A CHILD MOLESTOR AMONGST US

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Forum -> Children's Health

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greenfire

Mon, Sep 14 2009, 9:06 am

these pictures should be hung up in every shul on every street corner - so that even the kids are aware to protect themselves ...

Chocoholic

Mon, Sep 14 2009, 9:09 am

aisheschayil wrote:

I heard friedlander was innocent.
just sharing what I heard.

We should stop protecting the "tzadikim", stop telling victims they lied because the men are such ehrliche menschen who never would do such thing...

amother

Mon, Sep 14 2009, 9:10 am

http://criminaljustice.state.n.....16709

http://criminaljustice.state.n.....61155

http://criminaljustice.state.n.....70977

amother

Mon, Sep 14 2009, 11:56 am

rabbi friedlander was innocent. it was in the news when he was found innocent but of course it was not as juicy so it was somewhere in a small article in the news.

amother

Mon, Sep 14 2009, 12:14 pm

amother wrote:

rabbi friedlander was innocent. it was in the news when he was found innocent but of course it was not as juicy so it was somewhere in a small article in the news.

People who are proved innocent in court are not listed on the national registry as s*s offenders.
When it comes to protecting our children, it's "GUILTY until PROVEN innocent".

gold21

Mon, Sep 14 2009, 12:46 pm

OP you certainly did the right thing. kol hakovod! nice to hear that seichel still exists, in our topsy turvy world.

smilingmom

Mon, Sep 14 2009, 8:24 pm

To the amothers who said that Friedlander, you may be confusing the facts a little.

There were two Rabbi's involved in the incidence that resulted in the charges.
The United States Attorney's office in Los Angeles dropped the complaint of abusive s-xual misconduct against Rabbi Israel Grunwald, 44, "without prejudice" -- meaning that the investigation will continue and the charge can be refiled. [not that he was found innocent]

Friedlander pleaded guilty to a felony charge , but contended that the girl (a 15 year old) had encouraged him. He served a 22-month prison term.

No court overruled or threw out the charges.

amother

Mon, Sep 14 2009, 11:52 pm

does it make a bit of sense to you that a gabbai would do this while sitting next to a choshuva rav?

the guy was innocent but bec he pled guilty he still had to sit

The rav was my nephew's mohel

gold21

Tue, Sep 15 2009, 12:04 am

does it make sense that a fifteen year old would lodge an abuse case against a random frum man for no reason? umm NO. even your nephews mohel could be a creep. yup. so, my ex-neighbor just went to jail. so, how could my cutie little neighbor be a criminal, huh? Because we live a messed up world, thats why, amother. I dont see why an innocent man would plead guilty, that is so ridiculous.

amother

Tue, Sep 15 2009, 12:13 am

bad advice.

And it is a chov upon you to be dan lekaf zchus

amother

Tue, Sep 15 2009, 12:30 am

Hi its me again THE ORIGINAL POSTER!

***UPDATE****

I contacting SOVI and they were wonderful and within 2 hours Rabbi Cohen called me back adn that is where it STOPPED DEAD. He did not understand why he should be involved and had no clue what to do or say. He told me that if I was asking him if that guy was allowed to be in kids in action or working in houses he could not answer that, (I did not ask him I simply told him straight facts). When I asked if he was happy for this guy to walk the streets or if I was allowed to be a moiser and inform he told me to call ohel and speak to some lawyer there.

To be honest, I am a little tired and did not even realize that nobody does really care - when you want to act nobody is interested, they lie low.

Anybody want to take this further? be my guest!

mummiedearest

Tue, Sep 15 2009, 12:35 am

amother wrote:

why not call ohel, then? he didn't tell you NOT to tell, he told you to consult a lawyer. which is good advice. talk to the lawyer and ask what you should do in case something similar happens again. it's good to know how to do things properly.

Pizza

Tue, Sep 15 2009, 1:44 am

do you or dh have a personal rav? that is who you should ask. in terms of mesirus, you have a bona find shaila, not a lawyer question. I HATE it when rabonim play politics.

Inspired

Tue, Sep 15 2009, 5:34 am

Pizza wrote:

do you or dh have a personal rav? that is who you should ask. in terms of mesirus, you have a bona find shaila, not a lawyer question. I HATE it when rabonim play politics.

