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Forum
-> Children's Health
simba
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 Tue, Nov 21 2017, 12:32 pm
I am hearing a neighbor of mine screaming at her kids and quite often hitting them violently.
She screams for 20 minutes and very scary things. This morning it was loud enough to wake me. Then there were some loud bangs and the kid was crying for an hour.
I held my finger on the phone ready to call 911.. I was scared she would hurt the kid.
BH I grew up in a peaceful home and am traumatized by this.
Is there a normal amount of screaming and a child getting hit? I am not scared of calling authorities I just don't know if I am over-reacting.
Please enlighten me into this terrible and scary world 
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amother
Mistyrose
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Tue, Nov 21 2017, 12:34 pm
| simba wrote: | I am hearing a neighbor of mine screaming at her kids and quite often hitting them violently.
She screams for 20 minutes and very scary things. This morning it was loud enough to wake me. Then there were some loud bangs and the kid was crying for an hour.
I held my finger on the phone ready to call 911.. I was scared she would hurt the kid.
BH I grew up in a peaceful home and am traumatized by this.
Is there a normal amount of screaming and a child getting hit? I am not scared of calling authorities I just don't know if I am over-reacting.
Please enlighten me into this terrible and scary world |
it really matters what "hitting them violently" means. At face value, that sounds like abuse.
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amother
Orange
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Tue, Nov 21 2017, 12:35 pm
I'm thinking back to being that kid.
If there was someone who had the courage to call, they would have changed my life.
Even if the investigation turns out that everything is good, the parents will hopefully be scared into changing a bit.
The fear of them becoming worse, I believe is just a fear. Because, if they become worse, it's just a phone call...
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simba
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Tue, Nov 21 2017, 12:36 pm
| amother wrote: | | it really matters what "hitting them violently" means. At face value, that sounds like abuse. |
I cannot see it. I only hear it.
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Simple1
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Tue, Nov 21 2017, 12:36 pm
How can you hear someone being hit? The bangs can be from the kids throwing things.
Maybe call her up to shmooze and offer to watch some of the kids to make it easier for her, if this is something you are up to doing. If you are really concerned, and don't have proof of violence, maybe you can call a family services organization (Ohel? or something like that?)
Last edited by Simple1 on Tue, Nov 21 2017, 12:39 pm; edited 1 time in total
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allthingsblue
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Tue, Nov 21 2017, 12:38 pm
| Simple1 wrote: | How can you hear someone being hit? The bangs can be from the kids throwing things.
Maybe call her up to shmooze and offer to watch some of the kids to make it easier for her, if this is something you are up to. |
This is nice but not really a good answer. It's not going to solve this woman and her children's problems.
Simba, I think you need to consult with a mental health professional or a rabbi with experience in these matters.
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amother
Lemon
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Tue, Nov 21 2017, 12:38 pm
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simba
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Tue, Nov 21 2017, 12:40 pm
| allthingsblue wrote: | This is nice but not really a good answer. It's not going to solve this woman and her children's problems.
Simba, I think you need to consult with a mental health professional or a rabbi with experience in these matters. |
Would love to consult with someone. Any suggestions or phone numbers?
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Simple1
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Tue, Nov 21 2017, 12:40 pm
| allthingsblue wrote: | This is nice but not really a good answer. It's not going to solve this woman and her children's problems.
Simba, I think you need to consult with a mental health professional or a rabbi with experience in these matters. |
I edited my post. Maybe she can call a family services organization for advice.
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allthingsblue
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Tue, Nov 21 2017, 12:40 pm
| simba wrote: | | Would love to consult with someone. Any suggestions or phone numbers? |
pm me
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simba
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Tue, Nov 21 2017, 1:20 pm
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Anyone have contact info for R. Yakov Horowitz?
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allthingsblue
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Tue, Nov 21 2017, 1:43 pm
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Try the contact info listed on kosherjewishparenting.com
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BasMelech120
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Tue, Nov 21 2017, 1:57 pm
Do not let this just slide by. You are in a position to save a child from horrible abuse and pain. The child seemingly has already suffered, but you are in a position to help. You are an accomplice to the crime if you know about it and do not intervene. If you yourself are not a mental health professional, please reach out to one. They will help you with making the report.
If you are thinking about 'halacha' or 'lashon hora' or 'not being moser' --- it does not apply in a situation of pikuach nefesh.
A child's life is at stake.
Do not take it lightly.
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simba
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Tue, Nov 21 2017, 1:59 pm
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Update. I spoke to a Rav and An organization that told me I must report. I called and reported. Was shaking the whole time. Hashem please have mercy on them.
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amother
Chartreuse
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Tue, Nov 21 2017, 2:02 pm
| simba wrote: | | Update. I spoke to a Rav and An organization that told me I must report. I called and reported. Was shaking the whole time. Hashem please have mercy on them. |
You did the right thing!!
