S/O of rich: Mo' money, mo' problems?

amother

Rose

Mon, Nov 20 2017, 11:01 pm

Squishy wrote:

You can't take a tax deduction that way.

The person who gave me money for my daughter must be a real tzadik. He gave me for the sake of giving. He gave even if he did not get a tax deduction for it.

pause

Mon, Nov 20 2017, 11:02 pm

Squishy wrote:

You can't take a tax deduction that way.

So what?

I know of a building that was donated to a school on condition that the donor would remain completely anonymous. Till today nobody knows whose credit this building is, and it's been many years since.

People who are serious about tzedaka b'tzinah find ways to do so. The gemara writes about a couple who jumped into a hot oven to avoid being seen whilst giving charity.

Zehava

Mon, Nov 20 2017, 11:02 pm

I know plenty people, my dh included, who give money without getting tax deductions.

33055

Mon, Nov 20 2017, 11:07 pm

amother wrote:

How about if just one person knows about it and it's kept confidential?

If the person is a one man show, it might work.

amother

Rose

Mon, Nov 20 2017, 11:10 pm

Squishy wrote:

If the person is a one man show, it might work.

Just sign a contract that if one person finds out they have to give you back the money. And have them sign it. Promise no one will find out.

doodlesmom

Mon, Nov 20 2017, 11:11 pm

I guess constantly worrying if your rich cover will be blown is also stressful to all those anonymous benefactors. Smile

33055

Mon, Nov 20 2017, 11:12 pm

amother wrote:

The person who gave me money for my daughter must be a real tzadik. He gave me for the sake of giving. He gave even if he did not get a tax deduction for it.

How do you know that he didn't get a tax deduction?

You wrote, "I received an anonymous donation from someone to help me with my disabled child. No idea from whom. There was a middleman."

The deductions did not equal the gift. It is just a present to uncle sam not to take a deduction available. It doesn't show you are a tzadik; it shows you are not sophisticated.

Personally, I rather my money goes to Yidden than to pay more taxes than I am required to pay.

amother

Rose

Mon, Nov 20 2017, 11:13 pm

doodlesmom wrote:

I guess constantly worrying if your rich cover will be blown is also stressful to all those anonymous benefactors. Smile

That's if you want a tax deduction...
Everyone has stress. I personally would rather have that kind of stress.

amother

Rose

Mon, Nov 20 2017, 11:17 pm

Squishy wrote:

I know because I didn't give him any receipt that he gave me money. I got a check from someone. Didn't go through a tzedakah organization or gmach (but that's also an idea, there are plenty tzedakah organizations that would agree to be the middleman and give you a tax deduction.) Don't remember what name said on the check. Could be was just initials.

Boca00

Mon, Nov 20 2017, 11:18 pm

I have a question- Everyone who says "mo' money, mo' problems'', do you enter the lottery? If someone offered you a lot of money (inheritance, huge raise) would you take it??

33055

Mon, Nov 20 2017, 11:19 pm

pause wrote:

Because you don't know doesn't mean that others don't know?

How is it even possible to transfer a building anonymously? You need a grantor on a deed. If the owner held title in a company, perhaps he did it with shares, but even then there is a trail at least within the administration. Somewhere there was a deduction available.

amother

Rose

Mon, Nov 20 2017, 11:25 pm

Squishy wrote:

So whoever really needed to know, knows. But you see they were able to keep it from the public.

33055

Mon, Nov 20 2017, 11:28 pm

Zehava wrote:

I know plenty people, my dh included, who give money without getting tax deductions.

You husband is entitled to take the deduction on his taxes if the money is given to a qualified organization. Why not take it if available? It doesn't take away from the mitzvah. It's just smart practice.

My husband doesn't get a receipt when he gives cash at shul. We know pretty much how much he gives yearly. I know how much I give to tzedukah on Friday nights. It adds up.

Remember that you only get a fraction back of what you give, so not one is giving to get deductions.

pause

Mon, Nov 20 2017, 11:28 pm

Squishy wrote:

If there would be word on the street, I would know.

He didn't own the building. He donated the full amount of money needed for the construction of the building.

Zehava

Mon, Nov 20 2017, 11:35 pm

Squishy wrote:

Much of the money is given directly to people. Not everyone has a congregation in their name.

33055

Mon, Nov 20 2017, 11:39 pm

pause wrote:

If there would be word on the street, I would know.

He didn't own the building. He donated the full amount of money needed for the construction of the building.

How? Was it bags of cash?

If he moved the money through banks, gemachs, wire transfers, he would have left a trail. You really have no way of knowing what the admin of the school or the gemach knows. You really have no way of knowing if he didn't take a deduction for this.

33055

Mon, Nov 20 2017, 11:49 pm

Zehava wrote:

Much of the money is given directly to people. Not everyone has a congregation in their name.

I also give gifts of money directly. It is difficult not to. I tried to do it through organizations, but I found the money wasn't going where it was supposed to, so I don't fault your DH.

