S/o do you respect classy/wealthy people more?

FranticFrummie

Mon, Feb 05 2018, 1:29 pm

Maybe the question isn't "do you respect", but rather "are you intimidated"?

Money is power, and power is intimidating. If "class" is defined by high social status, then that is also intimidating.

If someone is in a higher position of power than you are, they can potentially do things that may harm you. It's natural to be intimidated by that.

What you have to remember, is that we are all just people. We are all created equal in the eyes of Hashem. As long as we remember that, we are immune from intimidation, because it's ALL from Hashem.

(If that doesn't work, imagine them in in the bathroom. Everyone poops! Wink

)

amother

Turquoise

Mon, Feb 05 2018, 1:29 pm

youngishbear wrote:

The wealthy people I respect are the ones who are down-to-earth and never act as if their higher economic level means anything.

The examples I am thinking of are the ones I didn't know were wealthy until I was told. That's when my respect for them went up. Not because of their wealth, but because they didn't let it change them in any way.

Its difficult not to let wealth affect you.

DS4 has a friend whose parents are very wealthy. And, yes, they are "different," not because they are snobs, but because they want their kids to enjoy the benefits of their wealth. So they vacation regularly in Europe, and the kids participate in the type of enrichment programs I can only dream of. It doesn't make them bad people, but it does make them different. And I would not expect otherwise. Just because me kids need to work summers doesn't mean that their kids shouldn't be learning about conservation in the rain forest.

DD2 also has a very wealthy friend. Think trust fund baby who could, theoretically, never work a day in her life. The parents are lovely. But again, their lives are different because of the things they don't need to worry about, or consider.

agreer

Mon, Feb 05 2018, 1:32 pm

dancingqueen wrote:

I don’t know about frum society, but historically class was associated with wealth because the poorer classes didn’t have the time money or inclination to waste time on etiquette and manners. With the industrial revolution and the birth of upwards mobility wealth became more accessible to more people who weren’t born into it. But old money always looks down on the nouveau riche with their mega mansions who didn’t have the same level of manners and class. As they say money can’t buy class.

So basically the point is the money =/ class.

Totally agree with this. I do respect classy people, regardless of their wealth status.

I know many wealthy people whose manners are sorely lacking. They treat poorer people with disdain. I do not respect them.

I know people from very simple backgrounds who are beyond classy - elegant, articulate, dress well, etc. I very much respect them because they are nice to everyone.

amother

Slategray

Mon, Feb 05 2018, 1:44 pm

I grew up in a family that is wealthy, but lacking class, and basic emotional and other survival skills.

As I am healing from my childhood scars, I'm noticing that class is very important to me, in the people I surround myself with. It's almost as important as emotional health.

Money doesn't intimidate me.

Money spent wisely does, because I don't have a clue as how to care for myself in the way that people who dress with class within a budget do. When I'm around someone who is dressed well, and/or has it all together, I can feel intimidated.

Mommyg8

Mon, Feb 05 2018, 2:34 pm

agreer wrote:

Dressing well costs money. And time.

SixOfWands

Mon, Feb 05 2018, 2:55 pm

Mommyg8 wrote:

Dressing well costs money. And time.

Give me enough money, and I can dress well without taking much of my time at all.

Give me enough time, I can dress well without taking much money at all.

Limit time and money, I've got an issue.

amother

Jetblack

Mon, Feb 05 2018, 6:38 pm

It just occurred to me that I come from "old money". One side of the family were very wealthy in Germany. But either they lost it fleeing the nazis, or it never trickled down to my immediate grandparents. Another great grand father was a wealthy non Jewish Industrialist. My parents are both extremely educated people who went to excellent schools and universities, but they are perhaps too educated and became respected academics, which might be classy but is not well paid, especially if you are frum and have lots of kids. So no cloth napkins in our house and there was never much emphasis on the type of nuanced table manners described in the other thread but that was likely because my parents focused on intellectual pursuits rather then social niceties. IOW my mother was too busy writing academic papers to polish the wine glasses.

There are not really many frum families who are old money in that sense.

The concept of old/new money is ridiculous in any case.

I guess I am a snob in that I respect educated people. I couldn't care less about handbags or cars but if you know what kafkaesque means, I like you already.

Boca00

Mon, Feb 05 2018, 6:55 pm

amother wrote:

I guess I am a snob in that I respect educated people. I couldn't care less about handbags or cars but if you know what kafkaesque means, I like you already.

