S/o do you respect classy/wealthy people more?

Zehava

Mon, Feb 05 2018, 11:14 am

I’ve seen this attitude in secular as well as Frum society. Class being equated with wealth, after all it seems only wealthy people have the means to dress classy enough and have classy homes/mansions.
So do you respect those people more? Would you deal with them over others?

amother

Cerulean

Mon, Feb 05 2018, 11:17 am

Not really. Although I prefer ppl of real wealth to wannabees who obsess over stupid details so they'll look the part.

But I mostly respect ppl who have dedicated their lives to a lofty ideal or people who use their talents in a constructive way or ppl who go about their lives with dignity and calm. Money doesn't really figure into it.

leah233

Mon, Feb 05 2018, 11:21 am

It depends on how they act to others. If a wealthy person is generous and has no airs about themselves then I respect them more.

If they are ostentatious and snobby then I respect them less.

Zehava

Mon, Feb 05 2018, 11:23 am

leah233 wrote:

It depends on how they act to others. If a wealthy person is generous and has no airs about themselves then yes I respect them more.

If they are ostentatious and snobby then I respect them less.

Some people would call snobbery and airs class

flowerpower

Mon, Feb 05 2018, 11:25 am

I respect people that are NICE and kind to others. Not by how much $ is in the bank or how big their house is. Sometimes money comes with acting classy and sometimes it comes with acting arrogant. You can also be classy and poor. Not always does it go hand in hand.

youngishbear

Mon, Feb 05 2018, 11:27 am

The wealthy people I respect are the ones who are down-to-earth and never act as if their higher economic level means anything.

The examples I am thinking of are the ones I didn't know were wealthy until I was told. That's when my respect for them went up. Not because of their wealth, but because they didn't let it change them in any way.

lavenderchimes

Mon, Feb 05 2018, 11:31 am

No. I do not care who is fancy or has more money or a bigger house. I like people for who they are. Or are not. lol if anything, I am biased towards those who live frugally:)

iammom

Mon, Feb 05 2018, 11:31 am

I don't respect them more but I'll admit I'm intimidated by them.

keym

Mon, Feb 05 2018, 11:36 am

And who here thinks our esteemed president is classy or has class. Hes certainly wealthy enough but I dont think even his biggest supporters think he has any class.

Kiwi13

Mon, Feb 05 2018, 11:43 am

I respect “classy” over “wealthy.” And I don’t mean the kind of classy that entails eating with a napkin in your lap or whatever other random (in my opinion irrelevant) points of etiquette. The classy I respect is the kind where people are careful about how they talk - avoiding lashon hara, not exaggerating, not using foul language, not avoiding difficult subjects but approaching them using delicate and gentle phrasing. Dressing nicely within your means, not in a keeping up with the joneses way, but in a way of showing self respect. You get the idea. I’m not great with these things myself, but I strive to be, and I respect people who are already there where I want to be.

Fox

Mon, Feb 05 2018, 11:44 am

I don't equate class and wealth at all.

In fact, in many cases, I see that wealth can be a hindrance to developing class and taste. When you have plenty of money, it's very easy to spend it without giving much thought to what you're buying. Likewise, ill-mannered behavior is likely to be excused or at least overlooked if enough money is flowing.

Miri7

Mon, Feb 05 2018, 11:52 am

I respect everyone, but you earn “extra” respect by your behavior. You can also lose my respect by bad behavior.

Blessing1

Mon, Feb 05 2018, 12:07 pm

I respect people that are nice, kind, friendly & not selfish. I respect people that are happy & not braggy. Money doesn't earn one respect.

FranticFrummie

Mon, Feb 05 2018, 12:15 pm

All the above comments, YES.

Class is behavior. (American description, not British.)
Wealth is income.

Sadly, one does not guarantee the other.

I actually respect a lot more people who are in the lower income bracket, because they behave with strength and dignity in the face of challenges.

ETA: In the British "class system", there are high status people who are FAR from classy. I guess it just depends on how you describe things.

Chayalle

Mon, Feb 05 2018, 12:18 pm

youngishbear wrote:

I grew up as family friends with such a family. Wealthy as in they had a foundation to take care of the family's charitable contributions, there's a plaque from them on many yeshivas, etc...but I never knew, till years later, that they were wealthy. They lived in a regular house, and they shopped in the regular stores and lived a standard middle-class lifestyle.

I don't know many people like them, TTYTT.

ETA must've clicked on anon by mistake - no reason to go amother here so I've un-clicked.

amother

Blonde

Mon, Feb 05 2018, 1:05 pm

You asked so I answer. No I don't like dealing with them. It shows how they have an attitude and I can't stand people with attitudes

Chayalle

Mon, Feb 05 2018, 1:09 pm

amother blonde - I have met wealthy individuals who have the most unassuming attitudes, and are totally good and kind...and I've met people with not much $$$ to their names, with "attitudes". And vice versa.

I love dealing with nice people. Period.

dancingqueen

Mon, Feb 05 2018, 1:22 pm

Zehava wrote:

I don’t know about frum society, but historically class was associated with wealth because the poorer classes didn’t have the time money or inclination to waste time on etiquette and manners. With the industrial revolution and the birth of upwards mobility wealth became more accessible to more people who weren’t born into it. But old money always looks down on the nouveau riche with their mega mansions who didn’t have the same level of manners and class. As they say money can’t buy class.

So basically the point is the money =/ class.

allthingsblue

Mon, Feb 05 2018, 1:27 pm

The people I respect most in this world are not necessarily wealthy, though some are. Most are people who do a lot of indiscriminate chesed.
I am intimidated by wealthy people, but I don't necessarily respect wealthy people. I've met a lot of wealthy people who have engaged in disrespectable behaviors.
I may admire their beautiful homes/clothing, but that's not respect.
Wealthy people do get a lot of attention, but is it flattery disguised as respect, or actual respect?

Fox

Mon, Feb 05 2018, 1:28 pm

One of the problems is that we have very little exposure to "old money" virtues in the frum veldt.

Unfortunately, much of the Jewish wealth in Europe was linked to assimilation, and even much of that was wiped out during the Holocaust. The families of early German-Jewish immigrants to the U.S. who found success in large retailing ventures have long since assimilated.

Much of what we consider "wealth" in the frum community is from the late 80s and 90s. We simply haven't had a lot of experience at behaving like rich people, by which I mean dealing with issues like how to raise children under such circumstances; how to pass along wealth to subsequent generations; how and what to spend our money on; how to maintain a kehilla with mulitiple economic tiers, etc.

So people with money -- even modestly affluent people -- don't have a lot of guidance or many role models. As a result, it's easier for vendors to sell them goods or services that they may truly not need or even want. It's tough to determine what will make kids spoiled and what won't. The line between justifiable comfort and over-the-top indulgence gets blurred.

People believe it won't happen to them. They're sure that money won't change them. But that's impossible because the challenges are different. People have to change. Unfortunately, people who would pound on the rav's door to check if a chicken is kosher would never think to sit down with the rav or someone else to discuss how to mindfully handle their wealth.

In fact, even suggesting that people should be mindful about their wealth is apparently controversial. I once wrote about it on Imamother, mentioning that there's a whole industry in Silicon Valley to help newly-minted millionaires think through the role of wealth in their lives. One Imamother was so upset at the prospect of frum people doing something similar that she literally followed me around for about a month, making snarky comments about it on different threads. People would get confused, and someone would always have to say, "Oh, she's still talking about something Fox said a month ago."

But if we're going to successfully handle the increased aggregate wealth of our communities, we're going to have strip away the emotions and start talking about how to use our money rather than letting it use us.