Kollel Life | Imamother

myfriends715

Mon, Jul 07 2008, 5:00 pm

we did it for abt the first 7 months after marriage.. I got married right after h.s and had no savings I was also working as a teacher in a kiruv school so my salary was almost nnone... dhs kollol paid decently but it wasnt enough to cover rent= utilities= insurance + food + extra expenses so we went into a lot of debt that we are still paying off 3 yrs later ( however, I wouldnt trade that time for the world) it was very special!

Strudel

Mon, Jul 07 2008, 5:17 pm

Aidelmom, I think that isn't fair at all. I think this thread has been positive on the whole. There was only one generalized statement that seemed, to me, anti-kollel, and that was responded to a good number of times.

Most of the answers I read seemed to say it is possible, just very difficult.[/quote]

I hope this isn't a response to my posting. We're far from being anti-kollel, we just can't manage it as we don't have an account at the Bank of Mom and Dad to help us.

Big difference.

cdawnr

Mon, Jul 07 2008, 5:51 pm

midwest wrote:

I hope this isn't a response to my posting. We're far from being anti-kollel, we just can't manage it as we don't have an account at the Bank of Mom and Dad to help us.

Big difference.[/quote]

Midwest,

I think the issue was that you said no it is impossible rather than, we did not find it possible. the difference between a generalization and a revelation of personal experience.

Smile

ora_43

Mon, Jul 07 2008, 6:24 pm

Atali wrote:

Aidelmom wrote:

I'd like to make a suggestion. Next time Op (or maybe the thread can be moved) start the thread in the Yeshivish subforum. It looks like the main forum is not the place to get the chizuk and ideas you're looking for.

But not everyone who learns in Kollel is Yeshivish.

Thanks, Atali, that's what I was thinking too... I know plenty of couples in the dati leumi (Israeli national religious) community who start their marriage with the dh in kollel (and there are some who continue in kollel beyond the first few years, although not as many as you find in the hareidi community). My dh learned for our first year but I don't think our experience is relevant here, because he was still in the IDF (hesder). Other couples we know who do the kollel thing get by because in Israel, you can rent a 2-bedroom caravan (the caravans are actually quite nice in most places I've seen) in a frum community for NIS 200-500 (about $70-$150). You hitchhike or carpool to work, or take the government subsidized buses that come to town about 3X/day. I know none of that is relevant to those living abroad, sorry.

Mama Bear

Mon, Jul 07 2008, 7:25 pm

I'm actually surprised/impressed at the kollel peopel who own cars. my dh works full time and makes a decent salary and we can't afford a car!!! not a lease not the insurance/gas/tickets/repairs... it's a HUUUUGE expense. it's cheaper to take car services for those rare times we even need a car. BH lately dh can bring home the company vehicle at night, but aside from commuting to and from work - which dh used to do via public transportation and hitches til now - we hardly use it.

sky

Mon, Jul 07 2008, 7:33 pm

I find that couples who grew up as children of kollel families are able to stay in it for much longer. They don't recieve support (their parents cannot afford it) but they are able to make do with a lot less and really do not feel like they are missing out. In the community were I live there quite a few families that I know who are like that. My brother-in-law learned for 10 years before becoming a rebbi with very little to no help. They made due with much less then I could and they are very happy.

debsters1101

Mon, Jul 07 2008, 9:11 pm

I have always been fascinated with that phenomenon- children, or grandchildren, even, of kollel couples. my husband and I are both college educated. my hubby spent about a year in kollel and would love to stay forever but then who supports the kids? (one salary is not nearly enough these days). I mean, sure you can get by with scrimping and help, but then who helps YOUR kids IYH?
(lets face it- 90% of kollel families are being supported. so who supports their kids in kollel?)

costanza

Mon, Jul 07 2008, 9:46 pm

I am glad this thread is in the public forum because I find it really interesting. I don't live a kollel life and am kind of fascinated by how those who do it actually do it.

