How do people live on income that qualifies for benefits?

amother

Pearl

Tue, Oct 03 2017, 7:05 pm

amother wrote:

I have been trying to understand this for a long time. Maybe someone can explain it to me. Supposedly there are families in Brooklyn who survive because they get benefits and pay little tuition because of tuition discounts for those in chinuch. I have seen people post on here that "they get benefits and tuition discount" as if that explains how certain families are making it.

But it seems to me that the income necessary to qualify for benefits is so low that it is not possible to support a family on that amount, even with the benefits and minimal tuition. How do people do it?

For example, according to income eligibility guidelines I found on NYS website, a family of 5 must earn a max of $37,416 before taxes to qualify for SNAP (food stamps) and the maximum allotment per month for a family that size is $760/month, which comes to approx 9K/year. Let's say this family has 2 boys and 1 girl and the father is a rebbe in the school the boys attend and they get free tuition (though it doesn't necessarily always work out like that), and that they get a generous scholarship for their girl and pay only 2K for her. And let's say they qualify for Medicaid and pay nothing for health insurance or copays (though I think Medicaid eligibility is even lower income).

Their income is about 37.5K (to qualify for SNAP) + 9K SNAP benefit = 46.5K.
Minus 2K tuition and let's say 5K taxes = 39.5K.

How are they supporting a family of 5 on less than 40K in Brooklyn where rent will be minimally 2K, probably more, even with that number being after tuition and taxes?

You are forgetting that they may declare welfare and have vouchers that pay for tuition. So they are left with the building fees only

amother

Pearl

Tue, Oct 03 2017, 7:34 pm

amother wrote:

Could you please explain the vouchers. I have never heard of that in N.Y. Thanks.

sorry I don't know details, but most playgroups in boropark only want vouchers which is around 750 a month. I hope you find out the info as many people only manage with vouchers.

I'm the poor middle class. Make too much for health insurance, pay almost 1000 a month just for insurance but not enough to save up very much because paying tuition, no food stamps WIC Medicaid or housing help. Lots and lots of taxes to help pay for other's lifestyle choice. Live in small basement apartment to be able to be financially independent. If I ever date voice my opinion I am told that I am crazy for working etc. People have suggested to me how to help me qualify and that I should only work a few hrs a day so I can be eligible.

MagentaYenta

Tue, Oct 03 2017, 8:11 pm

amother wrote:

I'm not in NY but this has been mentioned a number of times. The vouchers you are referring to are for childcare, they are not educational vouchers.

33055

Tue, Oct 03 2017, 10:04 pm

amother wrote:

The way a lot of Rebbeim live is that their income is considered parsonage which makes it that lot of their income isnt counted for Medicaid eligibility the part of income that is considered parsonage does not count as income as it isn't part of the MAGI. They still arent living the good life financially but without paying for health insurance and minimal taxes it makes it more feasible. Hope this is helpful.

Their income is counted for Medicaid.

It is income. It is only exempt from income tax. You are responsible for fica and Medicaid tax. You also don't get the employer contribution.

amother

Purple

Tue, Oct 03 2017, 10:14 pm

Just to clarify for people who this applies to.( Obviously feel free to clarify by calling up Medicaid itself or by speaking to Yeled Vyalda or LRRC. ) The part of the income that is considered parsonage ( assuming the parsonage was done correctly) does not apply towards the MAGI and therefore doesn't count towards the income limit set up by Medicaid guidelines. For example a Rebbe bringing in a salary of 50k and has parsonage income of 20k will be considered that his income is 30k for the MAGI.
(Im not getting involved in a back and forth about this ...this info can easily be verified online...Im just posting to help anyone who this applies to.) Chag Sameach! Very Happy

amother

Ivory

Tue, Oct 03 2017, 10:18 pm

amother wrote:

$1000 a month for insurance? Isnt this very much for Poor middle class?
I have upper middle class bil, very straightforward every penny on books who pays minimal amount for insurance. Nothing near to what you are paying.

amother

Cerise

Tue, Oct 03 2017, 10:47 pm

amother wrote:

I am not the person who posted about paying 1000 for insurance, but that is probably common among the poor middle class. Anyone can get child health plus in NY but the premiums are based on income and family size so many pay in the range of $60-$200 per month even with a modest income. And that doesn't cover the parents. You need a much lower income to qualify for really cheap coverage for adults. My employer doesn't pay into my insurance costs at all, and people on the plan offered through my employer (as a payroll deduction) pay at least $1000/month for a couple, and probably also have a high deductible.

