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Forum -> Chinuch, Education & Schooling

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amother

Thu, Mar 09 2006, 10:25 am

I'm wondering what people think of this. I hear from many people, that when they were growing up, there were special treats that were "only for Totty," such as soda (okay, these were simpler days). I'm kinda feeling this out with my own kids now.

Do you feel it's okay for kids to understand that there are certain boundaries between what's for kids and what's for adults regarding "treats?" I would never smack my lips over an ice cream with my kids hanging around me and salivating, while I tell them, this is just for Mommy. On the other hand, if I would share with them each time, either I would never buy myself stuff or I would end up with none, like the kitties.

I know some of you are scratching your heads and saying, "Why can't you just enjoy your stuff when the kids are not around?" But that's not my point. The issue is not, can parents fress their guts out and tell their kids, "No, you can't have that, it's just for Mommies/Totties." That's disgusting. But, is it valid chinuch for kids, just like there are going to be kids in their class who have certain things they don't, or just anybody else who has a flashier bike, more nosh, etc. to explain "Sometimes kids get goodies, sometimes Totties and Mommies get goodies, and sometimes we all get goodies." (wouldn't be bad if ADULTS would absorb this concept Smile

)

My husband just doesn't get my conundrum. He grew up in a pretty strict household, where Totty and Mommy were the ultimate authority and little pishers like him just did what they were told. For him, if a parent says NO, that's just it, we don't have to go into long psychobabble explanations with kids. Kids have to understand boundaries and rules. I agree with him partly, the question is just, to what extent?

happy2beme

Thu, Mar 09 2006, 10:33 am

how in the world are your kids going to share if you don't share?
I don't think it's a prob to say this is special for mommy/tatty but he/she will share with u...
I s/x's tell my daughter: mommy bought this for tatty & go ask tatty if u can have....
if ur kids don't see u practicing sharing, I really don't think they'll learn to share either.

amother

Thu, Mar 09 2006, 10:35 am

I'm not talking about on a daily basis. Like once in a while, just understanding the concept that Mommies can also sometimes have things just for them. And no, my kids are pretty good sharers.

amother

Thu, Mar 09 2006, 10:49 am

Quote:

But, is it valid chinuch for kids, just like there are going to be kids in their class who have certain things they don't, or just anybody else who has a flashier bike, more nosh, etc. to explain "Sometimes kids get goodies, sometimes Totties and Mommies get goodies, and sometimes we all get goodies."

I dont think this lesson should be taught by parents having treats that their kids arent allowed.
generosity teaches generosity.
but, I dont think theres anything wrong with saying "No" either. Kids shouldnt expect to get something everytime just because they asked. but I wouldnt say "no" for a treat, maybe to something like a toddler who wants to eat out of his mothers plate everytime she sits down to eat. Rolling Eyes

amother

Thu, Mar 09 2006, 10:53 am

maybe to something like a toddler who wants to eat out of his mothers plate everytime she sits down to eat

Quote:

But that's also what I mean. Sometimes, whatever Mommy is eating suddenly becomes eminently desirable. Besides for a great way to get your kids to eat spinach, does that mean that every time you eat something different than your kids, they are entitled to most of it?

goldrose

Thu, Mar 09 2006, 11:00 am

Quote:

how in the world are your kids going to share if you don't share?

my little daughters like to have some of my breakfast - even if they just had the exact same thing as me, and didnt want THEIRS. Sometimes I just feel like eating it myself. And I tell them clearly "I dont feel like sharing now" - and yes, they can take from this that sometimes we dont feel like sharing and we are entitled to things on our own. Once they know they dont HAVE to share, it's actually EASIER for them to share!

chocolate moose

Thu, Mar 09 2006, 11:02 am

What about lechaims (not to go to, to drink, but you know what, to go to too)? Or a fur coat?

I was told that certain things I'd have as an adult...and you know what, it's true!

No litle kids needs to drink likker or wear perfume. They can see it's choshuv and that it's for the future.

zigi

Thu, Mar 09 2006, 12:02 pm

my son wanted beer. no way he can't have it, I told him its only for tatty but you can have some soda.
a small treat in front of them like a small peice of chocolate, sorry its only for mommy, but say you also get some treats that are only for kinderlach, ie lollypops.
sharing doesn't have to mean splitting it evenly but a taste or a sip.

cindy324

Thu, Mar 09 2006, 5:13 pm

I just stick to the "enjoying when the kids are not around" Wink

mother48

Sun, Mar 12 2006, 12:40 pm

of course there are boundries: my daughter knows nailpolish is just for mommies, and when she grows up, she can also have some.

as far as food, I will tell my kids, no, I will not give you my cereal (s/t you just like to eat yourself...), but I can give you your own bowl if you'd like.

