Dating etiquette question.

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amother

Cyan

Thu, Jul 27 2017, 8:05 pm

My nephew told me an incident that happened to him a few weeks ago. I think he was waaaaay out of line. He was on a first date and was driving to their destination. Around 10 minutes into the ride it came out that the girl goes to movies. My nephew adamantly wouldn't think of going to movies. Nevermind how this wasn't checked into properly. At this point my nephew politely tells the girl that he's sorry this somehow didn't come out before hand, but he doesn't date girls who go to movies. He then took her back home. Start to finish was 20 minutes. He said the girl seemed to be in agreement that a date would be a waste of both their times if he feels that way. I feel my nephew should have continued the date and cut it a little short. Opinions?

mommy3b2c

Thu, Jul 27 2017, 8:07 pm

Your nephew behaved despicably. Maybe he should watch some movies about manners. Humiliating someone is a much worse sin then watching a movie.

amother

Bisque

Thu, Jul 27 2017, 8:19 pm

Well, he certainly saved them both some time, though he probably destroyed his reputation in the process. I'm sure she had no interest in spending the rest of the evening with him once he revealed his lack of sensitivity.

Please let him know that he should find a rebbi for a good mussar shmooze. This has nothing to do with movies or hashkafa, and everything to do with being a mentch. He doesn't sound ready for marriage in any way...

zaq

Thu, Jul 27 2017, 8:31 pm

Not nice. Not polite. Not menschlich. Of course the young lady agreed, what else could she do? Beg him to continue the date? What young lady with any gumption would humiliate herself that way? What young lady with any taste would even want to stay one minute longer than necessary in the company of a guy who would treat her that way?

if he had treated her like a mensch she could perhaps have eventually been persuaded to give up movies for his sake. All he's managed to do with his self righteousness is make a really, really bad impression on at least four people: the young lady, her parents, and the shadchan.

mame1

Thu, Jul 27 2017, 8:35 pm

You know your nephew better than we do. I'm sure if he's an insensitive person, that hasn't been the first example of it. However, in regards to dating, I feel like it is an insensitive process. It's not a process of getting to know a person, but of deciding that a person has the qualities that you want. I feel like he probably did them both a favor. If he had followed through with the date already knowing that it wasn't going to go anywhere and they weren't gaining a friend or anything from it, it would have been an awkward, uncomfortable situation. A waste of time. I seriously doubt she minded going home early once she knew that there was no chance for it to move forward.

zaq

Thu, Jul 27 2017, 8:59 pm

mame1 wrote:

You're mistaken about a few things:

1. Shidduch dating is a process of weeding out those who don't have what you want, not finding those who do.

2. Why does having gone to movies mean the whole thing is possul and not going to go anywhere? Ultimately marriage is about personalities. Where personalities mesh, everything else can be negotiated. But where personalities clash, and especially where one or the other isn't a mensch, that's where there's no point trying to move forward.

So yes, ultimately the young man did do the young lady a favor, not because she has no business going out with someone who objects to young ladies who go to movies, but because he's a sanctimonious boor and she doesn't need that.

If he had been a mensch she might have decided that he's worth giving up movies for.

mame1

Thu, Jul 27 2017, 9:14 pm

zaq wrote:

Maybe this boy is all you say he is. Maybe not. I don't know him and I'm certainly not going to pass judgment on him. Nobody was abused here, and I don't feel like he needs to be admonished online.

Doing something you don't want is the same as not having what you want, is it not? If you're in a situation where you can choose what you want and weed out what you don't want, why would you go into something knowing that you're going to have to "change" someone?

In his mind, it was a no-go because of the movies. Does that make him a bad person? I don't think so. Obviously, that's something that's important to him. Relationships have not worked out over many things that other people could find trivial. Even if something seems minimal to one person, it can be a deal breaker to somebody else.

At the end of the day, it sounds like they probably weren't compatible. There are a lot of girls who don't watch movies and a lot of boys who do watch movies. Perhaps she would be happier with somebody who enjoys what she enjoys, and he would be happier with somebody who enjoys what he enjoys. If she wants to give up movies, that should be something that she decides on her own, not something she's pressured into for a boy.

In my experience, there's a checklist of things that people want and don't want. Those are sorted out/figured out/exposed before personalities are even brought into the mix. Whoever set them up didn't ask the obvious questions. Having a TV in the home, watching movies, having internet...those are some basic things that a lot of people care about. If she truly wanted to continue on this date or get to know him better, instead of answering the question with a flat "YES- I watch movies," she could have said, "Yes- I watch movies" but with an explanation or a provision that it's something she's willing to give up. Maybe he would have been open to that. That was, not surprisingly, bad communication. They are presumably young. It was an experience. Nobody got hurt. Hopefully they each learned a little something for it, either about themselves, other people, dating, or whatever.

tigerwife

Thu, Jul 27 2017, 9:30 pm

It is very, very hurtful to have your date cut off early (especially that early!) because your date doesn't like something about you. In fact, it's pretty hurtful to be told to your face that you are not up to someone's standards in any case. He could have brought her home three hours later and told the shadchan it wasn't for him. Three hours of his life are worth sparing someone else's hurt. And yes, being told no hurts, too, but not as much when it's to your face without being given a proper chance.

mommy3b2c

Thu, Jul 27 2017, 9:41 pm

mame1 wrote:

In his mind, it was a no-go because of the movies. Does that make him a bad person?.

