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imasinger




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Apr 12 2018, 12:07 pm
amother wrote:
So it's third person?
And if we say Each one of you it's also his/her?


Yes.

It's an awkward construct, and sounds strange because with the word "you" next to the verb, we want to make it second person. So a clear writer/speaker would avoid the situation.

But technically, the correct sentence would be "each of you needs to turn in her homework."

As opposed to, "Miriam, you need to turn in your homework."
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FranticFrummie




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Apr 12 2018, 12:24 pm
Just do what they do in the American southern states.

Y'all = singular

All y'all = plural
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amother
Amethyst


 

Post Thu, Apr 12 2018, 3:08 pm
imasinger wrote:
Yes.

It's an awkward construct, and sounds strange because with the word "you" next to the verb, we want to make it second person. So a clear writer/speaker would avoid the situation.

But technically, the correct sentence would be "each of you needs to turn in her homework."

As opposed to, "Miriam, you need to turn in your homework."

Thank you for this.
You've given me much clarity.
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amother
Amethyst


 

Post Sun, Apr 15 2018, 2:39 pm
Imasinger, you were so helpful with that last one, so I'm bringing this one up again. If you, or anyone else, can help me, I'd appreciate it.
imasinger wrote:
"Each of us" = "every individual in this group". It doesn't matter how big the group is; "each" in this example means "one person." Therefore it's singular.

"All of you" = "the whole group". Therefore, it's plural, and would take a plural pronoun.

All of you is plural because it's a group. I get that.

What about this example?
"All of you should bring your/their sneakers tomorrow."

Wih "Each of you" the conclusion was to use his/her because it's third person. Does the same apply to "all"?

What about "All of us"? Again with each of us, it's third person (his/her). But what about once it's all and it's plural? Is it also third person (their)? Or is it first person (our)?

Again, ladies, I know it's preferable to rephrase the awkward phraseology. This is more about theoretically categorizing these indefinite pronouns. Thanks!
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imasinger




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, Apr 15 2018, 3:52 pm
amother wrote:
Imasinger, you were so helpful with that last one, so I'm bringing this one up again. If you, or anyone else, can help me, I'd appreciate it.
All of you is plural because it's a group. I get that.

What about this example?
"All of you should bring your/their sneakers tomorrow."

Wih "Each of you" the conclusion was to use his/her because it's third person. Does the same apply to "all"?

What about "All of us"? Again with each of us, it's third person (his/her). But what about once it's all and it's plural? Is it also third person (their)? Or is it first person (our)?

Again, ladies, I know it's preferable to rephrase the awkward phraseology. This is more about theoretically categorizing these indefinite pronouns. Thanks!


The word "all" is different from the word "each."

"Each" is always singular, referring to one person/thing.

"All" is indefinite. Therefore, the correct verb usually matches the word following "of."

"All of you should bring your sneakers."

"All of us used our umbrellas."

But

"Each of them signed his own name to the document."

Does that help?

You can find more information and other indefinite pronouns listed here:

http://englishplus.com/grammar/00000027.htm
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amother
Amethyst


 

Post Tue, Apr 17 2018, 10:12 pm
imasinger wrote:
The word "all" is different from the word "each."

"Each" is always singular, referring to one person/thing.

"All" is indefinite. Therefore, the correct verb usually matches the word following "of."

"All of you should bring your sneakers."

"All of us used our umbrellas."

But

"Each of them signed his own name to the document."

Does that help?

You can find more information and other indefinite pronouns listed here:

http://englishplus.com/grammar/00000027.htm

That does help. Thanks loads! Maybe next time I'll just PM you. Wink

I knew that "all" takes the number (singular/plural status) of the word following the "of" (aka the object of preposition), but I wasn't sure it takes its person (first, second, third) too.
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imasinger




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Apr 17 2018, 10:20 pm
You are most welcome. Smile
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amother
Amethyst


 

Post Thu, Feb 27 2020, 3:20 pm
Bumping up this thread for another example:

*Both of us have been annoyed by (our/their) brothers.
Both is the antecedent and it's always plural.
According to the conclusion from last time I posted, it is considered third person. Hence, the correct answer would be their?
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imasinger




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Feb 27 2020, 4:14 pm
Great question!

