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Forum -> Parenting our children -> School age children
8 yr old drew disturbing picture - looking for professional
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amother
Seagreen


 

Post Thu, May 11 2017, 8:40 pm
I am a clinical psychologist.

Call Gavriel Fagin for a consultation: http://www.tikunim-counseling.com
He is a consultant to schools when issues such as these arise.

You need an expert. Only an expert will have internal norms to know what is typical. By seeking treatment, you are opening the door to be steered in one of two opposing directions (normative versus high risk ). Seeing an experienced specialist will increase the likelihood that you can trust his or her clinical analysis and conclusion.
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amother
Slateblue


 

Post Thu, May 11 2017, 8:51 pm
Only chasidish people understand this concern. If your not chasidish you won't get it even if you "know" the chasidish lifestyle. Lime amother gets it because she's chasidish. No child would come write. The "loving words" molesters like to use. Because it's nothing to rave about. Now boobs and naked and tush are very shocking words for a chasidish kid when they are all put together.
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little neshamala




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, May 11 2017, 9:11 pm
amother wrote:
Only chasidish people understand this concern. If your not chasidish you won't get it even if you "know" the chasidish lifestyle. Lime amother gets it because she's chasidish. No child would come write. The "loving words" monlesters like to use. Because it's nothing to rave about. Now boobs and naked and tush are very shocking words for a chasidish kid when they are all put together.


I agree with you. And I really do get what you're saying. But its bothering me that the option of him having learned those words from a classmate, as opposed to a molestor, is basically off the table because chassidish kids are very "sheltered".

"Boobies" and "tushie" are not the same as boobs and tush. They are very age appropriate language for 8 year olds. Could they have been said by a creepy older man? YES! And I am very happy that OP is being careful about this possible situation. KOL HAKAVOD.

But please, realise it is just as possible, and quite probable, for one 8 year old chassidish boy, out of a class of 27, to have learned about "boobies" from his neighbor/sister/cousin/babysitter/brother in law/uncle/bunk-mate etc and then gleefully informed a pack of kids in the class.

V'zeh hu
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amother
Denim


 

Post Thu, May 11 2017, 10:25 pm
Just to clarify: the words used, though inappropriate and immature, and definitely not acceptable in my home, are not words he hasn't heard or spoken. What I found most alarming is the context (in a mikvah, which he's never been to).
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crust




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, May 11 2017, 10:36 pm
amother wrote:
Just to clarify: the words used, though inappropriate and immature, and definitely not acceptable in my home, are not words he hasn't heard or spoken. What I found most alarming is the context (in a mikvah, which he's never been to).


Ok. A mikvah is not such a far fetched thing. He can know what a mikvah is without being there. I wouldn't panic just because of the word mikvah.
I think you can really take your time to sort things out, find the professional you want get him to talk to your child and get guidance for yourself.
Much hatzlucha and Siyaate Dishmaya. We all need!
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amother
Smokey


 

Post Thu, May 11 2017, 10:50 pm
Does anyone else think that pickle might mean a private part in that context?
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amother
Denim


 

Post Thu, May 11 2017, 11:43 pm
amother wrote:
Does anyone else think that pickle might mean a private part in that context?


That's what I thought...
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crust




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, May 11 2017, 11:44 pm
amother wrote:
Does anyone else think that pickle might mean a private part in that context?

I didn't think otherwise.
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amother
Copper


 

Post Thu, May 11 2017, 11:45 pm
amother wrote:
Just to clarify: the words used, though inappropriate and immature, and definitely not acceptable in my home, are not words he hasn't heard or spoken. What I found most alarming is the context (in a mikvah, which he's never been to).


If you know for sure he has never been in a mikvah, I woukd think he used that context either because he knows people a unclothed there and/or because of something he heard from a friend. But I think you are wise to ask professional advice.
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marina




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, May 11 2017, 11:58 pm
amother wrote:
Marina, sorry but I think you don't get the severity here. It's obvious that his rebbe and mother are concerned and everyone's here is. Op, your right I would be concerned too.

And chasidish kids don't know the word boobs and don't hear their parents or friends say it either. It's a different type of life then others. I am just explaining. No the boys at this age don't talk about this stuff.

Even girls very minimally. But girls are different.


I hope I explained it well. It's hard to explain it.

And yes I'm chasidish so if my ds would come home with this, I would be just as concerned as she. I would cry. Our children are very sheltered.

Now you can have an argument about it if it's the right way in a s/o but not here.


