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Forum -> Inquiries & Offers -> Israel related Inquiries & Aliyah Questions
Why do chassidim make aliya? Split
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amother
Coral


 

Post Tue, Jun 11 2019, 5:40 pm
Genuine question, and pardon my lack of worldliness. As a chassidishe family, do you believe in Medinat Israel? If not, why are you moving there if your friends/family/.... are not there? If you do, will your children serve in the IDF and protect Am Israel B'Eretz Israel.
Really not judging, just understanding a world bigger than my own back yard.
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Rappel




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Jun 11 2019, 5:47 pm
amother [ Coral ] wrote:
Genuine question, and pardon my lack of worldliness. As a chassidishe family, do you believe in Medinat Israel? If not, why are you moving there if your friends/family/.... are not there? If you do, will your children serve in the IDF and protect Am Israel B'Eretz Israel.
Really not judging, just understanding a world bigger than my own back yard.


Please forgive me. Im reporting your post for a split/removal because this is a very intense topic here, and irrelevant to the OP. Perhaps it would be better to start a spin-off, since your question will almost certainly derail the thread.
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top mom




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Jun 11 2019, 5:52 pm
I'm not OP, but I'm Chassidish, and living in Eretz Yisrael.
We did not make Aliyah yet, we're in the process. I think Eretz Yisrael belongs to every yid, wether you believe in Medinat Yisrael or not. It's the nicest place IMO to raise a frum family, physically and spiritually.
And, we recognize the State of Israel.Our Chassidus does vote, our Rebbe strongly encourages his Chassidim to vote.
We do not serve in the army, but I highly admire and appreciate those who do.
Any other questions?
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blessedjmom




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Jun 11 2019, 6:01 pm
top mom wrote:
I'm not OP, but I'm Chassidish, and living in Eretz Yisrael.
We did not make Aliyah yet, we're in the process. I think Eretz Yisrael belongs to every yid, wether you believe in Medinat Yisrael or not. It's the nicest place IMO to raise a frum family, physically and spiritually.
And, we recognize the State of Israel.Our Chassidus does vote, our Rebbe strongly encourages his Chassidim to vote.
We do not serve in the army, but I highly admire and appreciate those who do.
Any other questions?


Same here ! Chasidish and Same position about everything you wrote. Except for the aliyah part, since were not yet sure about our plans for the future...
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WitchKitty




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Jun 11 2019, 8:50 pm
Top mom wrote it perfectly.
I'm not totally chassidish, but the main reason my parents brought us to Israel was for chinuch.
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amother
Coral


 

Post Tue, Jun 11 2019, 10:08 pm
Can I ask you to please elaborate on why you don't serve?
If you live there, there you directly benefit from the protection of the army and other people's boys.
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amother
Puce


 

Post Tue, Jun 11 2019, 10:10 pm
amother [ Coral ] wrote:
Can I ask you to please elaborate on why you don't serve?
If you live there, there you directly benefit from the protection of the army and other people's boys.

May I ask you why your sons do not serve in the US army?
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Einikel




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Jun 11 2019, 10:17 pm
amother [ Puce ] wrote:
May I ask you why your sons do not serve in the US army?


Applause Applause Applause
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Mommyg8




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Jun 11 2019, 10:28 pm
amother [ Coral ] wrote:
Can I ask you to please elaborate on why you don't serve?
If you live there, there you directly benefit from the protection of the army and other people's boys.


It's actually just the opposite. YOU are the ones being protected by the men who are learning. If not for the very frum, Israel would be gone a long time ago. Because Eretz Yisroel is not a land like all the other lands, it is a land that vomits up It's inhabitants if they do wrong. The only reason it is still in existence is from the zchus of those who are learning Torah.

אֵ֣לֶּה בָ֖רֶכֶב וְאֵ֣לֶּה בַסּוּסִ֑ים וַֽאֲנַ֓חְנוּ | בְּשֵׁם־יְהֹוָ֖ה אֱלֹהֵ֣ינוּ נַזְכִּֽיר
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SuperWify




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Jun 11 2019, 10:32 pm
Because as a Jew Eretz Yisrael is just as much their home as it is yours.
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amother
White


 

Post Tue, Jun 11 2019, 10:32 pm
amother [ Puce ] wrote:
May I ask you why your sons do not serve in the US army?


