Healthy Cooking- Isn't This Supposed to Be a Safe Haven?

Seraph

Wed, Nov 30 2011, 3:33 am

Wasn't it decided from the start that this was to be a safe haven?
If someone says "I want a recipe that calls for no white sugar but calls for honey or other natural sweeteners", no saying "Come on, white sugar isn't any less healthy than honey".
Or if someone says "I want a recipe that uses splenda" no one will give them an earful of how terrible splenda is.
Or if someone says "I want only low fat/no fat recipes" no one lectures them or gives comments about healthy fats and low fat being bad for you.
Or if someone says "I want recipes that call for only natural fats like butter, shmaltz, olive oil, etc" no one lectures them how butter is less healthy than margarine, and that they're being very unhealthy.

Isn't that what was agreed upon when this forum was started? Because there's no one universal definition of healthy, that we'd respect other people's decisions of how to feed their family and not give any lectures or irrelevant comments?
Did everyone else miss the memo?

Or am I just dreaming that that was what was decided...

Last edited by Seraph on Wed, Nov 30 2011, 3:37 am; edited 1 time in total

Seraph

Wed, Nov 30 2011, 3:35 am

From the forum description:
"A place to share recipes that are "healthier" than regular. This can include lower in calories, fat, sugar or artificial ingredients. This is not a place for debate."

Guess Yael agrees with me. Maybe other people didn't realize that?

Soul on fire

Wed, Nov 30 2011, 3:56 am

Not that I am disagreeing that people should be able to ask for recipes without lectures but splenda really is bad like all artificial sweeteners, so I would think it wouldn't belong in healthy cooking anyway.
That said....people can just ignore unwanted advice.

Seraph

Wed, Nov 30 2011, 4:17 am

FrumMamaPA wrote:

Uh, I agree with you about splenda, but other people are looking for sugar free because being diabetic or trying to lose weight or whatever, and this ISN'T the place to debate.

Yea, you can ignore unwanted advice, but the point of this forum isnt debating, its to get ideas for recipes or meals that suit your specific criteria of what you deem to be healthy.

shalhevet

Wed, Nov 30 2011, 4:18 am

Seraph, like you said, there are different opinions on healthy eating (besides which for a diabetic Splenda is much more healthy than honey; ww flour is very healthy, but not for you).

Sorry, but I think this is just a case of grow up/ scroll on by. Maybe you will learn something new (and if we are interested in healthy eating we should be always willing to hear new ideas/ research/ opinions) and maybe you won't, but I just find it silly not to be open to hearing other opinions. This is not a hashkafa debate. If someone gives me new evidence that honey/ eggs/ brown sugar/ butter is good or bad or better/worse than the alternatives, why shouldn't I be open to read and learn, and then make my own decisions?

Davka I think it is very useful to debate and bring reasons/evidence of why someone believes a particular way of cooking/eating is better.

Seraph

Wed, Nov 30 2011, 4:24 am

Its not that I can't scroll on by, its just getting annoying that EVERY time someone says "I want a recipe without sugar, but honey is ok" EVERY single time you get the same responses (by the same 2 or three posters, btw) "Honey isn't any healthier than sugar".
Ok, I know YOU think that, and thats fine, but I don't care, I'm looking for recipes that fit this criteria, not to get this thread turned into a debate on health.

If you want to debate on health, debate in the women's health section or controversial. Yael, not me, said this subsection is not a place for debate.

Seraph

Wed, Nov 30 2011, 4:24 am

freidasima

Wed, Nov 30 2011, 4:34 am

It's a fine line seraph and a problematic one.
Because any of us looking for healthy cooking are interested in healthy cooking, right? And we all have different definitions of healthy.

so maybe first thing is to answer the question being asked and provide the recipie being looked for.
And then if anyone wants to make a comment it might be done in a neutral way, such as "there are those nutritionists/food scientists/biologist/ whatever who have stated that Splenda, having gone through a chemical process is as dangerous to the health as artificial sweetner" or something like "just remember that for people who are looking at the chemical composition of honey, in the long run fructose, sucrose and (whatever the third one is, forgot) all break down to the same insulin raising substance when assimilated by the body".

Meaning, it's INFO, not a debate. One can do with info as one wishes. And therefore it should be presented as INFO and nothing else.

One can discuss the merits and problems of a particular substance but not take it as a criticism of someone who uses it.

Here - I have been having problems digesting whole wheat lately, and therefore I've had to use a combination of half whole wheat and half refined unbleached flours. Not as good as all whole wheat? Depends for whom and right now that's what I seem to need so...will people tell me it's not as "healthy" as full whole wheat? To be sure. Do I know it? To be sure.

Seraph

Wed, Nov 30 2011, 7:21 am

chocolate moose wrote:

I don't think this forum should have been created. for exactly those reasos.

