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How do ppl afford it? Living in EY.
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amother
Pumpkin


 

Post Tue, Jun 20 2017, 5:35 am
Always wanted to make Aliyah.
Just DH and I
But, how do ppl afford to live here?
Recently went to a major supermarket and food was expensive, more than US.
Food, expensive
Electric, expensive
To buy an apartment, expensive.
Then I here that teachers make $1,500 monthly.
How do ppl afford to live?
Yet, everywhere I go ppl buy, go out, hotels are full (not tourists, Israelis)
Please explain to me what a normal monthly budget looks like in EY, if everything is more expensive then in US.

Food (for2 that eat like 4)
Mortgage
Utilities (with air condition)
Car
Gas
Insurance
Misc.

Or do ppl just live on pure Emunah
Because the numbers just don't make sense
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WitchKitty




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Jun 20 2017, 5:54 am
where are you planning on living? the difference in cost of living between Ezras Torah and Ramot is huge, as is the difference between Yerushalaim and the Gush, for example.
Also, if you're planning on buying the same foods you buy in the US, it's IMPORTED=expensive.
Regular foods are not more expensive than USA.
1,500 monthly is a lot actually. People here manage with less. If you don't live with all the Americans (I.e. the places that cost 2000$ rent for a machsan), you usually don't need designer clothes, or matching children. Or meat twice a week (yeah, the prices of meat really are high)

Food (for2 that eat like 4)

As mentioned. Depends what you are eating. Some things are expensive and somethings aren't.
Mortgage

That is pretty high but if DH is in kollel/yeshiva and/or you don't work , there are big discounts
Utilities (with air condition)

The prices keep on changing. Water price here depends on how much rain fell this year.
some apartments use gas balloons
And again, there are lots of discounts
Car
Who has a car here???? (immediate reaction). If dh learns all day you don't have a car. usually.
If he works, you'll have money for it. Tongue Out

Misc.
clothes? get there.
and bring q-tips, deoderant, ziploc bags, cream cheese, american cheese.
Everything else you can get here for great prices.
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amother
Cerulean


 

Post Tue, Jun 20 2017, 5:56 am
Healthcare, daycare and tuition are much less expensive than in the US.

Teachers earn low salaries (though they have great hours and benefits, including deep discounts at hotels), but hi-tech workers and those working for foreign companies can do very well. It's ok to ask Israelis where you want to live nosy questions about how they manage. Many have help buying that first apartment.
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Blessing1




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Jun 20 2017, 6:12 am
Whoever I know that moved to Israel is being supported.
I think that the Israelis just know how to manage with less & be happy, it's in them.


Last edited by Blessing1 on Tue, Jun 20 2017, 10:38 am; edited 1 time in total
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amother
Pumpkin


 

Post Tue, Jun 20 2017, 6:27 am
fsr wrote:
where are you planning on living? the difference in cost of living between Ezras Torah and Ramot is huge, as is the difference between Yerushalaim and the Gush, for example.
Also, if you're planning on buying the same foods you buy in the US, it's IMPORTED=expensive.
Regular foods are not more expensive than USA.
1,500 monthly is a lot actually. People here manage with less. If you don't live with all the Americans (I.e. the places that cost 2000$ rent for a machsan), you usually don't need designer clothes, or matching children. Or meat twice a week (yeah, the prices of meat really are high)

Food (for2 that eat like 4)

As mentioned. Depends what you are eating. Some things are expensive and somethings aren't.
Mortgage

That is pretty high but if DH is in kollel/yeshiva and/or you don't work , there are big discounts
Utilities (with air condition)

The prices keep on changing. Water price here depends on how much rain fell this year.
some apartments use gas balloons
And again, there are lots of discounts
Car
Who has a car here???? (immediate reaction). If dh learns all day you don't have a car. usually.
If he works, you'll have money for it. Tongue Out

Misc.
clothes? get there.
and bring q-tips, deoderant, ziploc bags, cream cheese, american cheese.
Everything else you can get here for great prices.


We want to start planning to make Aliyah in retirement mode, in 10 yrs.
We have decided to look to buy an apartment now, and pay it up in 10 yrs time.
We have enough for a large down payment, or so I thought.
And pay the rest up, by renting it until we need it.
We looked in Ramot, 2,000,000 shekels, Ramat Bet Shemesh, a little less, 1,700,000
I'm hearing it's so cheap I'm buying one for my children, (from Israelis).
How?