Not as a criticism, but as an outsider looking in with questions, what does it take for a man to be accepted into any given kollel? Does he have to prove he has the ability to learn at a certain level? Does he have to show up for a certain minimum number of hours a day to qualify for a stipend? I once heard a Rebbe from the YU high school speak to a black hat crowd at a local shul, and he was adamant that most boys do not belong in kollel. They simply do not have the intellectual capability for it, similar to not all students being able to handle medical school. It is meant for the elite. Yet it is so common place nowadays.

While I admire and really can't believe how many of you are describing your financial lifestyles, I have to wonder, how long can this system survive? Who is paying school tuitions for these large families who barely get by? What will happen in retirement? I know many will answer that Hashem will provide for you. I also believe that Hashem is responsible for my lot in life, but I also believe I have to do my share.

Please don't take this as bashing - it's not. I genuinely am interested to hear your opinions.

TwinsMommy

Mon, Jul 07 2008, 10:10 pm

Do Kollel yungerleit get free tuition for their kids? Is that why so many schools are hurting for money?

Our expenses per month (our kids are young and not yet in school) are $5000 + WITHOUT school tuition so it's hard to know what we'll do when the tuition bills start rolling in but hopefully we'll be in less debt then.

Rent is $1250 ish with water, utilities (gas, electric) are $300 ish, food is $800 ish, student loan payments are $1000 ish, phone (home and cell) is $200 ish, and it goes on and on..... we certainly wouldn't be able to have hubby take off and learn full time (he'd love to though).

B'tzimtzim

Mon, Jul 07 2008, 10:17 pm

Mama Bear - It is feasible to live in Willi without a car, but not where I live, and not where many in out of town kollelim live. First of all, I need a car for work. I BH make a good salary, but it would be much harder for me, and add a lot of time to my day, to get a job that didn't require a car. And even just doing errands. Things are not down the block like they are by you - its just not feasible - no one in my community doesn't have a car - even the poorest of families.

TwinsMommy - No, kollel yungerlite do not get free tuition. They are lucky if they get a decent scholarship! Even Rebbeim who teach in the schools rarely get free tuition for their kids.

catonmylap

Tue, Jul 08 2008, 1:27 am

ora_43 wrote:

Atali wrote:

Aidelmom wrote:

But not everyone who learns in Kollel is Yeshivish.

My dh was in kollel for the first 2 years of our marriage(he also was in hesder but studying for semicha). We lived comfortably. The yeshiva gave us a very low rent on a 3 bedroom apartment, with a fridge & oven (they were originally for chutnikim but since the second intifata hit, there weren't many), plus dh got a stipend. In the second year, he did a shlichut program that paid a stipend too (though they reduced the first one). I worked full-time. We even managed to have a car (meaning we had the savings from before but we managed to pay the gas and insurance). I don't think most kollel wives can immediately work full-time. It is an advantage to be a little older and post college when you get married.

amother

Tue, Jul 08 2008, 2:03 am

My dh is still in Kollel and we are married six years already. We get tons of help from my parents but no government help. Everyone I know gets help somewhere whether it's from their parents or the government. Kollel people don't get pay full tuition, they get like $1,000 off a year which still adds up.

My dh has a friend who is married eleven years already and is still only learning full time, his fil gives him about $10,000 a month but he is a serious learner. I know that where I live people that live are in Kollel don't want to live a simpler lifestyle there are some exceptions but the majority of the kollel people want the same nice things myself included as everyone else and that's where the problem is. It used to be that people in Kollel lived on less, now we feel that we deserve the same nice stuff as people that work for it.

Ruchel

Tue, Jul 08 2008, 8:05 am

micfri wrote:

Not as a criticism, but as an outsider looking in with questions, what does it take for a man to be accepted into any given kollel? Does he have to prove he has the ability to learn at a certain level? Does he have to show up for a certain minimum number of hours a day to qualify for a stipend? I once heard a Rebbe from the YU high school speak to a black hat crowd at a local shul, and he was adamant that most boys do not belong in kollel. They simply do not have the intellectual capability for it, similar to not all students being able to handle medical school. It is meant for the elite. Yet it is so common place nowadays.

Yup. This is what is unnatural today and causes so many problems in communities. More people, smaller stipend, wife working like crazy and still poverty for many.

All the "old timers" of kollel/kollel world will say this, except those whose hashkafa say the contrary.