ITA.

ss321

Tue, Sep 15 2009, 6:52 am

amother wrote:

does it make a bit of sense to you that a gabbai would do this while sitting next to a choshuva rav?

the guy was innocent but bec he pled guilty he still had to sit

The rav was my nephew's mohel

you have GOT to be kidding me. seriously.

1) does it make sense that a chashuva rov would steal from the governmnent? not to me, but check the news stories taking place within the past year. you will see such occurances in many neighborhoods (not just my own) on a very large scale (like - make front cover of every newspaper in this country, top story on the 5 o clock news, massive FBI raid scale). does it make sense? no, because the torah says lo signov. does molestaton make sense? according to the Torah? no! does that mean It cant happen?? get real, AMOTHER.

2) and "pled guilty he still had to sit." sorry, but you obviously dont know the first thing about how our legal system works. people dont "plead guilty" and sit in prison for years because they throw up their hands and say "enough already! I am sick of going to court every day, it is just soo annoying. Id rather just go to jail and do the time for a crime I did not commit and is so sickening to me"

3) The Rav was your nephews mohel? Ive got news for you. just because he was the Gabbai to a Rov doesnt make him righteous. really, you have to get a grip. sorry you are in denial about the world we live in, but I urge you, for the sake of your children, to be cognizant of your surroundings and watch out. There are sickos like this. and they live amongst us.

smilingmom

Tue, Sep 15 2009, 7:25 am

amother wrote:

does it make a bit of sense to you that a gabbai would do this while sitting next to a choshuva rav?

the guy was innocent but bec he pled guilty he still had to sit

The rav was my nephew's mohel

Perhaps I did not make my self clear. The "Chashuva Rav" Rabbi Israel Grunwald, was also indicted, the charges were dropped temporarily as part of a deal, where he has to do community service and receive counseling.

What knowledge do you have, (ie court papers) that they are innocent? By professing someones innocence you are totally missing the point. You may have not been abused by them, but that does not mean that others weren't.

BTW, I would ask a shaila about the kashrus of your nephews Mila. A mila must be done by a frum yid to be kosher. I think fondeling 15 y.o. girls on a plane, categorizes you as not frum.

smilingmom

Tue, Sep 15 2009, 7:30 am

amother wrote:

That is so sick, that a rabbi of Rav Cohens stature would be so blase.
I know that it is disheartening.
If you find the strength, please call Dov Hikinds office and speak to them, they may be more receptive.
In the merit of all your efforts, may we be zoche to never have another case of s-xual abuse in our communities.

bubby

Tue, Sep 15 2009, 7:39 am

I'm shocked & disappointed that Rav Cohen took this position of what seems to me to be "no position." Sorry, OP, I thought that's what he does. Although in a way you did get a Psak: go to a lawyer from Ohel & presumably, listen to him/her. But I agree, it sounds like a cop-out to me.

This doesn't make sense. On the one hand people are openly discussing abuse B"H & are trying to deal with it, but then you get the head-in-the-sand attitude. I was so sure Rav Cohen would be able to guide you. I'm sorry, I gave you wrong info & advice. Dov Hikind sounds like a good person to contact, but who knows anymore. I'm still shaking my head in amazement.

tzatza

Tue, Sep 15 2009, 10:36 am

Almost evry day, when I hug my oldest son, I tell him how much me and Totty love him and that he should NEVER be afraid or hesitate to come to us if ANYONE does ANYTHING to him he is not comfortable with (aside from talking to him about screaming for help and running away, and all that stuff).
I am absolutely mortified with what is going on..... (and I coordinate Domestic Violence program, so one would think I don't have virgin ears anymore....sigh)

ora_43

Tue, Sep 15 2009, 11:27 am

Nice that everyone is so willing to bash on Rabbi Cohen based on what "amother" says. It's not like he's spent way more time and effort dealing with abuse issues than any of us, or anything, that he should be given the benefit of the doubt Confused

.

I don't understand how what he said was even bad. He doesn't know whether this guy is violating parole or not, he referred you to someone who can help. So nu, call the lawyer and find out.

It's not a question of whether or not Rabbi Cohen or anyone else is "happy for this guy to walk the streets." The guy is allowed to walk the streets. He's done his jail time. If you don't like that, so feel free to lobby for the death penalty for child molesters, but in the meantime there might not be anything anyone can do.

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