Ds asks how do we know...

amother

Powderblue

Sun, Sep 17 2017, 10:35 pm

Yesterday my 11 year old ds asks me, "Eema I have been thinking about this a lot, how do we know Judaism is the right religion?"
ok- so yeh- I talk about emunah and I talk about how Judaism came before all of the other religions. I talk about the miracles that happen everyday(he says but couldn't that just be nature?) etc. A scary question to hear since there is no answer, What would you have said?

Boca00

Sun, Sep 17 2017, 10:49 pm

Why do you think there is no answer?? There are so many answers.

We're the only religion that claims the Torah was received in front of all the ppl, the other religions dont dare try that as they wouldnt get away with it... The fact that this story was passed down for generations with noone denying the thousands of ppl who were there means something.

Your answer abt other religions being based off ours is a good one as well, even they don't deny we got the Torah.

You can listen to shiurim from Rabbi Mechanic and others for more.

amother

Puce

Sun, Sep 17 2017, 10:49 pm

I honestly wouldn't know how to answer that, because I have this question myself. Most of us are religious because this is how we where bought up & this is what we know.
So if you ever find out a good answer please share it.

amother

Powderblue

Sun, Sep 17 2017, 10:58 pm

sequoia wrote:

Isn't Zoroastrianism older?

Could be, but he has never heard of that so I did not bring it up.
The reason why this is so hard is because there is no tangible proof. You have to believe that Hashem gave us the Torah. One could sau maybe it was some group of people from thousands of years ago that made this up and we have kept it going. Christians and Muslims believe the way they do because of faith etc. How do we know yashka did not really come back to life or Mohamed did not hear from god. We can say the things they do and believe sound wacky, but we do plenty of wacky thinks- look at the "stringed capes" and black boxes men wear during davening. Obviously we do this because we believe in the Torah. It is all Emunah. If not it is pretty wacky seeing a bunch of grown men shaking in their capes muttering to themselves with black boxes on their heads and arms.

Boca00

Sun, Sep 17 2017, 11:03 pm

amother wrote:

So if me and a hundred friends made up a story about THREE MILLION people getting a Revelation, you think people would fall for that? The sheer numbers would be our failing, it would be proclaimed FAKE NEWS in a day.

Ashrei

Sun, Sep 17 2017, 11:05 pm

Rabbi Dr. Lawrence Kelemen:
Permission to Believe
Permission to Receive

(2 books)

You can read those books to him. They are AMAZING.

Sometimes, without even knowing the answer, but knowing there ARE answers - many of them, many great ones - is what they need to hear.

Here's what I would say:

"First of all, I am so very proud of you for asking that question! It shows that you are a thinking person, and it's good to ask questions! That's how we learn. Well done.

Second, I want you to know that many Jews have asked that question, and even harder ones, before you. And there are so many answers. And if you look for the answers, and keep asking, you'll find all of them, imyh."

Those books will give nice, solid reasons. But notice the books names. In the end, our faith is something we "feel," not something we "know." We feel it through our personal connection to HKBH and the klal, which, with Hashem's help, your son will learn and develop, or already has been.

But like we feel hot or cold because that's the reality of the weather, we also feel Hashem's presence and the light of His Torah because that's simply reality.

I hope that makes sense!

amother

Hotpink

Sun, Sep 17 2017, 11:07 pm

Difficult question to answer because there is no real proof. I'm pretty sure the people who believe they have 100% proof never read up on the many problems with the proofs. In a way, I wish I hadn't. It would be much easier thinking everything made perfect sense.

chestnut

Sun, Sep 17 2017, 11:16 pm

Boca00 wrote:

NOW it wouldn't be possible, with internet, etc. Back then ppl in a different region didn't know what was happening elsewhere

amother

Purple

Mon, Sep 18 2017, 1:31 am

I try to weave discussions about emunah into everyday conversations.

For me, a lot of this comes from nature and science. I believe that only Hashem could have created our world, in all its complexity and mystery and beauty, and I try to bring that into discussions with dc where relevant. Museum trips, parks, the beach, rain, snow, hurricanes, etc.

OP, interesting to me that your ds said that miracles are "just" science. To me, all of science is a miracle.

I would also acknowledge that your ds is right; there is no absolute answer. Hashem created the world as it is, with no black and white proof of anything, because this is meant to be our challenge.

These questions and uncertainties are the meaning of Olam Hazeh.

When moshiach comes, things will be clear.

I also try to talk about Hashem in general, in the sense of appreciating the small, good things that we have. (Thank you Hashem for finding me a parking spot when I was running late, for a working washing machine, for giving me the ability to buy our groceries, etc.)

LovesHashem

Mon, Sep 18 2017, 3:27 am

amother wrote:

Nothing in life has 100 percent proof. When you get married there's no 100 percent one-off this guy is for you and not an axe murderer.

Another point. People in many States and places are given the death penalty and "compelling evidence" with no actual proof.

Life is scary.

In all of the classes I've been to at AISH they always say they cannot give proof. They can try and give lots of evidence. I've never had anyone say they can PROVE Judiasm is 100 percent true. I've heard people give evidence and theories why it's probable. And at the end of the day, we never make decisions in life (especially the big ones) on proof. You never know what will happen, yet we don't live in fear and worry, and we are confident in who we marry, where we send our kids to school, etc. (Or at least we try to be)

Last edited by LovesHashem on Mon, Sep 18 2017, 4:49 am; edited 1 time in total

LovesHashem

Mon, Sep 18 2017, 4:47 am

MrsDash wrote:

We don't *know* that Judaism is truth. We believe it to be. Just have an open conversation with your kid. Be honest.

I Know Judiasm is the truth. Please speak for yourself.
I know in the context, just like I know my husband is not a murderer. Could he be hiding it from me? Sure. Is it probable? Not really.

amother

Hotpink

Mon, Sep 18 2017, 7:16 am

LovesHashem wrote:

I Know Judiasm is the truth. Please speak for yourself.
I know in the context, just like I know my husband is not a murderer. Could he be hiding it from me? Sure. Is it probable? Not really.

I don't think it's reasonable to say as you did one post earlier, that nothing is 100%, and there's no absolute proof, and then say in the post I'm quoting that you KNOW Judaism is the truth. You're taking both sides of the argument. I KNOW that water boils at a certain temperature. It's been tested and therefore I know the information we have is accurate. We do not have anywhere near that level of proof with Judaism. Therefore I agree with your previous post that we don't really know, and it's faith based.

Ruchel

Mon, Sep 18 2017, 7:28 am

I would list all the Jewish nobel prizes, scientists... that believed. I would list all our iluim too.
As my mom (lite MO, not fanatic) says, it just READS like the truth. And how did such a small people and culture not only survive but flourish despite all odds if there isn't a being rooting for it? I have felt the kedusha for myself in certain places and certain people. I've seen open miracles when I didn't believe it would happen.
In the end, maybe I'm wrong, but what are the odds all those are wrong?

LovesHashem

Mon, Sep 18 2017, 7:39 am

amother wrote:

Yes but a judge can say "I know he did it" based on overwhelming evidence and not proof.
I can say that I know something. People say things like "I knew he was the right man for me" "I knew he was my bashert" "I know this is the best school for my daughter".

In THIS CONTEXT I do "know".

amother

Blush

Mon, Sep 18 2017, 8:04 am

Proof doesn't guarantee results. The generation that saw kriyas yam suf and maamad har Sinai - overt proofs which we'll never see - did the chet haegel and listened to the meraglim. So don't bother with finding just the right proof. Admit that we're believers. Our job is to do the mitzvos.