Will President Trump PLEASE stop Tweeting...

33055

Thu, Nov 30 2017, 1:48 pm

southernbubby wrote:

When I used to be on Facebook, those who hated Obama sent out memes of Obama as a monkey, a donkey, etc. so that has been going on since the Obama administration. Maybe it has become more widespread with Trump since it is unusual for a man his age to have blond hair. Trump has also mocked other people such as calling a Latina former pageant winner Miss Piggy and Miss Housekeeping. The mocking of a handicapped reporter seems to be debatable with supporters saying that he wasn't mocking the reporter and detractors saying that he was.

The problem with tweeting anything that appears to smear any group is the following:

1) there was evidence that the Britain First video was a misrepresentation and the facts in it had not been verified

2) such propaganda has been used in the past against Jews

3) Muslims have dangerous groups and fringe elements but most Muslims in America just want to live their lives (although there are members of ISIS in Dearborn, MI).

4)In the name of diplomacy, POTUS should not be sending out messages that could damage diplomatic relationships

5)It looks very unprofessional to simply tweet anything he wants. The military did not ask him to tweet that transgenders could no longer serve. That caused quite a stir because there are ways to properly inform the public if the military makes that decision.

6)If he is such a diplomat, the first place to start is with the press. The press has always been trusted in the past to impart news to the people. If they are not allowed to function as the press has always functioned, they will be hostile.

7)Does showing the public scary videos about Muslims actually do anything to prevent Muslim violence?

8)Is the public that watches those videos simply going to retweet them all over the place and put them on Facebook or are they going to demand that Muslims not be allowed into the US? If they do demand that, is that fair to Muslims who would never harm anyone. I have met some Muslims, who were quite friendly and I don't hide my religion, particularly if I am with grandchildren wearing yarmulkas and tzitzis. There is a current Ami article about a Muslim who loves Israel. Why should we go out of our way to alienate them and make enemies?

Lets say your questions are about EY?

Is it fair to the innocent friendly Palestinians who are nice to people wearing tzittzis and yarmulkes to have boarder controls?

I met a lovely Palestinian family in Aruba. They were very nice to us. Now let's let have all Palestinians have the same access as Israelis because we don't want to hurt anyone's feelings protecting people's lives.

I rather keep the worst Muslims out of the US of it means we are safer. Do we have to the same problems Europe has before we open our eyes?

southernbubby

Thu, Nov 30 2017, 2:14 pm

Squishy wrote:

Islam is a religion that embraces a number of types of people, just like,l'havdil, Judaism does. Palestinians are a nation of Muslims that live in a particular place. There is a difference between a nation and a religion. We are the nation of Israel but while we are saying that, we are talking about a people who embrace a belief while when we say the the State of Israel we are talking about a secular entity.

So that is the question that all Americans have, is it better to put all Muslims in one category and keep them all out as though all are evil, or is it preferable to acknowledge that some Muslims want to be part of our society, contribute to arts and sciences, and serve our country? Since there are already many Muslims living in America peacefully and organized Muslim violence is not breaking out all over America on a regular basis, there is room to restrict immigration but not to outlaw it entirely.

And as far as Palestinians go, I think that some have permission to work in Israel but correct me if I am wrong about that. Those who simply want to work and live and let live, I think are given the opportunity to do that. There are plenty of Arabs in Israel and most of them simply live their daily lives and leave the Jews alone. Many work in Israel's hospitals and particularly on Shabbos, when we need non-Jews, they are on hand to help out.

SixOfWands

Thu, Nov 30 2017, 2:30 pm

southernbubby wrote:

More than three million refugees have arrived in the US since the 1970s, but there is not a single instance of any refugee committing a fatal terror attacks on U.S. soil since then.

Before Trump took office, the refugee vetting system now took anywhere from 16 to 36 months, and included screenings from the Department of Homeland Security, the Department of Defense, State Department, the National Counterterrorism Center, FBI, and the U.S. Intelligence Community.

Was it perfect? No. Nothing is.

33055

Thu, Nov 30 2017, 4:36 pm

southernbubby wrote:

At the same token can't we acknowledge there are dangersous Islamic terrorists. Can we also acknowledge there are certain members of that religion who do not follow the rules of society - that raping and groping of women is seen differently?