Completely different. Serving in the US army is voluntary, in Israel every other Jewish mom is sending her sons off to fight.

And the hesder boys learn too.
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amother
Periwinkle


 

Post Tue, Jun 11 2019, 10:34 pm
amother [ White ] wrote:
Completely different. Serving in the US army is voluntary, in Israel every other Jewish mom is sending her sons off to fight.

And the hesder boys learn too.


those "hesder" guys are aren't the "very frum" clearly. Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes
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sequoia




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Jun 11 2019, 10:35 pm
Mommyg8 wrote:
It's actually just the opposite. YOU are the ones being protected by the men who are learning. If not for the very frum, Israel would be gone a long time ago. Because Eretz Yisroel is not a land like all the other lands, it is a land that vomits up It's inhabitants if they do wrong. The only reason it is still in existence is from the zchus of those who are learning Torah.

אֵ֣לֶּה בָ֖רֶכֶב וְאֵ֣לֶּה בַסּוּסִ֑ים וַֽאֲנַ֓חְנוּ | בְּשֵׁם־יְהֹוָ֖ה אֱלֹהֵ֣ינוּ נַזְכִּֽיר


This argument does not hold water, as it’s not either/or. Young men in the DL and Torani communities serve in the army AND learn Torah.
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Mommyg8




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Jun 11 2019, 10:37 pm
sequoia wrote:
This argument does not hold water, as it’s not either/or. Young men in the DL and Torani communities serve in the army AND learn Torah.


And how are they allowed to do this? Obviously, as you all know, our Rabbanim do not allow boys to serve in the army the way it is structured right now. Maybe there are some Rabbanim who find a heter- which is questionable.
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sequoia




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Jun 11 2019, 10:40 pm
Mommyg8 wrote:
And how are they allowed to do this? Obviously, as you all know, our Rabbanim do not allow boys to serve in the army the way it is structured right now. Maybe there are some Rabbanim who find a heter- which is questionable.


What? Their rabbis not only allow but encourage and say it is a positive mitzvah!

Have you really been thinking this entire time that entire communities are operating on a “questionable heter”???
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zohar




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Jun 11 2019, 10:44 pm
sequoia wrote:
What? Their rabbis not only allow but encourage and say it is a positive mitzvah!

Have you really been thinking this entire time that entire communities are operating on a “questionable heter”???


She wrote "our". Rabbanim from her community.
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Mommyg8




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Jun 11 2019, 10:48 pm
sequoia wrote:
What? Their rabbis not only allow but encourage and say it is a positive mitzvah!

Have you really been thinking this entire time that entire communities are operating on a “questionable heter”???


It's not a "questionable heter ". The Rabbanim from our community don't allow it at all.

I'm sure that you are aware that there are huge frum communities that do not serve in the army at all?
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sequoia




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Jun 11 2019, 10:52 pm
Mommyg8 wrote:
It's not a "questionable heter ". The Rabbanim from our community don't allow it at all.

I'm sure that you are aware that there are huge frum communities that do not serve in the army at all?


Of course I’m aware.

It sounded like you were asking, “how are boys from DL/Chardal communities allowed to serve in the army?” And that’s why I replied, they’re not just allowed, they’re encouraged!
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amother
White


 

Post Tue, Jun 11 2019, 10:52 pm
Mommyg8 wrote:
It's not a "questionable heter ". The Rabbanim from our community don't allow it at all.

I'm sure that you are aware that there are huge frum communities that do not serve in the army at all?


How convenient.
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amother
Puce


 

Post Tue, Jun 11 2019, 10:55 pm
amother [ White ] wrote:
Completely different. Serving in the US army is voluntary, in Israel every other Jewish mom is sending her sons off to fight.

And the hesder boys learn too.

I'm not sure why that makes it different.
"If you live there, you directly benefit from the protection of the army and other people's boys."
As a side point, since every other Jewish mom is sending her sons off to fight, believe me, Israel has enough soldiers.
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