I went to a large supermarket, one that I thought was lower priced, chicken leg 1/4s came out to about $5 the lb. I pay $2.89 in the US, when it's not on sale.
We do eat A LOT of chicken
Ground Meat was almost $10 the lb.
Produce didn't seem cheaper to me, about the same if not more.
Israeli packaged stuff, made in Israel, I pay either the same price or less. For example I saw a package of frozen artichoke bottoms (I buy these as a luxury item on YT) in EY $5.50. The same exact Israeli Brand in US 3 for $10.
How can this be?

If this is how expensive EY is then $2500 (after apartment is bought) may not be enough

If someone is kind enough to show us how ppl make it.
I'm really yearning to live here.
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ProudMommie




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Jun 20 2017, 6:39 am
Sometimes people actually have more money here after expenses... than in America, depends on where they make aliyah from. We lived in Brooklyn, so ye, definitely we are able to live here without accumulating a huge debt..and it is so much easier for us financially.. But we live simply... and don't have luxuries. However, we have enough BH (bli ayin hara). You are welcome to pm me. I can speak to you on the phone and tell you more info if you are seriously considering.. It is amazing to realize how many extra things we were used to America that we really did not need.. (though many people still have those things they were used to in the US and seem to still be managing ok.. it is very individual and I don't know the details of every situation.)
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amother
Pumpkin


 

Post Tue, Jun 20 2017, 7:29 am
OP here, at the moment we are not ready to make Aliyah.
Thinking of making Aliyah once we retire in about 10 yrs. we'll be in our 60s by then. Young enough to enjoy, but a little old to start again.
At the moment WE ARE looking to buy an apartment since we have some money put aside for a down payment, and I thought that the rest would be paid out by renting it out, also since we still work it will be easier to pay it off now. The goal is to have it debt free by the time we make Aliyah.

Plus if we wait prices are just going to get crazier.

Where can I buy an apartment for about $300,000/ 1,000,000 shecks.
Since we are not going to be making Aliyah right away, we need to pay 8% property tax, upfront.

Also everyday living expenses. I don't think I live luxurious, and I know that in Israel I would have to live even more simply, but the prices of things just seem imposible.

No kids at home (all married B"H) so tuition isn't going to be a savings for us.

Perhaps I'm looking at it the wrong way.
Maybe the numbers will never add up.
This is a land of miracles.
Maybe the key is to have emunah that some how you make it
Is this too naive
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amother
Burlywood


 

Post Tue, Jun 20 2017, 7:41 am
First of all, almost everyone I know that lives in Israel is either being supported monthly, or has been given a entire apartment with no mortgage (or at least they aren't responsible for the mortgage). That way, they need much less to live on.
I don't know where you can get an apartment for 300. Even Beitar is more like 400 now. And Jerusalem, as you probably know, is upwards of 500 for a very small apartment.
Gas/car expenses are very high there, so if you calculate taxis, it might come out less to just take taxis and buses when you can.
The Ramat Beit Shemesh retired couples are generally very well off and bought expensive apartments, renovated, and live like Americans. Only the very wealthy can live like that. There too, the small apartments are around 400.
Basically, you have three choices--be very rich, have family members that are very rich and want to give you money, or have almost no gashmiyus needs and be ok with living on a very very very low level.
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amother
Pumpkin


 

Post Tue, Jun 20 2017, 7:48 am
amother wrote:
First of all, almost everyone I know that lives in Israel is either being supported monthly, or has been given a entire apartment with no mortgage (or at least they aren't responsible for the mortgage). That way, they need much less to live on.
I don't know where you can get an apartment for 300. Even Beitar is more like 400 now. And Jerusalem, as you probably know, is upwards of 500 for a very small apartment.
Gas/car expenses are very high there, so if you calculate taxis, it might come out less to just take taxis and buses when you can.
The Ramat Beit Shemesh retired couples are generally very well off and bought expensive apartments, renovated, and live like Americans. Only the very wealthy can live like that. There too, the small apartments are around 400.
Basically, you have three choices--be very rich, have family members that are very rich and want to give you money, or have almost no gashmiyus needs and be ok with living on a very very very low level.


This is what I thought
So, I guess it will only be a dream, till Moshiach comes.