Nope.

Here's what makes him a (bad) selfish person:

Humiliating a girl on a date.

Is he perhaps your son?

If he is, I'm sorry to inform you that you failed to raise a mentch.

Simple1

Thu, Jul 27 2017, 9:41 pm

The "waste of time" happened already. She rushed home from work, did her hair and make up. Got dressed etc, etc. It seems the right thing to do is to finish the date, maybe keep it a little short if he needs to.

That said maybe it was a mistake. Sometimes good people make mistakes out of inexperience or immaturity, and with a little coaching will get things right.

mame1

Thu, Jul 27 2017, 9:46 pm

mommy3b2c wrote:

Nope.

Here's what makes him a (bad) selfish person:

Humiliating a girl on a date.

Is he perhaps your son?

If he is, I'm sorry to inform you that you failed to raise a mentch.

I don't have a son, actually. I don't know who he is. That's my point. Nobody here does, except for the anonymous poster, who wasn't on the date, who doesn't know the full story. I'd rather give somebody the benefit of the doubt than to diss him for being a horrible person and diss his mother for raising a horrible person. We've now created two generations of horrible people. Maybe they both decided they didn't want to go on a date. We don't know.

marina

Thu, Jul 27 2017, 9:48 pm

If being kind to people is a waste of our time, I don't know what any of us are doing on this planet

allthingsblue

Thu, Jul 27 2017, 9:52 pm

How would he like it if after he mentioned that he's not in the the top level Shiur, only in the second best, she said, "excuse me, but would you please take me home? I only want to marry someone who is in a top level Shiur."

allthingsblue

Thu, Jul 27 2017, 9:55 pm

He sounds clueless. He has a lot to learn about putting himself in another person's shoes.
And he's going to get a bad name. This girl is going to probably tell her friends (I mean, a story like this is literally incredible!) and her parents will tell their friends, I'm sure. And they'll obviously tell the shadchan.
Really, this story leaves me speechless.

mommy3b2c

Thu, Jul 27 2017, 9:56 pm

mame1 wrote:

This is an online forum. We do not make up scenarios to give unknown people the benefit of the doubt. We base our responses on the information the op gives us. According to her, her nephew took a girl home after ten minutes because she watches movies. There is no reason to doubt her or her story. I don't get your point because you don't have a point.

mame1

Thu, Jul 27 2017, 10:01 pm

mommy3b2c wrote:

Maybe you should start giving people the benefit of the doubt. Maybe that is a problem. It doesn't have to be made up. We don't have any facts- that's the truth. We don't have anybody that was there and witnessed what happened. We have a secondhand story that we have added to. Somebody also added that the girl rushed home to do her hair and makeup...did that somehow become part of the scenario? And you accused me of being this boy's mother and raising a horrible son. If I can't look at it from a different perspective then facts should not be added by others. No?

At least my benefit of the doubt isn't hurting anybody or calling anybody names.

mommy3b2c

Thu, Jul 27 2017, 10:08 pm

mame1 wrote:

Oy vey.

amother

Blue

Thu, Jul 27 2017, 10:22 pm

I would have been very insulted if a boy did this to me. I had dates where within the first 5 minutes, we could tell we were not compatible. The boy usually tried to be polite about it and ended it within a couple of hours. I appreciated that he didn't want to waste either of our time. But to just go home 10 minutes in is insulting, regardless of the reason.

Last edited by amother on Fri, Jul 05 2019, 11:13 am; edited 1 time in total

MagentaYenta

Thu, Jul 27 2017, 10:24 pm

mame1 wrote:

If you have difficulty in accepting that individuals have differing opinions perhaps the internet isn't a good place for you. Just something to think about.

mame1

Thu, Jul 27 2017, 10:34 pm

MagentaYenta wrote:

If you have difficulty in accepting that individuals have differing opinions perhaps the internet isn't a good place for you. Just something to think about.

I don't know what you're trying to say. I don't belong on the internet? Are you kicking me off the internet? I'm pretty sure the internet is a place to voice your opinion, and I seem to have one.

All this because I'm not willing to join the bandwagon in calling some presumably young boy vile names? I certainly don't revel in the fact that some boy is going to be shunned and never get a date again. I feel bad for the kid and I feel bad for his mother, and I hope she doesn't come on this website and see this.

Since I'm the only one that offered a differing opinion and I was called out as being the boy's mother and as raising a horrible son, I feel like it's not me that has difficulty in accepting other people's opinions. I accept that it might have happened like op said. If that's the case, then I accept that the boy could have been wrong. I also accept that it could have been an amicable, mutual rejection.

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