Kafkaesque- characteristic or reminiscent of the oppressive or nightmarish qualities of Franz Kafka's fictional world.

And no, wealthy people don't intimidate me. Most people don't.

Mommyg8

Mon, Feb 05 2018, 7:19 pm

SixOfWands wrote:

Give me enough money, and I can dress well without taking much of my time at all.

Give me enough time, I can dress well without taking much money at all.

Limit time and money, I've got an issue.

So there is a value judgment against people who are short on both money and time? I.e. the working poor?

lavenderchimes

Mon, Feb 05 2018, 7:24 pm

SixOfWands wrote:

Give me enough money, and I can dress well without taking much of my time at all.

Give me enough time, I can dress well without taking much money at all.

Limit time and money, I've got an issue.

Exactly. I dress well with no money -- but I have time to hunt through thrift stores for amazing designer deals! My Mother also has time, and often finds things for me.

amother

Seafoam

Mon, Feb 05 2018, 7:30 pm

SixOfWands wrote:

Give me enough money, and I can dress well without taking much of my time at all.

Give me enough time, I can dress well without taking much money at all.

Limit time and money, I've got an issue.

agree, but look into all the 10 item wardrobe / capsule wardrobe bloggers. It definitely can be done. I kind of do it. I have very few clothes, I’m very careful about what I buy being best quality I can afford, multiseasonal, versatile - (good for wearing to work and around kids), and that lots of combos can be made from all the various pieces.

DVOM

Mon, Feb 05 2018, 8:33 pm

I respect class. I'm not sure how I feel about wealth.

My mom is the classiest woman I know. Not in the cloth napkin way, but tactful, emotionally mature, unfailingly kind, thoughtful and practical. I respect her so much.

The wealthiest woman I know is insecure and childlike in many ways. She is dependent on her very wealthy parents financially and seems to have a hard time making even small decisions without their input and approval. I care about her and like her, but I can't say I respect her. I'm sometimes jealous of her. In many ways, her life seems so easy.

Laiya

Mon, Feb 05 2018, 10:42 pm

FranticFrummie wrote:

)

I think this gets to the crux of it. We use the term class to describe someone who has an element of power over someone else, but, rather than abuse that power, chooses to act with humility.

Humility means, understanding that the brachos we have are gifts from Hashem. With this understanding, a person will be discreet, generous, and happy for others; never jealous.

That's class.

Snobs are not classy, because they lack humility. And there are all types of snobs; some types have nothing to do with money.

amother

Wine

Tue, Feb 06 2018, 12:40 am

Interesting how nearly every poster distinguishes clearly between behavior and money - all of us respect/treat well individuals with classy behavior, but deny being impressed by wealth. And yet, look around. Do you really note the same thing in your day to day life? Be honest - don't you think wealthy people get more respect? Also, isn't it easier to be classy when you're not snappish because you're hungry/worried about rent/worried about tuition/can't enjoy your own simcha because you're worried about the cost?

amother

Peach

Tue, Feb 06 2018, 1:37 am

Respect? That’s something reserved for special people whom I admire. I mayb gravitate towards them mainly because I want their business and they are more likely to give me businedd but I may also highly disrespect them. You gotta earn respect by proving you are a good person etc

Woman of Valor

Tue, Feb 06 2018, 11:21 am

I respect class but I define it as tact, depth, self-awareness, authenticity, emotional sensitivity, dignity, self-respect, assertiveness, selflessness without being a doormat etc.

With wealth -- what is there to respect? That they have money? I may respect the hard work and the creativity that led to the money but not the fact that they have money alone.

Would you respect someone who has any other G-d given gift more? Everything is in the hands of Heaven except fear of Heaven.

I agree that they are treated differently but do others truly feel an inner respect? I doubt it.

naturalmom5

Mon, Jul 16 2018, 1:59 pm

That comment about wealthy people eating in delux was the funniest thing I saw in a while. I always thought I was poor she ba poor. I live in a small place, all my furniture is from my mother ah or my inlaws who passed away long before I met my husband. All my clothing is from Gemachs or cons. shops. Its just my husband and I now , so I rarely go to a grocery store. Delux and other takeout places average 40-50 a week. ( When my son came for the month of Nissan, it cost a fortune Smile

).
Meanwhile all my neighbors who are young couples pre-children , say they can't afford to eat out, but they get 300-400 $ orders from Gourmet Glatt or Farm Fresh once or twice a month...