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allthingsblue
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Tue, Nov 21 2017, 2:04 pm
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You are very brave. Kol Yisroel areivim zeh lazeh. You did the right thing!
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amother
Periwinkle
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Tue, Nov 21 2017, 2:04 pm
This post stirs up such a sadness in me. There is no easy answer. Clearly, a family is in distress. Less clear is how to support them. Govt often comes in like a bull in a china store. Govt often enough does more harm than good.
I have an idea. Please bear with me. I would go to this family. I would knock on their door. I would say that they are at risk of being reported to the govt. I would say I'm there to offer an alternative. I would have a chat with the parents to find out what sort of support they need. Removing a child should be a last resort. Only a govt has the power to do that over parental objections. So a call to the govt can be made if it seems that's the direction needed.
Suppose the mom says she's overwhelmed. Can I offer her the support she needs? Money is required.
Imagine if instead of calling the govt we call a local hotline. A frum heartfelt woman comes to the overwhelmed mother's home, listens to her, takes note of what is leading the mother to behave cruelly to her child, then enlists the help of willing gevirim to fund any therapy or cleaning help or whatever is needed.
Mother can be interchanged with father.
I would be willing to be part of a team that receives the calls from people who find themselves in simba's shoes, and I would be willing to make those hone visits. The parents may or may not be willing to let me in or speak with me, but they would be on notice that we as a community will not stand by when we suspect a child is being treated cruelly, and that we would call in the govt if we felt it was the only way to protect their child.
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allthingsblue
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Tue, Nov 21 2017, 2:07 pm
| amother wrote: | This post stirs up such a sadness in me. There is no easy answer. Clearly, a family is in distress. Less clear is how to support them. Govt often comes in like a bull in a china store. Govt often enough does more harm than good.
I have an idea. Please bear with me. I would go to this family. I would knock on their door. I would say that they are at risk of being reported to the govt. I would say I'm there to offer an alternative. I would have a chat with the parents to find out what sort of support they need. Removing a child should be a last resort. Only a govt has the power to do that over parental objections. So a call to the govt can be made if it seems that's the direction needed.
Suppose the mom says she's overwhelmed. Can I offer her the support she needs? Money is required.
Imagine if instead of calling the govt we call a local hotline. A frum heartfelt woman comes to the overwhelmed mother's home, listens to her, takes note of what is leading the mother to behave cruelly to her child, then enlists the help of willing gevirim to fund any therapy or cleaning help or whatever is needed.
Mother can be interchanged with father.
I would be willing to be part of a team that receives the calls from people who find themselves in simba's shoes, and I would be willing to make those hone visits. The parents may or may not be willing to let me in or speak with me, but they would be on notice that we as a community will not stand by when we suspect a child is being treated cruelly, and that we would call in the govt if we felt it was the only way to protect their child. |
Op already spoke with a rav and followed advice to report.
If only the world were so simple and abusive people would be so open to change...
Even if therapy or other solutions can help remedy the situation, it's cruel to allow the children to suffer for the long months/years until actual change occurs.
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simba
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Tue, Nov 21 2017, 2:12 pm
| amother wrote: | This post stirs up such a sadness in me. There is no easy answer. Clearly, a family is in distress. Less clear is how to support them. Govt often comes in like a bull in a china store. Govt often enough does more harm than good.
I have an idea. Please bear with me. I would go to this family. I would knock on their door. I would say that they are at risk of being reported to the govt. I would say I'm there to offer an alternative. I would have a chat with the parents to find out what sort of support they need. Removing a child should be a last resort. Only a govt has the power to do that over parental objections. So a call to the govt can be made if it seems that's the direction needed.
Suppose the mom says she's overwhelmed. Can I offer her the support she needs? Money is required.
Imagine if instead of calling the govt we call a local hotline. A frum heartfelt woman comes to the overwhelmed mother's home, listens to her, takes note of what is leading the mother to behave cruelly to her child, then enlists the help of willing gevirim to fund any therapy or cleaning help or whatever is needed.
Mother can be interchanged with father.
I would be willing to be part of a team that receives the calls from people who find themselves in simba's shoes, and I would be willing to make those hone visits. The parents may or may not be willing to let me in or speak with me, but they would be on notice that we as a community will not stand by when we suspect a child is being treated cruelly, and that we would call in the govt if we felt it was the only way to protect their child. |
I was holding the phone this morning ready to call 911 and was happy to hear the child crying cause that meant she was alive. It is too much responsibility for me to bear. What if Ch'v the child got hurt or was killed and good and nice me was thinking of ways to help. Maybe a visit from the mean non jews will wake her up to get the help she needs.
I feel terrible about it, don't get me wrong, I just cant carry the weight. I am still shaking.
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