But it has been. And its been helpful to quite a few people.
So why insert your "Whats wrong with sugar" in every post, Chocolate Moose? Obviously the people asking for sugar free recipes think sugar is unhealthy. They don't need your opinion that its totally fine, even if you're entitled to it.

Liba

Wed, Nov 30 2011, 7:39 am

Healthy for any two of us isn't going to be the same.

Healthy for me is, no fish, very limited dairy, almost no whole grains, seeds, sprouts, beans, liver...

It has actually been hard for me since I am used to cooking with and eating whole grains and beans.

I have one child who needs a high calorie diet, one who needs a low fat diet, a husband who is supposed to eat only whole grains and no white sugar...

Tova

Wed, Nov 30 2011, 8:57 am

Seraph wrote:

I wrote up that forum description for Yael. Truthfully the only reason that line was even added was due to the naysayers when I originally proposed the forum in the Announcements section. I don't think it's "save haven" the way Natural Parenting is, but it should be "mutual respect." So yes, if someone requests no sugar but honey OK, respect it.

Choc Moose - you were against the forum creation from the beginning, but it's here and many of us like it and I feel like it's gotten a lot of great posts in the past week or so.

freidasima

Wed, Nov 30 2011, 9:00 am

Tova I really really REALLY like the mutual respect line.
I'm going to adopt it in many things.
There should be mutual respect on this board in general, and as we well know, it's sometimes sorely lacking.
That should be the guideline for EVERY section not only this one.
Kudos for thinking of it.

amother

Saddlebrown

Wed, Nov 30 2011, 9:20 am

freidasima wrote:

Meaning, it's INFO, not a debate. One can do with info as one wishes. And therefore it should be presented as INFO and nothing else.

I couldn't for the life of me figure out what INFO stood for!! In...Not...For...Opinion?! Lol, I just kept looking at it, trying to figure it out, until it clicked! You know you've spent too much time on imamother when any capped word looks like it's an acronym, and you can't read regular words anymore.

Last edited by amother on Fri, Aug 21 2020, 10:07 am; edited 1 time in total

HindaRochel

Wed, Nov 30 2011, 9:50 am

If you are talking about me there was a question raised about using honey versus sugar and the poster didn't know if that was healthier or not. She was obviously also searching for a good healthier substitute, so I I basically said that there is little difference between them, however if you want a good substitute, blackstrap molasses is healthier. It contains a number of vitamins, iron etc.

I wouldn't consider that off the path. The question was raised and answered.

ChossidMom

Wed, Nov 30 2011, 12:22 pm

Ok, I haven't seen the threads that are mentioned here, but the healthy cooking section is exactly the place where I would expect and like to find the controversy about what is and isn't healthy. Because in the other sections, people may not care. But I assume that everyone posting in here DOES care about how healthy something is! If someone wants to point out that honey isn't better than sugar, really, I want to hear about it even if it's something I know. Because one day someone may post something that I don't know yet (well, I don't know everything Wink

).

Maybe I shouldn't have posted my comment about egg whites in the protein pancakes thread.....
But, hey, I really hate having to think and re-think every post in a RECIPE section.

Just my 2 cents.

Seraph

Wed, Nov 30 2011, 12:57 pm

I hear you, Chossidmom, but since "healthy eating" minded people can have completely different opinions on what is healthy, I really don't think there is any to'eles even to all these comments. I assume that if people are asking for recipes that fit within a certain category, that they've done their research and come to the conclusion that this is the healthiest way for them to eat, and you saying "Uch, you're being stupid" or "Wow, you're really going to make your family sick if you eat that way" won't change anyone's mind, especially if people have done their own research. For myself, for example, I don't care how many times you way white sugar, soy bean oil, canola oil, etc... are totally fine, and much healthier than the butter, eggs, shmaltz, etc that I feed my family, and that honey and sugar are no different healthwise, you won't convince me otherwise because I have done my own research, even if my conclusions are vastly different from yours.

What I propose is that if someone is asking for ideas of what types of food is healthy, and they're looking for direction, people give their ideas on what they think is healthy and why, and there would be fine to engage in respectful debate. But when someone asks for a recipe that fits the "healthy eating criteria" that they do, people give suggestions and ideas that suit what they're looking for instead of trying to convince them that they way they're eating is silly/stupid/unhealthy.

What do you think?

LiLIsraeli

Wed, Nov 30 2011, 1:06 pm

I haven't really checked out the forum, but I agree with Seraph's principle: that if someone is asking for recipes with no sugar, people shouldn't say, "Well, what's wrong with sugar?"

Debates like that can be held on separate threads meant for debating what is or isn't healthy, but posts asking for recipes should be answered on-topic with mutual respect (I like that line, too!).