I went to chassidishe summer camps starting from age 9. And that's pretty much where I learned what s-ex is. Bunk Yud gimmel told me all the Johnny Deeper jokes I had never heard in my public school 3rd grade classroom. It was a very educational summer with the girls from Beis Rivkah. And every summer thereafter Smile

So, lol. No.
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marina




 
 
    
 

Post Fri, May 12 2017, 12:03 am
amother wrote:
Does anyone else think that pickle might mean a private part in that context?


sometimes a pickle is just a pickle.

Look OP, are there any other off signs about your son? Is he acting strange? having accidents? Disrupted sleeping? Reluctant to participate in activities he previously enjoyed?

If not, I'd really not worry about this.

Everyone is so fast nowadays to raise the alarm about abuse, which is good to some extent, but on the other hand this approach risks pathologizing normal childhood activities and experiences.
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crust




 
 
    
 

Post Fri, May 12 2017, 12:11 am
marina wrote:
sometimes a pickle is just a pickle.

Look OP, are there any other off signs about your son? Is he acting strange? having accidents? Disrupted sleeping? Reluctant to participate in activities he previously enjoyed?

If not, I'd really not worry about this.

Everyone is so fast nowadays to raise the alarm about abuse, which is good to some extent, but on the other hand this approach risks pathologizing normal childhood activities and experiences.

I really appreciate your grounded calming tone. I think everyone does. It's needed.
But whats gonna happen if the OP does see an experinced professional to straighten it out with? I think that she will be calmer this way given the society we live in. At least a consultation and take it from there.
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marina




 
 
    
 

Post Fri, May 12 2017, 12:24 am
crust wrote:
I really appreciate your grounded calming tone. I think everyone does. It's needed.
But whats gonna happen if the OP does see an experinced professional to straighten it out with? I think that she will be calmer this way given the society we live in. At least a consultation and take it from there.


I agree- sure. She should see a professional if only to calm her down about this. I just don't want her to worry in the meantime. It takes a while to get an appointment with professionals.
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amother
Brown


 

Post Fri, May 12 2017, 12:31 am
My chasidish son googled "boob" on my phone once. He was 11. You never know what they know and where they hear it from.
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tigerwife




 
 
    
 

Post Fri, May 12 2017, 1:11 am
amother wrote:
Does anyone else think that pickle might mean a private part in that context?


This sounds weird but I've heard people say "She's a pickle!" a way to describe very skinny (skinny pickle). Actually laughing out loud at this memory. But that was my thought.

OP, I hope Marina is right. Sometimes kids do just write naughty words for fun. I'm not shocked about the language- even sheltered little kids do not necessarily share the trending 'bad words' from their classroom with their parents. I do agree that getting a professional evaluation will make you feel better.
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gp2.0




 
 
    
 

Post Fri, May 12 2017, 10:00 am
marina wrote:
sometimes a pickle is just a pickle.

Look OP, are there any other off signs about your son? Is he acting strange? having accidents? Disrupted sleeping? Reluctant to participate in activities he previously enjoyed?

If not, I'd really not worry about this.

Everyone is so fast nowadays to raise the alarm about abuse, which is good to some extent, but on the other hand this approach risks pathologizing normal childhood activities and experiences.


ITA!
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amother
Azure


 

Post Fri, May 12 2017, 10:22 am
JCW ist always the best place to start. They have professionals to help figure out if/what happened. Before starting to question him in a way that pushes him to believe something that eventually didnt happen. Dont be afraid to contact them. They have the right ressources and are super helpful.

Behatzlacha!
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FranticFrummie




 
 
    
 

Post Fri, May 12 2017, 10:46 am
When DD was in first grade, she went to a Chassidish school with the kids of Big Name Rabbis.

One day I looked in her notebook, and she had written "FUK YUO" in big letters. I asked her "who says that word?" and she said "Dovi!" The son of one of the biggest name rabbis in the community, who sits on the beis din.

So much for a sheltered environment. Rolling Eyes
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crust




 
 
    
 

Post Fri, May 12 2017, 10:58 am
FranticFrummie wrote:
When DD was in first grade, she went to a Chassidish school with the kids of Big Name Rabbis.

One day I looked in her notebook, and she had written "FUK YUO" in big letters. I asked her "who says that word?" and she said "Dovi!" The son of one of the biggest name rabbis in the community, who sits on the beis din.

So much for a sheltered environment. Rolling Eyes

She had a boy in her class?
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FranticFrummie




 
 
    
 

Post Fri, May 12 2017, 11:01 am
crust wrote:
She had a boy in her class?


I wasn't happy about it, but they don't divide the genders until 3rd grade. It was a really small class. 3 boys and 4 girls, total.
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