One day, I would love to have an organization where I could give directed gifts and get a deduction.

amother

Rose

Tue, Nov 21 2017, 12:16 am

Squishy wrote:

I also give gifts of money directly. It is difficult not to. I tried to do it through organizations, but I found the money wasn't going where it was supposed to, so I don't fault your DH.
One day, I would love to have an organization where I could give directed gifts and get a deduction.

My old boss, who is rich, has his own non profit organization, all his donations go directly out of that bank account. I was his bookkeeper so I took care of his money. All you need to do is find a competent accountant that can open a non profit organization for you. You donate all money to that organization. That organization has a bank account. You write checks from that bank account directly to people.

amother

Slateblue

Tue, Nov 21 2017, 12:16 am

I dont know everyone's story, but I will add mine briefly. I grew up in a wealthy home. my father was working for a business that was making a lot of money when I was growing up. it was a difficult industry, and profits were a lot about reading the market properly, and making sure you never lost a customer.

he did however bring home a lot of money. going to israel for succos was a "must". florida for a week at some point was a given, unless we were going somewhere nicer. the fanciest bungalow colonies & sleepaway camps for the wife and kids were obvious. we had a large house with multiple cars, always late model.

unfortunately this came at a price. he worked very long hours. we lived in spring valley, and he worked in the city. he often did not come home until after 9 at night, this was very normal. he also left to catch the bus early in the morning. when I was a child, this meant I did not see him sometimes during the week at all. shabbos was not even all that better, as he usually fell fast asleep by the main course. us children, and there were a bunch, fought to say our "parsha sheets" during the fish course so we could catch him awake, as once mom went in to serve the soup all bets were off. shabbos day was little better, and his nap was sacred. I was never bothered by this as a child. it was my "normal". I could go on but you get the idea.

in addition I recall my parents not really talking alot, because my father was very high-strung. he was always anxious, and therefore always on edge. talking to him always seemed, idk, just not the most pleasant activity. we did enjoy the good life I guess, and so I guess it made up for it for my mother? the few times I ever heard my parents talking, and I mean really talking not just pleasantries, the conversations always seemed tense and hurried. also, the few times I ever heard him talk about business he always complained how his industry was saturated with competition, and the business was so cutthroat, and everyone did not realize how low the profit margins were, and he had to work so hard to make the money he was making, and how if he stopped it would all fall apart and we would be left with nothing.

then one day when I was in around 6th or 7th grade, tragedy struck. one of the partners in my fathers business had a heart attack. (everyone agreed it was stress, but who really knows). unfortunately, a lot of the business (remember this was "way back when") was not on paper, but in this partner's head. he jealously guarded many of the businesses secrets, including the locations of some of the companies money that was "his" and the phone numbers of "his" clients, "his" secret suppliers, etc. suffice it to say the company was thrown into chaos, and soon after collapsed. my father became an old man in the short span of a few years as he desperately tried to keep up what our family was used too.

after that, he told us that we would not be able to go away that year for succos. he was so broken about it. his attitude affected us kids, and we were all nervous about "what would be" I vividly remember. but guess what! the older boys helped build a succah, much to their delight, and "daddy" took a day off (from doing nothing but running around to try and find what to do) to help them, much to their delight!I still remember that succos, and how we were all surprised at how normal it was. I think we were all expecting some kind of disaster.

after that, following the advice of a rav, my father took a job that was low pay and demeaning, so he could pay, with difficulty, the mortgage and (now discounted) tuitions. this job had less hours. my father started being home in the evenings. he started being present with our family. he would go out for a shiur every night at 8 pm for an hour, and then again for an hour before shacharis. as far as I can recall, my relationship with my father began in 9th grade. before that I had virtually nothing to do with him. all of the sudden he was part of my life, and I loved it. and my family thrived. we had no more trips. no more bungalow. no more nice cars. no more fanciest clothes in the class. but we did get a father. (I am not saying everyone has to make that trade. I guess some people get to have it all, idk. does anybody really get to have it all? what do we know. even if yes, I am not jealous of them). and I loved it.

eventually my father got older, we all got married, and he gave up. he sold the house, and used the money to buy a small 2-bedroom apartment in florida, in a frum community. he and my mother live there full time. I have NEVER in my life seen my mother so happy. they spend time together, and they both have things they do. my father goes to several shiurim everyday, and my mother has tons of friends and tehillim groups, etc. sometimes, if tickets are really cheap, they hop on a plane to come visit. they live off the few good investments my father had made, that he did not have to sell when his kids got married, which provide them with enough so they can be retired, but not more.

anyways, I lived on both sides of the rich/poor coin. and I can tell you, I definitely preferred poor. I guess that does not prove anything, but I thought it was relevant.

amother

Seafoam

Tue, Nov 21 2017, 12:37 am

Squishy wrote:

I assume he gave through a private foundation.