she does.

Notsobusy

Fri, Mar 31 2017, 11:15 am

mommy3b2c wrote:

My neighbor asks me to use my internet sometimes. I'm thrilled to help her. I feel bad for her. Life is so difficult without the internet. Why would I mind helping her? She's not getting in my way.

That's how I feel, if I can do someone an easy favor why not? I wouldn't let someone use it if they preached about how terrible the internet is, or they bragged about not having it, that's different. Or if somebody wanted to use it frequently, then they should get their own.

But it doesn't affect me in any way if somebody else makes different choices than me. It's no different than me borrowing a book from her that I want to read but don't feel like buying.

Stars

Fri, Mar 31 2017, 11:15 am

mommy3b2c wrote:

My neighbor asks me to use my internet sometimes. I'm thrilled to help her. I feel bad for her. Life is so difficult without the internet. Why would I mind helping her? She's not getting in my way.

Doesn't sound like she thinks she's holier than you for not having the internet in her house, does she?
It's the holier than thou types who come knocking on your door saying "I heard you can get xyz on amazon. Order it for me. I'll bring you cash"
They do this every other day, and the cash takes a looooooooooong time in coming.
Oh and when you need them you can never reach them because they don't have text or email.