This case is different. Yes, "both" is plural, but so is "we." As you pointed out, this question is not about singular vs plural, but about first person plural vs third person plural.

Picture a Venn diagram for this one. In this example, "both" is a subset of "us".

A synonym for "both of us" is "we both."

Both of us love dancing. We both love dancing.

Therefore, it would be "both of us have been annoyed by our brothers," just as it would be "we both have been annoyed by our brothers."
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amother
Amethyst


 

Post Thu, Feb 27 2020, 4:19 pm
imasinger wrote:
Great question!

This case is different. Yes, "both" is plural, but so is "we." As you pointed out, this question is not about singular vs plural, but about first person plural vs third person plural.

Picture a Venn diagram for this one. In this example, "both" is a subset of "us".

A synonym for "both of us" is "we both."

Both of us love dancing. We both love dancing.

Therefore, it would be "both of us have been annoyed by our brothers," just as it would be "we both have been annoyed by our brothers."


Why? What makes this different than "Each of us"?
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amother
Slateblue


 

Post Thu, Feb 27 2020, 4:29 pm
amother [ Amethyst ] wrote:
Why? What makes this different than "Each of us"?


Each is always singular, both is always plural.
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amother
Amethyst


 

Post Thu, Feb 27 2020, 4:56 pm
amother [ Slateblue ] wrote:
Each is always singular, both is always plural.

I know that!

My question is about the difference in person: why "each of us will bring his/her suitcase" (according to what was previously discussed on this thread), in 3rd person, but "both of us will bring our suitcase" in 1st person?
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imasinger




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Feb 27 2020, 5:00 pm
Because "each" is singular. The synonym for "each of us" might be "each one of us".

Each one of us loves dancing. Each of us loves dancing.

As opposed to "We both love dancing/both of us love dancing."

You correctly point out that in both cases, the word is followed by "of us", which makes it confusing.

English is confusing sometimes.

P.S. In your stated example, it makes more sense to say, "Both of us will bring our suitcases." Because each of us has a suitcase.
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amother
Amethyst


 

Post Thu, Feb 27 2020, 7:49 pm
imasinger wrote:
Because "each" is singular. The synonym for "each of us" might be "each one of us".

Each one of us loves dancing. Each of us loves dancing.

As opposed to "We both love dancing/both of us love dancing."

You correctly point out that in both cases, the word is followed by "of us", which makes it confusing.

English is confusing sometimes.

P.S. In your stated example, it makes more sense to say, "Both of us will bring our suitcases." Because each of us has a suitcase.


If both of us will bring our suitcases, the meaning gets construed as we're each bringing more than one which may not be the case if each of us has only one. Wink



I still don't get what makes you differentiate between "each of us" and "both of us" regarding person.
What makes you decide that "both of us" is a synonym for "we" in the first person, while "each of us" remains as third person? Both "both" and "each" are categorized as indefinite pronouns serving as antecedents. The only difference is that "both" is plural while "each" is singular. What gives you the "right" to then decide that the prepositional phrase "of us" will only impact the person (1st, 2nd, or 3rd) of the pronoun "both" when this cannot be done with any other indefinite pronoun?

Are you saying that singular indefinite pronouns will retain their 3rd person status despite the prepositional phrase following it while indefinite pronouns that are plural AND indefinite pronouns that can be both singular and plural (depending on what they're referring to) are impacted by the person (1st, 2nd, or 3rd) of the prepositional phrase?
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amother
Amethyst


 

Post Sun, May 17 2020, 3:19 pm
bump

Looking for answers to my previous post.
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