Did you raise your cleaning lady?

amother

Seagreen

Sun, Jan 14 2018, 8:52 am

amother wrote:

And how will they prove how much you paid them if they are paid in cash?

Would you stand under oath and say you didn’t employ the person at all?

A person paying cash, taking a position not to make payroll deductions, still needs to provide evidence of payment (a pay slip).

If we are having a conversation about breaking the law as an employer already - additional discussion about the applicability of minimum wage is kind of moot.

thunderstorm

Sun, Jan 14 2018, 9:03 am

There's an article in the New York Post that people are cutting minimum waged employees hours because it's having a negative effect on the employers. My DH said there was a discussion about this in shul this week and a few husbands are having their wives cut the cleaning lady's hours because of the increase. They simply can't afford it.
I noticed that the groceries just increased the delivery charge to the customers because they have to pay their delivery guys more now. Sounds like a small amount of money but for employers this is a huge burden and it's having a domino effect , falling onto the consumers. Basically the only people benefitting are the minimum wage earners.

amother

Seagreen

Sun, Jan 14 2018, 9:10 am

Bizzydizzymommy wrote:

Basically the only people benefitting are the minimum wage earners.

Well the argument is that they aren’t.

It’s meant to benefit min wage earners, and those earning close to that, ( who else would it benefit? ) but in reality their employers can’t afford it so hours, or other benefits are cut to pay for it. So no one is better off.

WhatFor

Sun, Jan 14 2018, 9:12 am

Bizzydizzymommy wrote:

Well yes. That's precisely who minimum wage laws are supposed to serve. And if employers cannot afford to pay employees minimum wage then they simply cannot afford them.

unexpected

Sun, Jan 14 2018, 9:23 am

I don't see myself as an employer, rather I am a homemaker who pays for a service. My cleaning lady comes for around 6 hours. She has specific chores that she needs to accomplish and then she leaves. She always gets paid the same 70$. (She has never once stayed over time to finish her work. However, she has rushed through them in order to leave early)
I don't employ her nearly enough to consider her an employee. If I was dealing with an agency, and getting a different woman each week, this would be an even stronger argument.

amother

Seagreen

Sun, Jan 14 2018, 9:34 am

unexpected wrote:

So what if she said - madam I’m now charging you $75 for my service. WWYD?

amother

Maroon

Sun, Jan 14 2018, 10:56 am

unexpected wrote:

So why do you pay in full if she leaves early?
I don't want to be called a racist but unfortunately this behavior happens often. We pay full price for mediocre work and often get gypped on the hours. Yet we are the only ones who have to be afraid of the law.

unexpected

Sun, Jan 14 2018, 11:04 am

amother wrote:

I don't like when she leaves early but I also don't like when she stretches out the hours just so I can pay her more. I feel like I give her 6 hours worth of work (based on the amount she did when I first hired her and she wanted to make a good impression) and if they get done, then I pay her without making an issue of the hours. When I see her cutting corners, I.e., not changing the water when washing the floors, dumping the laundry in all the wrong drawers etc then I remind her what needs to be done. When she stops listening to my reminders, then I start looking for a new lady...

amother

Seagreen

Sun, Jan 14 2018, 1:21 pm

amother wrote:

So back to original question. Did you raise your lady this month to meet minimum wage requirement if you were paying less?

If you initially hired someone and were paying min wage at the time - the number didn’t come from thin air - the person working would rightly assume she’s going to get more - and if she’s too embarrassed or otherwise scared to ask - it’s really on the ‘employer’ to pay it. IMHO.

amother

Seagreen

Sun, Jan 14 2018, 1:24 pm

unexpected wrote:

Sounds reasonable.

Amarante

Sun, Jan 14 2018, 1:29 pm

I'm in Los Angeles where minimum wage is not as high as New York City but of course I pay at least the minimum wage and I would raise proportionately for a worker who was receiving the minimum wage prior to the raise since if they deserved to pay paid a certain amount above minimum wage prior to the raise, they still deserve the differential after the raise.

I can't deal with a justification that someone can't afford to pay a legal wage - let alone a wage that is a "living wage". What amount are we talking about that people are claiming they can't afford - $10 a week? And if someone is employing someone full time (I.e. 40 hours), certainly the employer should be in an economic position to pay a living wage. And all the twisting that someone isn't really an employee or is being paid off the books or they can take it or leave it because they are the ones accepting the wages - it's all just justification for economic exploitation of people who are generally not powerful and or generally desperate - no one cleans someone else's toilets given the choice of an easier better paying job.

I don't feel comfortable exploiting people who are in a bad economic situation. If someone isn't working out, hire someone else. But for the most part, I've found that if you treat people as you would want to be treated and not try to exploit them and squeeze out the last dime from them, there will be a mutually respectful relationship.

unexpected

Sun, Jan 14 2018, 2:19 pm

Amarante wrote:

my cleaning lady lives in a two bedroom apt with her husband and daughter and daughters boyfriend as well. All four of them are working full time and being paid in cash. Their rent comes from the government and the daughter and boyfriend went through the public school on taxpayers' dime. They have food stamps and Medicaid and HEAP to take care of their most basic needs. So excuse me if I don't feel bad for her and give her a raise that she doesn't deserve. She probably has more money in her bank account than I do.

tichellady

Sun, Jan 14 2018, 3:16 pm

unexpected wrote:

You sounds very unhappy with your own lot and you seem to think you know a lot about your cleaning lady’s life and how perfect it is . I hope things get better for you.

unexpected

Sun, Jan 14 2018, 10:46 pm

BH I am quite happy with my set up in life. I know about my cleaning lady because she likes to talk and I am a nice person so I listen to her. I have no issues with how she manipulates the system to make it work for her but I refuse to believe that I am exploiting her. She is getting paid the going rate for the work that she does and no one is forcing her to do it. I understand the concept of minimum wage for someone who is working on the books, but someone who gets paid in cash, avoids paying taxes and lives off programs that the rest of us are paying for is exploiting the system and not the other way around.

amother

Seagreen

Sun, Jan 14 2018, 10:50 pm

unexpected wrote:

what books? You pay her $70 a week and you don't run a business. You're not doing anything wrong, other than not giving her a receipt.