Author Naomi Ragen

Log in / Sign Up

List of Forums + New Post Recipe Box Usergroups Following My Posts Bookmarks

Private Messages Advanced Search Rules New User Guide FAQ Advertise Contact Us

Forum -> Hobbies, Crafts, and Collections -> Reading Room

Author Naomi Ragen

Previous 1 2 3 4 Next

View latest: 24h 48h 72h

chen

Fri, Aug 18 2006, 12:47 pm

happy2beme wrote:

Quote:

curse a blue streak

I've heard this used b4. what does it mean? thx

major, major bad language continuing at length. The language is so "hot", the air around the speaker is said to turn smoky blue.

happy2beme

Fri, Aug 18 2006, 1:25 pm

thank u!

mimsy7420

Fri, Aug 18 2006, 3:41 pm

I really enjoyed The Covenant. It was not like her first 3, which were fun reads, but portrayed the negativity in the Chareidi world a little too much for peoples liking. The ghost of Hannah Mendes was also very good.

JRKmommy

Wed, Aug 23 2006, 1:46 pm

I was reading some more on her website. If you click on the "about" button, it links to a couple of articles about her. In them, she talks about her own background a fair bit. It also mentions that she was moved to write her first book, Jephte's Daughter, after a charedi neighbour committed suicide and killed her young daughter at the same time by jumping from a building. It goes on to say that she did subsequently have second thoughts about the portrayal of charedim, and make things more positive in her second book (Sotah) as a result. She also refused to sell movie rights to Jephte's Daughter, apparently out of a concern that she didn't want viewers to see the image of a charedi man beating his wife.

So yes, she is an outspoken critic of certain things that she finds objectionable, but she wasn't intending to put down the entire community.

From her website as well, she is a passionate advocate on the whole agunah issue, and has also been an outspoken critic of abuse/corruption. Her advocacy has been noticed.

Most recently, her attention has been focused on criticism of the liberal left and of the Israeli government's treatment of settlers and handling of the Lebanon war.

BasMom

Wed, Aug 23 2006, 2:02 pm

JRKMommy, I am with you all the way! I just finished reading the Covenant, and frankly, I would read anything Ragen writes. The Covenant was hugely pro-Jewish/Frum/Israeli, and I would recommend reading the articles she has written about the matzav in Israel. She is eloquent and on target.

shabbatiscoming

Thu, Aug 24 2006, 6:32 am

I like naomi ragen's books. I dont read them to read about charedi bashing (unfortunately, living in israel, you can look in other places for that every day)

I read them because they are a good read, thats all. they are good novels, thats all. I am not reading them as an acurate characterization of the charedi or chassidish population, far from it, I read them to enjoy a enjoyable read.

and as a last note, I red danielle steel for the same reason. they are very far from reality, but I know that reading them. I read them to get away from reality a bit, just for a bit of fun and enjoyment.

Motek

Thu, Aug 24 2006, 1:15 pm

JRKmommy wrote:

From her website as well, she is a passionate advocate on the whole agunah issue, and has also been an outspoken critic of abuse/corruption. Her advocacy has been noticed.

Often, that goes along with bashing the rabbis for "not trying harder". Is that her view?

chen

Thu, Aug 24 2006, 1:40 pm

Future Naomi Ragen books:

Sowtah: frum akeres habayis is falsely accused of planting contraband e.g. marijuana, in her backyard.

Slow-tah: frum woman falsely accused of driving below the minimum speed limit

Sewtah: frum matron falsely accused of manufacturing counterfeit "designer" clothing

So?tah: frum woman accused of not caring enough

Showtah: Frum playwright falsely accused of plagiarizing from a broadway show

Snowtah: Frum married woman falsely accused of drug trafficking

Smote-ah: Frum wife falsely accused of beating husband with dictionary of medieval terms.

Motek

Thu, Aug 24 2006, 2:00 pm

let me guess - all originated by you?

chen

Thu, Aug 24 2006, 2:53 pm

Vu den?

Motek

Thu, Aug 24 2006, 4:38 pm

(translation for mystified posters:

"vu den" is yiddish for "who didya think?" or "who then" for short)

Raisin

Thu, Aug 24 2006, 6:38 pm

I have read her books and enjoy them. But some of the stuff that I know about is just plain not true. For example in Sotah, half of Dina's 12th grade class are engaged or married, and then n.r goes on to say that this also happens in other groups in the chareidi world, like belz and Ger and Lubavitch. Question

I was wondering if there is any truth whatsoever to her charming group of hooligans known as the "morals patrol"???

chen

Fri, Aug 25 2006, 10:02 am

Rifky wrote:

I was wondering if there is any truth whatsoever to her charming group of hooligans known as the "morals patrol"???

Sure is, at least in Bnei Brak. They have been known to harrass people of whom they disapprove, to the point that the people had to move out of the neighborhood.

non-conformist

Tue, Sep 05 2006, 5:54 pm

After reading one of her books (Tamar's sacrifice) I definitely think that Naomi Ragen has an agenda to promote (her main character shifts from ultra-orthodox to more "modern orthodox" as was mentioned in the thread, the balanced character is more modern too).
Nevertheless, she brings to light some real issues that DO exist in the frum world: sweeping issues under the rug, "good reputation" over all and more... (can't remember - read it a while ago). Her description of a stressed young lady on the night of the mikve was very believable, at least for me...
I find that the frum world does not know very well to accept criticism, even when it's deserved... Confused

BTW, Jrkmommy, I totally agree with what you wrote.

JRKmommy

Wed, Sep 06 2006, 10:50 am

Motek wrote:

JRKmommy wrote:

From her website as well, she is a passionate advocate on the whole agunah issue, and has also been an outspoken critic of abuse/corruption. Her advocacy has been noticed.