When it reaches the point that Americans' behavior has to change like it does in Europe because of these animals who do not follow the rules, it will be too late. You can't send them back. We don't need to import Europe type problems here.

I am all for any immigration system like Canada's where immigrants who are good for Canada are welcome. We need to end the ridiculous lottery and chain migration. We need to end chain migration because it is not good for the US and rewards fraud.

We also need a system that spreads the burden of the immigrants across the nation instead of unfairly over taxing certain municipalities. I don't want to pay extra tax money to support the immigrants who come here and are immediately entitled to services.

SixOfWands

Thu, Nov 30 2017, 4:45 pm

Squishy wrote:

We also need a system that spreads the burden of the immigrants across the nation instead of unfairly over taxing certain municipalities. I don't want to pay extra tax money to support the immigrants who come here and are immediately entitled to services.

What services do you believe that green card holders are immediately entitled to?

SSI -- five years in the U.S. and credit for 40 "quarters" of work

TANF -- five years in US for most states; some also required 40 quarters of work

SNAP -- if over 18, only after 40 quarters of work

Full Medicaid -- five years in US for most states; some also required 40 quarters of work

CHIP -- permanent resident for five years, and be a child under 21 AND live in a state that provides Full-Scope Medicaid to permanent residents, or be pregnant AND live in a state that provides Full-Scope Medicaid to permanent residents

Green card holders can get Section 8 housing.

33055

Thu, Nov 30 2017, 4:56 pm

SixOfWands wrote:

Wrong!

southernbubby

Thu, Nov 30 2017, 5:36 pm

Squishy wrote:

Congressmen are also guilty of groping women so I am not sure that immigration affects that. Does Canada automatically keep out Muslims? How do they know who is good and who is not? According to this article Muslims are a rapidly growing demographic in Canada;
https://globalnews.ca/news/320.....2036/

Here is an article my a political conservative who is apparently a Trump critic rather than a Trump supporter. He basically sees Trumps tweets as chipping away at his ability to govern and at the Republican party's ability to hold on to the House:http://www.nationalreview.com/article/454217/donald-trump-tweets-gaffes-not-harmless?utm_source=Sailthru&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=NR%20Daily%20Monday%20through%20Friday%202017-11-30&utm_term=NR5PM%20Actives.

Read this because it basically says that these tweets are slowly reducing any respect that anyone has for the man, despite a Dow of 24,000 and possible tax reform and health care reform. People are so caught up with his outrageous tweets that they forget the accomplishments that he is achieving.

Fox

Thu, Nov 30 2017, 6:25 pm

southernbubby wrote:

So that is the question that all Americans have, is it better to put all Muslims in one category and keep them all out as though all are evil, or is it preferable to acknowledge that some Muslims want to be part of our society, contribute to arts and sciences, and serve our country? Since there are already many Muslims living in America peacefully and organized Muslim violence is not breaking out all over America on a regular basis, there is room to restrict immigration but not to outlaw it entirely.

In theory, this makes perfect sense. In practice, it's a little more complicated.

The biggest problem is that a core tenet of Islam is destroying or converting infidels and installing sharia as the law of the land -- whatever land they happen to live in. This isn't "radical" Islam -- this is pretty normative Islam, despite efforts by so-called moderate Muslims to obfuscate the fact. While Jews may yearn for Moshiach, when they will live under halacha, I don't know of anything that would require everyone else to do so, let alone threatening them with conversion or death in order to achieve the goal. Nor is there anything in the Torah that suggests "Judaizing" the rest of the world.

So while obviously some Muslims are less interested in political Islam than others, it's impossible to separate the political components from the religion itself -- they're completely entwined.

Because of this, it is impossible to police the political aspects of Islam without policing the entire religion. No one wants government inspectors going into mosques to check out whether people are being urged to overthrow the existing government. But that's what would be necessary, in one form or another, to prevent political Islam from being taught and promoted.

As Britain's experience has shown, curbing the political ambitions of Islam is not necessarily about refugees; it appeals to second-generation immigrants and converts far more than to first-generation immigrants.

