So torn possible abuse

mommy3b2c

Tue, Aug 28 2018, 7:54 am

FranticFrummie wrote:

My first thoughts as well. I have an adopted child who has given me a run for my money, and I can't imagine ever sending her away.

If you abandon this boy (YOUR SON) at such a delicate age, he will be broken for life. He needs help. Your help. Hashem sent him to your home for a reason. If you reach out, Hashem will send you the wisdom and clarity to deal with the situation.

I am proud of you that your 4yo feels safe to tell you about this. That proves that you are a good mom. I'm just thinking that with therapy, the 4yo will recover. With the 12yo, if he is removed from your home, no amount of therapy will fix that.

I think you did the right thing by reaching out and getting help to process your feelings. You've gotten excellent advice about going straight to the professionals before you make any firm decisions.

I'll be davening for your whole family. Hug

You expressed my thoughts exactly. As did the anonymous poster that you quoted.

imasinger

Tue, Aug 28 2018, 8:02 am

Whenever anything explosive happens in life, the most important first thing to do is gather information and think. Rushing into anything as drastic as sending a child away is not a good idea.

Aside from the damage it could do to the foster child, who likely thinks you see him as a son, it could damage the very child you are trying to protect, who could internalize the message that any child who does something awful enough will be sent away forever. Both the loss of an older brother, and the fear that it could happen are potentially devastating.

Do continue to seek psychological help for the 12 year old and parent counseling for yourselves. Do take obvious precautions about not letting them bathe together or be alone unsupervised. Do try to talk to your foster son, in an understanding rather than accusatory manner, to see if you can understand exactly what he did and why.

Then, with the help of counseling, you have a reasonable chance of getting past this incident with confidence that ALL your children are safe.

DVOM

Tue, Aug 28 2018, 9:10 am

OP, this is a terribly painful post to read. I'm so sorry for both of your boys. This type of behavior does not sound like typical s-xual exploration to me. I'd guess that your older son learned it from someone, possibly he was abused in this way himself, perhaps even before he came to live with you.

Here's my advice, for what it's worth:

Is your older son your kid, yours? If he is, you don't give him away because he hurt his brother. You help him. You love him.

Sit both of your boys down together. Your younger son should be praised for sharing this with you. Hug him and kiss him and tell him how proud you are that he told you about touch that made him uncomfortable. Your older son should be praised for being honest about touching his brother when you confronted him. Hug him and kiss hims and tell him how proud you are that he was honest with you, even though he must have known that what he did was not OK. Tell your older son that you will be helping him make sure that this type of behavior never happens again. Explain that our private parts are private and should not be touched or looked at by another person. Tell both your boys that for the time being, they will be supervised whenever they are together, that at night there will be alarms on your younger son's (and daughters) bedroom doors so that you can be sure to wake up if anyone comes into or goes out of thier rooms so that you can get up and supervise them. Tell your older son that you love him NO MATTER WHAT he does, but that this behavior will never happen again. Explain that you will be getting him a therapist to talk to to help him figure out why he did this and how to help him stop doing it in the future. Let him know that your there for him to talk to and come to NO MATTER WHAT.

And then get a really good s-xual abuse therapist for both your boys and a family therapist for yourself. This incident aside, it sounds like your feelings towards your olderst son are very complex. An attachment focused therapist that specializes in adoption and fostering might be really helpful for you.

amother

Rose

Tue, Aug 28 2018, 9:56 am

I don't want to freak you out but what about at night when you're sleeping? What are your sleeping arrangements? Or if you go out and theres a sitter?
Honestly I'd look into putting some kind of alarm on his door at nighttime ( like people have to do for seniors or some kids with specific needs) and letting him know in a loving way. Its okay if he begins to understand the ramifications and seriousness of that choice. Its for his own good too. Yes Id take this extremely seriously. Still Id check with professionals and not make any "permanent" decisions in haste. More would need to be known.

I don't think I would sit them down together necessarily but rather with each one separately. I would be very careful not to let my 4 year old think Im minimizing what the older brother did. Id definitely confer with professionals before doing such a thing. Perhaps more importantly, developmentally they are at different stages and would require different approaches etc. 12 and 4 are worlds apart.

hugs and hatzlocha

imasinger

Tue, Aug 28 2018, 11:03 am

amother wrote:

As to the first part of this post, that is a good example of an extreme reaction that needs to be put aside during the information gathering stage.

Once there is a clear picture of exactly what happened, what caused it, and you have appropriate, professionally trained and certified therapists to guide your next moves, then you can consider whether this is necessary.