BTW, for $400,000 you can gets super luxury apartment 1800 sq ft., with valet, spa, pool, etc., in a very posh area where I live,
BUT I'll trade it any time for life in EY.
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amother
Cerulean


 

Post Tue, Jun 20 2017, 8:20 am
$2500 a month for two people without a mortgage should be plenty. The key is getting used to smaller living space. Or perhaps buying on paper now, if you can.
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grace413




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Jun 20 2017, 9:05 am
Are you open to living in places other than the Jerusalem-Bet Shemesh area?

Unfortunately, housing prices are very high. Do you own a home in the US that you would be selling when you retire and come here? You might want to buy something at whatever price you can afford now, use the rent to pay the mortgage and then see where you stand when you are ready to come. Think BeerSheva or Charish, even if you don't want to live there.

You can't go wrong buying property in Israel.

Re chicken - generally much cheaper to buy whole, uncut chickens as opposed to parts. My neighborhood makolet sometimes has ground beef on sale for 30 a kilo - not a bad price at all.
Food - if you want to spend less you have to eat differently and of course that's not always the healthiest option. The less processed food you buy the cheaper it is. Chumus is much cheaper here than in the States. Eggs are reasonable. Fruit and vegetable prices change by season and you get the tastiest and cheapest by buying in season.

It's a myth particular to young couples in kollel that all Americans here are being supported by their parents or somebody else.

True you will not be able to get as posh a place for the same money but if you are willing to live in a 2 bedroom 80 square meter apartment you can manage. I'm spoiled and couldn't live without my car but many people do.

The most important thing is that you have to really want to be here and be willing to make some sacrifices.

Hatzlacha.
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Karnash




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Jun 20 2017, 9:32 am
I don't know, I think most Imamothers live in a parallel universe. I won't talk about myself because I and Dh are retired, worked most of our working lives in Israel, in salaried positions. We have decent pensions, no mortgage and b"H can afford to live nicely. We have 5 married children, all b"H own their apartments - we and machatonim helped with a down payment. They all have mortgages which THEY pay. I'll tell you about my son. He learns in kollel, has 3 children, does odd jobs when he can, teaches bar-mizva boys, gives shiurim etc. My DIL is an occupational therapist. Their combined net income is about 14,000 shekel. They live simply but they have a car, very occasionally go out to eat, manage just fine. The only people I know who think 1500$ is an average family income exist on Imamother. I think that when you live in an insulated American community where most don't or can't work at regular jobs, you get a skewed view of what the real Israel is like.
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amother
Jade


 

Post Tue, Jun 20 2017, 10:15 am
We find it cheaper to live here actually.
Our medical insurance premiums and car insurance/maintenance were sky high and now they're negligible. (We don't have a car now, dh has an electric bike and I bus.)
Rent is the same - Brooklyn and Jlem are both insane.
Another major savings we didn't expect was a cultural one. When stores don't accept returns (or at least hassle free ones) or offer free shipping etc. you think twice about purchases and just don't buy as much.

Yes, there was an adjustment in how we eat, but more figuring out what's cheap here vs. what's expensive. In the U.S., schnitzel is more expensive than legs. Here it's the opposite. Schnitzel used to be for Shabbat, now legs are.
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imasoftov




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Jun 20 2017, 10:17 am
Blessing1 wrote:
Whoever I know thirst moved to Israel is being supporeted.

Burlywood amother wrote:
almost everyone I know that lives in Israel is either being supported monthly, or has been given a entire apartment with no mortgage (or at least they aren't responsible for the mortgage).


Almost everyone I know in Israel lives in Jerusalem, and most of them in a few neighborhoods, (curiously, all near one another). But it seems that most Israelis don't live in Jerusalem, and most Jerusalemites live in other parts of the city.
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Marion




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Jun 20 2017, 10:35 am
amother wrote:

I went to a large supermarket, one that I thought was lower priced, chicken leg 1/4s came out to about $5 the lb. I pay $2.89 in the US, when it's not on sale.
We do eat A LOT of chicken
Ground Meat was almost $10 the lb.
Produce didn't seem cheaper to me, about the same if not more.


