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Update on the question I had about narcotics
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amother
Cerulean


 

Post Sun, Mar 18 2018, 8:39 pm
The sad part is that the nurse who was taking details was cringing when details of injury was being told so it wasn't reported properly then the doctor just assumed it was a simple stitches issue when the doctor didn't ask us specifically.he just walked in saying he refuses to give anything more then Motrin. That's where this whole thing got derailed.

Doctor did not know the extent of injury. And oh well. Now I will see if the on call doctor will be able to help, I'm hanging in there. I
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amother
Jade


 

Post Sun, Mar 18 2018, 8:43 pm
amother wrote:
The sad part is that the nurse who was taking details was cringing when details of injury was being told so it wasn't reported properly then the doctor just assumed it was a simple stitches issue when the doctor didn't ask us specifically.he just walked in saying he refuses to give anything more then Motrin. That's where this whole thing got derailed.

Doctor did not know the extent of injury. And oh well. Now I will see if the on call doctor will be able to help, I'm hanging in there. I


The doctor who did the stitches could see with his own eyes the extent of the injury.

If the patient is still in a lot of pain, sounds like he should be getting medical attention, again. Not a review of his file, but an exam.
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amother
Cerulean


 

Post Sun, Mar 18 2018, 8:45 pm
Good news! The doctor on call got all the gory details and prescribed Tylenol codeine for the next 3 days! may Hashem spare us all unnesessary pain.

So now I learned a real lesson. Don't hold back any details when you have an injury. Let the nurse cringe but you do what needs to be done. And don't be shy from any doctor. Lesson 2 I learned is never ever give up. Thanks to all of you here for a sounding board or I would never have realized why this all happened. I do think that this doctor was very unprofessional. He should ask the patient details and not rely on his nurses.
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amother
Coral


 

Post Mon, Mar 19 2018, 2:21 am
This is routine to not give any narcotic Rxs in an ER. I was in the ER (injury with a bunch of stitches)- I wanted ONE pill so I could sleep that night. That was it. I knew if I can get through the worst pain after numbing wore off I could make it through. I asked for 1. I was told they could give me one there but I had to take it there... But since I didnt plan to sleep there it wouldn't help.

Oh and that major study where they are now touting that "Tylenol and Motrin work just as well as narcotics"? Um, read the actual data published. Maximum doses of both Tylenol and Motrin work almost as well as minimal dose of a narcotic plus Tylenol. So it isnt the same as long term Tylenol use especially at that dose will destroy the liver, stomach and cause other major medical issues.
We are all being punished because of the minority who become addicted. I have been given Rx narcotics in the past- no tolerance, withdrawal, cravings etc and use less than needed. But when I really needed just 1 I was told no, despite explanations. I am no addict, am not drug seeking and I had a true injury.

Family who have chronic pain issues are told to try methods that never worked for them. Sometimes (many times!) Tylenol, heat packs, gentle exercise etc only do so much... And without pain relief they cant even get out to their PT session!
Plus only when they are out of meds are they allowed to travel to the doc and get a new Rx, go to the pharmacy, wait there, go home and then can finally get some relief.
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amother
Mustard


 

Post Mon, Mar 19 2018, 4:40 pm
There are a few reasons why narcotics aren't given routinely:
- Addiction potential. Your body can build up tolerance to drug within just a few days, long before addiction is noticed. (On a side note, I've experienced this myself with opiates after a medical procedure, and it was frightening how quickly what I was taking wasn't enough, - within 48-72 hours I felt I needed more. I immediately went off and cried for two weeks instead (seriously)).
- Narcotics are not as effective as people think for many kinds of pain. There have scientific studies on this, but it depends what kind of pain we're talking about.
- Side effects. This is actually very high on the list of reasons why narcotics are not given regularly - they can have very serious side effects, as they work directly on your central nervous system. Some of the side effects can be long term or even permanent. This is often even more of a concern than addictiveness, and I was surprised that more people aren't aware of this.

For each case, doctors have to weigh whether it's worth it to risk the potentially severe side effects of a narcotic which isn't always sufficiently effective and is highly addicting vs a different pain killer which would be somewhat effective but has low risk of serious side effects and is non-addicting.
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amother
Pink


 

Post Mon, Mar 19 2018, 5:06 pm
This reluctance to prescribe narcotics has not been my experience. I recently had a scheduled c-section and my OB prescribed oxycodone in advance so I wouldn't have to pick it up from the pharmacy with a newborn in tow. I have a bunch leftover as I didn't like the way it made me feel. It didn't do enough to take away the pain but it made me light-headed. So I stopped taking it as soon as possible and stuck to alternating Tylenol and Advil as necessary.
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dancingqueen




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Mar 19 2018, 5:25 pm
Op, google the term “opioid crisis” to understand why doctors are reluctant to prescribe narcotics these days.
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dancingqueen




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Mar 19 2018, 5:26 pm
amother wrote:
This reluctance to prescribe narcotics has not been my experience. I recently had a scheduled c-section and my OB prescribed oxycodone in advance so I wouldn't have to pick it up from the pharmacy with a newborn in tow. I have a bunch leftover as I didn't like the way it made me feel. It didn't do enough to take away the pain but it made me light-headed. So I stopped taking it as soon as possible and stuck to alternating Tylenol and Advil as necessary.


A csection is major abdominal surgery, in a different category than 5 stitches.
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amother
Lilac


 

Post Mon, Mar 19 2018, 8:32 pm
dancingqueen wrote:
A csection is major abdominal surgery, in a different category than 5 stitches.