Often, that goes along with bashing the rabbis for "not trying harder". Is that her view?

Here is the link to her columns on her website: http://www.naomiragen.com/Coltoc.htm

As you can see, the vast majority of the columns are slamming the Israeli government and the left.

Columns discussing specific problems of abuse/corruption in the Charedi world include the 2005 columns Rachel's Story (Parts 1 and 2), the 2005 column on the beating of the suitor of the Sephardic Chief Rabbi's daughter which was arranged by her mother and brother, a 2004 article on her harassment on an Egged bus, and a 2001 article "The Hundred Rabbi's Scam".

IMHO, the things that she criticized deserve criticism, because they are a chillul Hashem and worse.

I've had a couple of personal experiences with harassment and corruption, and experienced first hand the negative effects on not only the victims, but on religious/secular relations in Israel. [This is probably a whole other thread.]

My only criticism of her columns would be to point out that secular family couts aren't always great either, especially when it comes to dealing with parental alienation and stopping spouses determined to make the life of the other one completely miserable. The difference, though, is that I tell my clients up front not to expect perfect justice, and I explain the limitations of the courts. In addition, the courts do have some coercive power, which does get used. The real point, I think, of the Rachel's Story columns and the play NR wrote is that RABBIS should have been working to make the situation better, not supporting the husband. In addition, the delays caused by lack of action by the religious authorities, coupled with the abhorance of her decision to seek help through other means (courts, publicity) ultimately led to the successful alienation of the children from the mother.

roza

Sun, Apr 29 2007, 7:03 pm

After reading the book Sotah, it got me thinking.
What if anything is being done about those men who prey on young, innocent, ignorant girls and women? Who disgrace them and then go about their life with their wife and children? These men are dangerous and their names should be publicized, just like the names of child molesters are public now after so many victims, after so many tragedies.

I personally know of the girl who was 'a mistress' to a frum married man, now I feel guilty, this evil man is out there and may be some other girls and women are falling into his clever 'halachic' preaches. I once observed him in the store, he was deliberately mingling within the crowd of women, his customers, he was touching them, it looked accidental but it was deliberate, and he was enjoying it.

I think that frum girls in seminaries and schools need to get some kind of guideness in dealing with situations like those in Sotah. It's very confusing for young girls because these men are 'frum', 'chassidim' or 'scholars', girls are trained to trust such people.

Sanguine

Tue, Sep 09 2014, 5:08 am

This is a very old thread but I saw no point in starting a new one and I wanted to talk Naomi Ragen. Years ago I read Sotah and Sacrifice of Tamar. She's a great writer, can't put down her books even though their not my usual style of reading (I like books where they kill someone on the first page). But her books really bothered my - such chareidi bashing. This was in a book that anyone can buy. Maybe didn't believe things are really like that. Maybe they are (I'm not Chareidi) but it was strange for me to read a book like that and she annoyed me.

Then I noticed she wrote a column in the Jerusalem Post which really bothered me (maybe she was anti-settlers there too. Don't remember exactly). Overall she bugged me. I suddenly put the column together with the books.

But then I read The Chain Link Fence (didn't see a review of it here). It was so different. When life is hard, the little girl gets pulled in by a Talmud Torah teacher's lessons. She brings Shabbat to the family and that brings peace to the family. I don't remember exactly what happened but it gave me a nice feeling. It was just so different than the others. I was happy to see a book where religion was a positive thing.

I loved The Covenant. It was so positive to Yishuv life (except we don't get kidnapped in general). It was nice. It showed terrorists but also good Arabs and how a Dr. who lived on a Yishuv also saved Arab's lives. Just a nice book.

So there I'm starting to like her (BTW, The Rabbi's wife was stupid and even worse was that it didn't have an ending, only possibilities).

But I just started Jephte's Daughter and I feel like - Oh no! She's at it again. Well it's not really her fault being the book is from 25 years ago. I'm tempted not to read it except she's such good writer that I can't put it down (but I had to rant about her)

grace413

Tue, Sep 09 2014, 6:06 am

I hear you. Her books are page-turners but I was very put off by the charedi-life-is-jail-but-if-you-become-MO-it's-all-peaches-and-cream.

November

Tue, Sep 09 2014, 6:19 am

Sanguine, I agree with your assessment of these different books, although I haven't read the latest ones so I can't say about those. I used to read N Ragen books because they are so enticing but it's real a guilty pleasure and I often felt yucky afterwards. I encourage you to put down Jephte's Daughter, especially given that it is Elul. In my humble opinion it would be a good exercise for your yetzer to overcome the urge to finish it. Better you should read something that draws you closer to Hashem and to His people. B'hatzlacha!

Sanguine

Tue, Sep 09 2014, 6:30 am

grace413 wrote:

I hear you. Her books are page-turners but I was very put off by the charedi-life-is-jail-but-if-you-become-MO-it's-all-peaches-and-cream.

I'm certainly not Chareidi and I might even agree with her philosophy on Chareidim but:

1- As a non-Chareidi reader (possibly not even Jewish), how do I know if Chareidi life for women is really like that or it's just fiction? For all Chareidim or certain groups? Does she take some facts and overly exaggerate to make a book?

2- Even if it's exactly like that, it's part of their Hashkafa and she has no right to blast it to the world cause it makes good reading. There are things even us MO do which would horrify non-Jews too. Even Brit Milah which there are people in the world anti harming a baby. A good book about a young mother not wanting her newborn put through this "barbaric ritual" would sell copies. Well that one is pretty publicly known but no one wants to have to justify it to a gentile. It's wrong to publicize something that the world will look poorly at

Page 3 of 4

Previous 1 2 3 4 Next