I think perhaps people with a really large family can get a significant subsidy through the marketplace based on income and family size, but otherwise people who make a middle class income are often paying a lot for insurance at least for the adults.

amother

Burgundy

Tue, Oct 03 2017, 11:01 pm

My families monthly income is 1600, we are a family of 4. We have fs, wic and medicaid (bh). No vouchers, section 8, childcare etc. Its very hard. There's no money to buy what we need, and I had to reach out to my in-laws to help us out with the rent. I just went back to school since the place Id worked for declared bankruptcy so that I have better job opportunities in the future. Without the food stamps, we wouldn't survive, but this isn't the ideal way to live. We are in survival mode, as are most people receiving these benefits. It's not a position I want to be in long term, but since I am in this position, thank god for benefits. So the people that say ppl receiving benefits are lucky; they're right and wrong. We are not lucky to be in this situation. But we're lucky to live in a time and place where our government lends assistance to those in need.

amother

Lavender

Tue, Oct 03 2017, 11:25 pm

I lived there with benefits in the past when DH was in school and am currently living without benefits except that my kids are still on CHP because it's good for a year even after you disqualify, and their year isn't up yet.

It was hard.
We received medicaid and food stamps but not section 8 or anything.

We paid 50% tuition for one child and lucked out with a relatively inexpensive daycare/preschool for the other child so it was just a little more than the tuition kid. Now both are in school and I'm still paying 50% tuition because I'm not much richer now, just on paper less qualified!

We lived (still do) in a teeny tiny apartment that is smaller than what most people would call small. Like you wouldn't believe. Tiny. Still not cheap because NY but fits better in a food stamp budget than a larger apartment that would have been far more expensive (because there didn't seem to be anything in between.)

I almost never bought anything new for myself. Thought twice before throwing away worn-out socks.

Did a lot of hand-me-downs for the kids. B"H had nice friends with kids a little older than mine. Never used a gemach. If I needed anything new I waited until Children's Place or something had it on sale.

Never spent a dime on any vacations or stuff like that. Visited museums on free admissions days and enjoyed public parks. Needed an unlimited metrocard to get to and from work, and that was my way to get everywhere. Used babysitters only once in a very long while such as to attend half of a close friend's simcha.

Not having any copays for doctors or medications was huge. Didn't realize just how huge until I graduated.

Careful shopping can make food stamps stretch quite far. We were also a cute young family who got invited out for many yomim tovim. And for a big portion of our food stamp years we were on WIC as well. WIC+food stamps can cover a frugal food budget quite nicely. I never had to pay for lunch because my kids got free from school and I got free lunch as part of my work.

What else was there? I don't remember. It wasn't horrible. It definitely wasn't a rich or carefree or luxurious experience but I didn't feel destitute. However it was definitely not a long term thing. I'm not sure how long I could have kept it up. Eventually kids age out of WIC, need more than just hand-me-downs, can't be stuffed into a one-small-bedroom apartment... so I'm just reporting on how I made it work for me but beyond that I can't say.

Mommyg8

Tue, Oct 03 2017, 11:52 pm

amother wrote:

I'm so sorry that I hurt you with my post. I should have been more clear so as not to be misunderstood. Actually, I do not believe that people are liars or cheaters. In fact I hesitated to post because I was afraid people would respond by saying that people manage like that because they are cheating. I can't believe that that is the only explanation (or that that explanation is even true at all).

I am rather asking because:
A) I am a single mother struggling to make ends meet (I posted on the family of 6 in Flatbush thread but didn't want to hijack it and anyway had this question long before that thread) and I do not qualify for any benefits except child health plus for my kids which I pay into. I am not managing on my income without benefits, and I also don't know how I would manage on an income that would qualify me for benefits, even with the benefits. I thought maybe others know something that I don't since I must be missing something here.

B) I can't stand reading posts where people make it as if those in chinuch who get "benefiits and tuition discounts" are living the good life. I was trying to point out (though I guess I didn't do a very good job) that those who qualify for benefits must still be struggling mightily if they make little enough to qualify.

If you are working for a non-profit, there are certain tax benefits as far as tuition. Most yeshivos and frum schools know these rules, so if you work there, you can ask them.

Shoshana37

Wed, Oct 04 2017, 12:53 am

I remember when I was making 20 years ago 25k I just had my son and was getting Wic program that's all I was eligible for. I have gotten a raise 2k and has recertification and the wic lady told me I wasn't eligible anymore. I cried my heart out begging I really really needed it cause my salary wasn't not enough and my husband wasn't working then. My paycheck was only covering our rent and $200 for food.
I cried for days and when I stopped I promised to never never go back and beg for government help or assistance. Yes we end up owing over 40k on credit cards after 5 years and bh Hashem loves us and he helped us to manage.
Now we make 100k in household of 6 and life is in Brooklyn is just very expensive. Big chunk of our pay check goes to obama care 😬 So that's why 100k no longer considered middle class.