Ground meat was almost 80NIS/kilo? Where? I can get rib steaks for that amount. (Not a Rubin/Eida/Landau hechsher.) Chicken leg quarters run about 27NIS/kilo. That's $3.47/lb. Not on sale. On sale you can find 4-5kg for 100NIS. Again, not Rubin/Eida/Landau hechsher, but yes mehadrin. Produce is definitely cheaper. I'm willing to bet you're not converting kilos to pounds...
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amother
Gray


 

Post Tue, Jun 20 2017, 10:38 am
amother wrote:
First of all, almost everyone I know that lives in Israel is either being supported monthly, or has been given a entire apartment with no mortgage (or at least they aren't responsible for the mortgage). That way, they need much less to live on.
I don't know where you can get an apartment for 300. Even Beitar is more like 400 now. And Jerusalem, as you probably know, is upwards of 500 for a very small apartment.
Gas/car expenses are very high there, so if you calculate taxis, it might come out less to just take taxis and buses when you can.
The Ramat Beit Shemesh retired couples are generally very well off and bought expensive apartments, renovated, and live like Americans. Only the very wealthy can live like that. There too, the small apartments are around 400.
Basically, you have three choices--be very rich, have family members that are very rich and want to give you money, or have almost no gashmiyus needs and be ok with living on a very very very low level.


My husband and I are not being supported by anyone. I actually do not know anyone who is being supported by parents. It's not done in my circles. I have friends in Jerusalem, Modiin, Tel Aviv, Maaleh Adumim, Rehovot, Bet Shemesh, the Gush, the Shomron, Golan, Galil, Negev...literally all over the country -- cities and yishuvim. We are all working hard and supporting ourselves and our families.
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juggling




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Jun 20 2017, 10:59 am
Op, your grocery prices are way higher than I pay here in beit shemesh. Of course it depends if you require super-mehadrin. Regular mehadrin chicken is rarely more than 20 shekels a kilo, and it's often much less. This is very similar to US prices. Ground beef is around 50 shekels a kilo, sometimes less. That's about 6.5 usd, not 10. (To the poster who said chicken breast is cheaper than legs here, I have never seen that. Legs are always cheaper in my experience. But, yes, it's cheapest to buy the whole chicken and cut it yourself.)

I literally don't know anyone here who is supported by anyone in chul, to my knowledge. They wouldn't make it known, if they were.

That said, $2500 sounds like a very low budget. But maybe. You're only two people, so you could possibly make it work. People who teach, and don't have a higher-earning spouse, generally do tutoring, and the like, to supplement their salaries. You can't support a family on the salary of a teacher.m

I would guess nbn has some useful resources on the subject of budgeting in Israel.
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amother
Bronze


 

Post Tue, Jun 20 2017, 11:02 am
Look beyond your sixties. Let's say you live to your nineties and have 25 years in Israel. Of those 25 years, assume half are in great health for both of you. Then what?

You need to factor in the cost of health care for the elderly. If you stay in the States, do you have long term medical insurance? Have you discussed what you or your DH would do if one of you could not be cared for in the home? What if you or your spouse develops dementia?

Costs for medical care and equipment are much less in Israel. Medicines are less expensive in Israel. Employing a Philippino/a to allow you to live in your own home costs less than a similar caregiver in the U.S.

Without being morbid, do you hope to be buried in E.Y.? If so, factor in shipping a body to Israel. (It was about $12,000 fifteen years ago. I don't know what it is now.) Plots in Israel for Americans can be upwards of $20K, but Israelis living in Israel get a free plot.
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shevi82




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Jun 20 2017, 11:03 am
If you have a down payment then buy somthing asap. You can always sell it later on and the prices will only go up.
In jerusalem, areas such as Neve Yaakov, pisgat zeev you can probaly find an apartment for 1,250,000 NIS.
For less then that perhaps in Afula, Chaifa, Kiryat Ata.
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shabbatiscoming




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Jun 20 2017, 11:17 am
I 100% agree with karnash. Imamother seems to be skewed very much to the anglo charedi sector in Israel. No, not everyone lives that way at all. We would not live happily on $1500.
We both work as well, we own a car, we own an apartment (thankfully got help with the down payment, but are paying our mortgage for the next 30 years like every other joe shmoe that we know here).
And for those who say that all of the people you know in Israel are being supported, are they not maybe kollel couples? Thats again, how imamother gets skewed. That is not all of the population in Israel. There are so many different kinds of people living and working and everything else, in Israel.
As for prices on food, you CAN NOT compare prices in dollars to what things cost in Israel. It wont help you understand prices because they are just that different.
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