When I gave birth naturally 3 years ago, I lost track of how many times I was offered codeine (and kept declining). It became rather annoying.

But that was because the hospital had re-done their birthing unit and wanted a reputation that would appeal to expectant moms.
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amother
Pearl


 

Post Mon, Mar 19 2018, 9:11 pm
There has been a massive drop in RXing opioids due to the major Oxycontin scam run by Purdue Pharma.

Purdue Pharma falsely misrepresented their drug as having the ability to provide pain relief for 12 solid hours -- which was longer than other drugs from other pharmaceutical companies. The medical world bought into it, even though patients complained of being in pain again long before 12 hours had elapsed.

When doctors consulted with Purdue, they were told that the patients were in pain because the dosage was too low, not that it wore off too early. And so docs would up the doseage of Oxycontin, and as a result, many people became addicted to Oxycontin. Many people, including women who had just given birth and were not at risk of developing an opioid addiction otherwise, became addicted.

Purdue Pharma agreed to pay $600 million in fines after the scam was revealed, though I do not know who actually received that money...

Since this info was released, doctors, it seems, are playing it super safe and reserving the heavy drugs for specific cases. (Palliative care, anyone? Drug the patient with opioids and let them die of hunger/thirst...)
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amother
Mistyrose


 

Post Mon, Mar 19 2018, 10:26 pm
amother wrote:
There has been a massive drop in RXing opioids due to the major Oxycontin scam run by Purdue Pharma.

Purdue Pharma falsely misrepresented their drug as having the ability to provide pain relief for 12 solid hours -- which was longer than other drugs from other pharmaceutical companies. The medical world bought into it, even though patients complained of being in pain again long before 12 hours had elapsed.

When doctors consulted with Purdue, they were told that the patients were in pain because the dosage was too low, not that it wore off too early. And so docs would up the doseage of Oxycontin, and as a result, many people became addicted to Oxycontin. Many people, including women who had just given birth and were not at risk of developing an opioid addiction otherwise, became addicted.

Purdue Pharma agreed to pay $600 million in fines after the scam was revealed, though I do not know who actually received that money...

Since this info was released, doctors, it seems, are playing it super safe and reserving the heavy drugs for specific cases. (Palliative care, anyone? Drug the patient with opioids and let them die of hunger/thirst...)


This is very true and because of this doctors are not allowed to prescribe these heavy drugs because they are addictive. There are so many articles on this topic everywhere online, magazines, tv etc....
I work in drug rehab and it’s very very sad what is happening to youths and adolescents especially. Heart breaking😰

So please read on it and educate and be aware before requesting these pills.
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amother
Coral


 

Post Tue, Mar 20 2018, 1:51 am
Yes, opioids are addictive. But not for everyone. And by stopping doctors from giving them to patients who have no history of addiction and have real pain you are hurting many innocent people. Yes, stop giving out full bottles for stitches. But what about making an informed decision when someone has true chronic pain? Have you ever been in a situation where you can't do basic, everyday things that others take for granted? unable to sleep because of the pain? Ever sit on a couch, unable to move and crying from the pain??
And no, tylenol and motrin did not help. Not one bit. And they aren't without major risks too. And no, PT doesn't work.
Sometimes there is real pain that other measures can't handle. They don't cause addiction in everyone and they don't cause side effects in everyone. I have been able to take them without lightheadedness, dizziness or any cloudy brain effect. They just finally dull my pain so I can actually move and do normal stuff. It all depends on your body and how you react.
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amother
Pearl


 

Post Tue, Mar 20 2018, 2:06 am
amother wrote:
Yes, opioids are addictive. But not for everyone. And by stopping doctors from giving them to patients who have no history of addiction and have real pain you are hurting many innocent people. Yes, stop giving out full bottles for stitches. But what about making an informed decision when someone has true chronic pain? Have you ever been in a situation where you can't do basic, everyday things that others take for granted? unable to sleep because of the pain? Ever sit on a couch, unable to move and crying from the pain??
And no, tylenol and motrin did not help. Not one bit. And they aren't without major risks too. And no, PT doesn't work.
Sometimes there is real pain that other measures can't handle. They don't cause addiction in everyone and they don't cause side effects in everyone. I have been able to take them without lightheadedness, dizziness or any cloudy brain effect. They just finally dull my pain so I can actually move and do normal stuff. It all depends on your body and how you react.


100%. This is the classic case of bad medicine. Doctors thought a medication was wonderful, so they overused it -- just like with antibiotics that lead to MRSA, and steroids that lead to Red Skin Syndrome. And then they were force to wake up and smell the coffee -- errr, their big fat mistake -- and then they went running the opposite direction to an extreme.

We need medical professionals who READ medical studies with a critical eye, probe deeply, question everything, and then use medications determined to be "good" within the correct perimeters. Unfortunately, this sort of doctor is a rare breed.
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amother
Mustard


 

Post Tue, Mar 20 2018, 5:16 am
For reference, opioids are addictive for everyone. That's how they work in the brain.

Not everyone who takes them is at high risk of developing a significant addiction. But it's possible for anyone to become addicted - all addicts at some point in their lives started out with no history of addictions.

And not everyone has severe side effects, but also the longer you use them, the more at risk you are for certain side effects, and side effects can also show up in any use not dependent on previous use without them - just because you have used them briefly doens't mean you won't have side effects the next time you use them.

I am very sympathetic to those who suffer a lot of pain, I myself have a chronic illness involving pain. Opioids should be prescribed to those who really need it, but only when the benefits of using them outweigh the risks of the potentially serious side effects and addiction potential, and for a condition / indication for which they have been proven to be helpful (less than you think).
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