I don't nosh s/t special in front of them, don't think it's fair, they are, after all, people.

chen

Mon, Mar 13 2006, 11:07 am

I think it's easy enough to instill the idea of certain things being just for adults outside the arena of food. Father and Mother have their special chairs, their special machzorim or siddurim, CD players or cameras or perfume or makeup, watches and jewelry...the list goes on and on.

When it comes to food, most people have no problem with the concept of alcohol, coffee, or artificial sweetener being for adults. The standard response in our house is that these things are unhealthy for children who are still growing. (It takes a while for them to figure out that these things are not exactly health food for adults, either.)

As to other treats that are difficult to distinguish from children's treats, I'd avoid saying those are just for adults. Sometimes it's a matter of expense and appreciation. A 6-year-old will be just as happy with el cheapo ice cream or chocolate as with premium, for example. If you don't want to "waste" the good stuff on a child, save it for when the children are not around. It's really inconsiderate to eat it in front of a child and then tell him "this is just for adults". The child knows what ice cream and chocolate are, after all.

This is very different from not giving a child food from your plate. That is a matter of simple hygiene. We don't eat from our children's plates, and they don't eat from ours. You want what I'm having, you can get your own dish. The only exception is when we eat at a restaurant and order an assortment of dishes. whoever wants a taste of someone else's order--assuming the other person is willing--gets a sample cut with a clean utensil when the dish is first served, before the person who ordered it started eating it. We don't force anyone to share their meal--though I can't think of a time when anyone ever refused. usually there is a lively exchange all around the table, and the only refusal is someone who does not want to taste someone else's order.

chocolate moose

Mon, Mar 13 2006, 11:10 am

Yay Chen!

imanut

Mon, Mar 13 2006, 12:27 pm

my daughter always eats from my food, even if I gave her the exact same thing Exclamation

I don't like it, but otherwise she wouldn't eat anything. the alternative is to only eat while she is sleeping, but she doesn't sleep enough for that to be possible.
treats that we don't want her to have we eat when she is sleeping; otherwise it's not fair.

gryp

Mon, Mar 13 2006, 12:40 pm

Quote:

This is very different from not giving a child food from your plate. That is a matter of simple hygiene. We don't eat from our children's plates, and they don't eat from ours

chen- there are lots of people I know who do.

shoy18

Mon, Mar 13 2006, 12:41 pm

Food is not special for anyone, (obviously we arent speaking about things that are bad for children or not healthy in general) if you dont want to share something with your kids dont eat it in front of them. food is also not a reward especially candy and junk, either than can have it or they cant have it!

chen

Mon, Mar 13 2006, 7:21 pm

GR wrote:

Quote:

This is very different from not giving a child food from your plate. That is a matter of simple hygiene. We don't eat from our children's plates, and they don't eat from ours

chen- there are lots of people I know who do.

there are lots of people I know who sip from a communal can of soda, and there are lots of ppl I know who give their 5-year-olds schnapps on shabbos, and lots of ppl I know who drive without wearing seatbelts and while talking on hand-held cell phones, but I don't recommend any of the above activities.

gryp

Tue, Mar 14 2006, 1:25 pm

the above examples you give are a bit different and more extreme than just giving your child a spoonful from your plate. or eating untouched food from your child's plate so it doesnt go to waste for no reason.

chen

Tue, Mar 14 2006, 1:37 pm

I believe the topic of the thread was how to get children to understand that certain things are just for adults. having a policy of sheli, sheli-- veshelcho, shelcho is one way to do that. I didn't tell you what to do, I described what we do. you want to eat off your child's plate, that's your prerogative. freilachn purim.

SAH

Tue, Mar 14 2006, 6:47 pm

I don't see any problem with having some food items only for adults (in certain circumstances), and saying just that to kids--it doesn't have to be so complicated. I despise soda, but finally figured out why Hashem made coke--for pregnant women. (It really has helped me in my current pregnancy.) However, soda is not for kids (in our family's view) and my son (age 2) accepts that. He also has food allergies and is very accepting of the fact (even today on Purim) that he can't eat all treats, which may help us all around. (He once asked if soda had eggs or nuts in it! Smile

.)

We have friends who are shluchim on campus and serve coke to students every Shabbos, but their kids (the oldest is 9) do NOT drink it and never even ask--that was their family's policy from the beginning and noone complained.

So the bottom line (in my opinion) is there are some foods that occasionally we have to eat or serve around kids, and they're not for them--so they can be told so from age 2 and older. That said, I certainly wouldn't eat something my kids CAN have and do eat and just say "not now" for them.

raizy

Tue, Mar 14 2006, 8:08 pm

chen u did it again . the words from the wise.!! \

what I would do is have two different chocalates the cheap stuff and the good stuff. the kids will hopefully not realize that they are getting the cheap stuff!!!

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