Saying amen | Imamother

tigerwife

Sun, Jul 30 2017, 1:38 pm

amother wrote:

Hashem yirachem! Hundreds of generations of Jews have lived and died without knowing about this mitzvah.

Like I said, if you want to say amen, go to shul.

If these parties aren't to feed a female need, why aren't men making them too?

What on earth? Do you not respond with "amen" when you hear a brocha, inside of shul or outside? Do you not encourage your children to say their brachos out loud so that another person can complete it with "amen"?

What does this have to do with feminism? Do men not say amen to brachos?

The reason these parties are all- women is because of gender segregation, not female empowerment.

I am still confused as to why someone would think it's strange to have an opportunity to do many mitzvos in one sitting, regardless whether decrees "are being ripped up" or not.

etky

Sun, Jul 30 2017, 1:54 pm

tigerwife wrote:

I can only speak from my own experience and from the literature that I have read about the phenomena of seudot amen and hafrashat challah sessions. They are all about female bonding and carving out an all-female space within a religious context. Not feminism, or even female 'empowerment' in the feminist sense- rather a space apart from the men within which women can socialize, be the main actors, 'run the show' and fill with religious content that is valuable to them. Sometimes there will be a female speaker and/or singing and dancing. Often the seuda is conducted as a segula for a refuah for a relative or friend or for a zivug. It's a spiritual 'girls night out'.

amother

Honeydew

Sun, Jul 30 2017, 3:36 pm

tigerwife wrote:

I say amen to brachos.

When women create a ritual in which they artificially eat so they can say brachos, they are doing something that's new and reflective of a need for spirituality.

Why stop at amen? Why not go from house to house building railings on the roof so you can do the mitzvah of maakeh? It saves lives directly. Why not separate teruma and maaser together if you live in Israel? Why not kasher ovens in a group?

Again, if it makes you feel good, fine. Just recognize the novelty and ask what was lacking that inspired this change.

marina

Sun, Jul 30 2017, 8:16 pm

amother wrote:

so here it comes up again - the big F - FEMINISM.
By some people, feminism seems to be associated with everything in life - from the simple to the serious, - what/how u choose to eat, act, to doing mitzvos to_________ fill in the blank.

So a Amen party has become a feminine ritual. Or a woman's need to show her femininity. or a gathering of females to do mitzvos belonging to woman.

It doesn't seem like that for some people, a mitzvah or anything can be done anymore simply for the sake of the mitzvah or the deed done. it has to have feminine explanations and translation attached to it for it to be logical.

.

I know you feel the same way about women who wear tefillin, right? It's just about the mitzvah for her and no need to tie it to the big F, right?

SpottedBanana

Sun, Jul 30 2017, 8:20 pm

marina wrote:

I know you feel the same way about women who wear tefillin, right? It's just about the mitzvah for her and no need to tie it to the big F, right?

Women wearing tefillin is assur according to the Rema and other major halachic authorities. Nothing to compare. If you'd like to compare this to a woman wearing a tallis in the privacy of her own home (to prevent the yuhara issue of wearing it in shul), go right ahead, though you'd be ignoring thousands of years of mesorah of women saying amein to each other's brachos but not wearing talleisim.

crust

Sun, Jul 30 2017, 8:57 pm

amother wrote:

RIDICULOUS Rolling Eyes

What did I say that it was so ridiculous?
Btw, Rebbetzin Miesels is one of my favorites. I listen to her speech alot. I was warmed up to say amen with more kavana since listening.

If I feel that women organizing parties and groups for challah are looking for action, it might be my own opinion, true. Perhaps even a wrong opinion, true. But still Not a 'ridiculous opinion' mamish.

amother

Maroon

Mon, Jul 31 2017, 12:10 am

Come on. seriously.
Yes. I Believe in umein, and the power it possesses. Do you always see your prayers answered when you Daven? no but you believe Hashem listens to every word.
I believe in the power of umein. Am I checking how many decrees are being torn? NO.
Am I making umein parties, the answer would be no to that too. But, I don't think there's anything to make fun of, or to call it feministic... they are definitely getting zechusim.
And yes anytime you hear a bracha say umein. how hard is to say the 3 letter word?
And we cant fathom the impact it has in shumayim.

amother

Honeydew

Mon, Jul 31 2017, 2:16 am

amother wrote:

But their grandmothers didn't make amen parties, and their husbands still don't. Which makes the amen party a contemporary female innovation. Can we agree on that?

PinkFridge

Mon, Jul 31 2017, 7:33 am

amother wrote:

But their grandmothers didn't make amen parties, and their husbands still don't. Which makes the amen party a contemporary female innovation. Can we agree on that?

Yes, and chadash assur min haTorah. Right? (Do I insert an eyeroll, or not?)
Personally, I don't get the animus, or dislike, here. Maybe because I never heard anyone say that all your gezeiros will be ripped up at any brachos party I went to, just discussion about what amein means, and appreciation for the zechuyos accrued, if being done as a zechus for someone.

And I think we can assume that when someone goes to a brachos party they are hungry so no brachos will be levatala.

amother

Honeydew

Mon, Jul 31 2017, 7:36 am

PinkFridge wrote:

No animus or dislike, just an observation that this is a new grassroots practice that comes from women in the community.

crust

Mon, Jul 31 2017, 9:38 am

Iymnok wrote:

Some ladies will go to a shiur for a spiritual uplift, some like lighter or more hands on or involved, so these challah bakes and seudas ameinim is great for them.
Do what uplifts your Neshama and let others nourish their own.

True.

amother

Honeydew

Mon, Jul 31 2017, 10:27 am

PinkFridge wrote:

Not that there's anything wrong with that Very Happy

I'm ok with religious life developing, as long as we don't pretend at the same time that we are the true guardians of an unchanging mesorah. It's very interesting that people here and in real life (and that's why I've gone amother, because I do talk about this in real life), when asked whether this is a new practice, will always turn the conversation to the benefits of saying amen.

crust

Mon, Jul 31 2017, 11:15 am

amother wrote:

In one sentence, can you explain your objection to this?

tigerwife

Mon, Jul 31 2017, 11:24 am

etky wrote:

Maybe I am not familiar with the amen parties everyone is talking about here. I haven't participated in one since school and sometimes on shabbos we have all the neighborhood kids say tehillim and make brachos out loud- girls and boys. I was responding to the comment who made it sound like amen is something new and save your amens for shul.

But from what you describe, I honestly see nothing wrong with it. Men automatically gather in shul together three times a day. Why can't women do the same and gather together to do a mitzva? This has nothing to do with modern feminism. I'm not sure what people take issue with here, as long as it's not forced upon anyone.

etky

Mon, Jul 31 2017, 12:13 pm

amother wrote:

The way I see it, this trend falls under the label of 'folk religion' and by its very nature is extra-halachic and non-obligatory. Folk practices and rituals come and go. I don't see them as being part of a mesorah- just as halachically neutral embellishments that arise from a spiritual or social need. Those to whom it speaks, partake. Those who don't see the point are under no obligation to join in. There may be social pressure to attend but that's a different story.