But the biggest mindset we have to get past is the one that Muslims are "just like us" in their goals and values. Some may indeed have similar values to the rest of American society, but it is naive to suggest that good jobs, good schools, nice homes in the suburbs, an occasional vacation, and pleasant neighbors will be all it takes to neutralize the political aspects of Islam.

southernbubby

Thu, Nov 30 2017, 6:49 pm

Fox wrote:

But the reality and the facts on the ground, are that Muslims have been living in the US for quite awhile, probably more than a century, and have not managed to turn the US into a Caliphate. I am aware that they would love for the country to be under sharia law but unless the average American stops having kids, that is unlikely to happen.

Evangelical Christians also would like for their religion to be the law of the land, although they seem to have a much less harsh religion. I live only a few miles from Dearborn and we have not had any problems with Muslims here. I am not saying that I love Muslims, seek out Muslims or have Muslim friends but when Jews sought asylum from the Nazis (yemach sh'mo), we were not given an easy time about coming into the US and many Jews died as a result.

And it is interesting to note that Saudi Arabia, where the 9/11 attackers originated from, is not on the list of countries that can't immigrate. Why, because of Trump's business interests there, I assume but more importantly, Saudi Arabia is cooperating with vetting and Saudi Arabia and Trump are on the same side against Iran. So how much safer are we if we keep out immigrants from Chad? Chad is fighting terrorism but is lacking in vetting procedures, but I never see Chad in the news that they are in kehutz with ISIS.

Last edited by southernbubby on Thu, Nov 30 2017, 7:33 pm; edited 1 time in total

southernbubby

Thu, Nov 30 2017, 8:08 pm

Fox wrote:

What factors differentiate Deaborn, in your opinion, from the European experience that has deteriorated into "no-go zones" in some cases?

My husband said it is because they have been living in Dearborn for 100 years. They are Americans and not immigrants. They came here for their slice of the American dream. Possibly, they didn't rot in DP camps for several years either. There are nice homes, thriving businesses, decent schools, etc and their lives are good here. Some of the Muslim population live in West Bloomfield which is a wealthy neighborhood but those are the frei or Reform Muslims who are Muslim in name only and wouldn't want Sharia law here because they want freedom from all the rules of the religion. I sat next to one of those on a Spirit air flight home from LGA. She had come to a Hillary event with her BFF who was Jewish. She saw me with my tehillim and decided to tell me that she was a Muslim (she didn't dress at all Muslim) and that it was really a normal religion and only crazy people joined terrorist groups.

youngishbear

Thu, Nov 30 2017, 8:20 pm

southernbubby wrote:

I think in time Islam as a whole will mellow, through young people's exposure to western living. Even Catholicism is not what it was; just look at their liberal pope.

The cynical question is, will the changes happen before the fanatics kill us/each other in religious frenzy or after?...

southernbubby

Thu, Nov 30 2017, 8:44 pm

youngishbear wrote:

It doesn't look like the ones who come to America come for any other reason but to just live their lives. There apparently are ISIS supporters in Dearborn but no one in my neighborhood lives in fear of them. Usually most people just want to have a good life and are not willing to blow themselves up for an ideal. Those folks in Dearbornistan have their own halal McDonalds. What could be better than that?

33055

Thu, Nov 30 2017, 9:43 pm

SixOfWands wrote:

In my county they get immediate medical and dental treatment. If they say they can't afford the copay, it is waived. It is so generous, we have medical/dental tourism. Come here on vacation and get your teeth fixed for free. No residency requirements. Nor is proof of poverty required. They take everyone's word they can't pay. I know illegal immigrant men making the prevailing wage. They get free services.

The kids get Medicaid, free school, free breakfast and lunch.

There are also programs founded by Johnson to empower the poor. I used to volunteer at a branch in a different county. They never asked immigration status. They provided job training, day care services, assistance with housing expenses like fuel or insulation among their programs. Since there isn't infinate resources, our citizens should get preference.

The illegal immigrants also use municipal resources disproportionately to the property taxes paid on their housing. (They squeeze in more families than the CO allows. Sometimes, they sleep in shifts). One person doesn't make a difference, but a whole sanctuary city sitting on the shoulders of a largely residental county hurts financially.

Sewerage, garbage, roads, food banks, Medicaid, clinics all cost money to run. Someone is paying for the freeloaders. My big complaint is that it is me.

If the US doesn't want to stop the illegal immigrants, then they should distribute the cost of providing for them nationally.