Many times, a situation like this is based on an impulsive older child, brimming with hormones and either curiosity or his own abuse, acting out in a particular moment. To jump from there to a door alarm at night is really extreme, and although it might be necessary for certain kids, would not be the first solution to jump to.

amother

Indigo

Tue, Aug 28 2018, 11:05 am

I'm so sorry you are going through this. It's so horrifying on so many levels. So glad your four year old was able to verbalize what happened to you and also that he knew to say stop.

I'm not therapist but the only thing I can imagine doing given that you have been this boys parents for 9 years and are in the adoptions process, is treating him like your own son because that's what your life has been for the past 9 years and you are the only parents he knows. Putting him in the system is effectively destroying his life, he has little to no chance of finding another adoptive family and you will confirm that he is unloveable and unimportant even to the only parents he knows.

Still, you do have to keep your other kids away from him without serious supervision (even if that is hard--much of parenting is incredibly challenging).

What happens if your 4 year old mimics this behavior to his younger sisters when he gets a bit older? Will you give him up too?

I've never had an adopted or foster child and have great respect for foster parents who often don't get the full satisfaction of being the real parent like biological or adoptive parents, but the answer to challenges isn't to simply give the child away. You've come this far. Get the professionals involved and get help as if he was your biological child.

amother

Pink

Tue, Aug 28 2018, 11:06 am

Thank you all so much for your responses
It is very complex the situation
And the 4 year old is an innocent calm child who when his older brother is not around is so calm and pleasant when his older brother I around he gets hyper , defensive and nervous
Although they do play together calmly sometimes with toys
But he is always the brunt of the 12 year olds baggage
He let's it out on him and can't see him relaxed for a second always bothering him
When he sees him calm
And enjoys seeing him cry
Although they do see each other as brothers and most likely as we were told that because of his baggage he is pretty infantil and doesn't realize the diff between himself at 12 and 4 year old
I am not willing to let my innocent 4 year old and chas vesholom our new baby girls
Be the receiving end of his baggage
Although my heart breaks if we have to send him I don't want to ruin his life that we have tried so hard to build up over these years

We did take him to see the social worker yesterday and he told her that he couldn't stop
When the 4 year old told him it was beyond him to stop
Which terrifies me to no end

If he does go away from the family it was be gradual and he will have contact with his bio family which would make him happy
And the easiest possible way for everyone
Although the comment about how th 4 year old will be affected and think he can also be sent away if he misbehaves is very important that I haven't thought about
This is obviously the last resort
Over the years we have put up with so much with him and never even thought about sending him away.
This is till where I can handle
s-xual abuse is it this is where I break
We are going to talk to a therapist tomorrow myself and my husband to make an informed decision
Once again he said he couldn't stop it
It might have been a silly game
But it had a name to it it was more than once and he said he couldn't stop it
I am not willing for it to get to actual rape for it to be too late
They share a room
So the 4 year old has been sleeping with me
But can't do that forever
And can't be on tipytoes scared in my own home for my kids and my baby's safety
The whole story is such a big nightmare
Thank k you all for your help on and no judgement

imasinger

Tue, Aug 28 2018, 11:13 am

amother wrote:

This is all very overwhelming and scary!

I agree that if he's saying he can't stop, even when your 4 year old is asking him to, he is a danger, and may need to leave the home, at least until there is some control.

For absolutely certain, under no circumstances should they ever share a room again.

I hope you find clarity and some compassionate answers.

I do think, under the circumstances of the 4 year old having asked him to stop and his refusing, that the issue of the 4 year old internalizing a fear that he too might be sent away is MUCH less significant.

Instead, the 4 year old will likely internalize that you will keep him safe no matter what.

Hugs and hatzlacha!

amother

Natural

Tue, Aug 28 2018, 11:33 am

amother wrote:

I think you are on point for knowing that you must protect your children. Even if the 12 yr old was your biological child, you would need to find a way to protect your other children to the full extent. If a child is 'suffering' in any way at the hands of another sibling, this is abuse that must be addressed immediately. It's not for nothing that your 4 yr old is acting out around him.

You do not need to tell your 4 yr old that the older child is going way because of misbehavior. I'm sure you will get the right advice- but I would think that you can simply explain that for various reasons it will be better for him to live with [whoever].

Good luck!!

amother

Rose

Tue, Aug 28 2018, 1:32 pm

Theres no such thing as overreacting when it comes to protecting children. From others. And from themselves if they are a danger to others. All the more so if its siblings. Living in the same house. With love and calm thoughtful compassion hopefully everyone can be safe. (and if someone posted that their 12 year old brother did this to her when she was 4 what would your advice be then)
Obviously Op you have the most facts on the ground and hopefully will find the right eitzah and hadracha for you and your family.

hugs and hatzlocha