Would you say something?-son being taken advantage of

amother

Gold

Tue, Jun 18 2019, 12:23 am

amother [ OP ] wrote:

His responsibilities are more than that of an average staff employee.
He is in more of a managerial position.
And he is older than an average camper.

Do you think an adult camp staff member in a managerial/supervisory position earns the same compensation as a young staffer with less responsibilities?

And if he is considered an employee then why is he obligated to pay $3000 rent and have to wait until after the summer to ascertain IF and how much money he will earn?

Sorry - I had made that point earlier - I should have been clearer.

He shouldn't be paying rent. Nothing about this set-up suggests he is running a business that he owns.

Functionally, he's an employee.

So the question is - with that in mind - and the fact the camp is feeding him (as it does all staff) - how much should he be paid?

dankbar

Tue, Jun 18 2019, 12:26 am

besides rent for canteen hes also paying for the room & food like a camper....makes no sense & geting paid peanuts

myname1

Tue, Jun 18 2019, 3:10 am

I agree this situation is ridiculous, but your son should be the one to speak to the one in charge, or find a different job.

I worked in an overnight girls' camp as a day camp counselor at about that age. If I remember correctly, I got room and board and some sort of very low salary. I did not pay anything. The camp has that expense (room & board) because they need that staff member. Seems like your son should have the same- he should not pay for a room or rent (that's ridiculous!) and he should get paid some salary (could be commission-based if agreed on clearly before).

If I were your son I would look for a different camp job, but it might be too late for that. This boss sounds like a creep!

ectomorph

Tue, Jun 18 2019, 5:59 am

Here's the question. If he leaves, could he be easily replaced by a 16 year old.

I suspect the answer is yes.

amother

Gold

Tue, Jun 18 2019, 7:57 am

ectomorph wrote:

Here's the question. If he leaves, could he be easily replaced by a 16 year old.

I suspect the answer is yes.

I wouldn't trust a 16 year old with all that.

I just don't like the set-up. Its not right for a rabbi, to treat a teen like this.

bestme

Tue, Jun 18 2019, 8:20 am

Maybe he could ask if his friend could come along or get an assistant so that he does not work so hard.

amother

Dodgerblue

Tue, Jun 18 2019, 8:29 am

ectomorph wrote:

Here's the question. If he leaves, could he be easily replaced by a 16 year old.

I suspect the answer is yes.

I doubt it. I'm part of the yeshivish world and I know that this is industry standard. I still don't think it's right.

amother

Tue, Jun 18 2019, 2:06 pm

amother [ Gold ] wrote:

I'm not set on dissecting the amount of earnings as much as the deceptive arrangement that my son was positioned into.

The way I interpret the agreement is that the camp director was planning on using my son as an employee and keeping the profits from the canteen.

He knew my son from prior years as a camper and trusted him to run the canteen efficiently and lucratively.

Yet he misrepresented the agreement as:
"you own the canteen business-pay me rent and keep the profits".
"But you won't have access to the records".
"Just trust me-I'll do the accounting and let you know how much you earned".
(Apparently, it wasn't that clear-cut and simple to calculate the profits as the Rabbi took many months until he had the numbers).
"And we won't pay a camper to assist you because you're the owner and working for yourself-we won't even give you an option to tap into some of your earnings so you have the option to hire someone to help you".

(I don't know the exact words that were verbalized but this was the gist of it-my son expected to earn a few thousand dollars).

This way camp director gives my son the incentive and motivation to invest a lot of effort and energy into the business so he could maximize profit for himself-be innovative, expand the menu, shop in Costco for some provisions and shlep them to the camp, make many runs to Shoprite to purchase soda cans for the price advantage etc...

Yet the director must have had a good estimate of how much profit the canteen nets on average and known that my son would be left with very little money if any at all.

To summarize, my instincts tell me there was never any intention to share a substantial amount of profits with my son and that giving my son the idea that he is the owner of the canteen business was a disguise for getting my son to earn a nice amount of profit for the camp director.

Maybe I'm wrong.
I don't know.

Mollie

Tue, Jun 18 2019, 2:11 pm

ectomorph wrote:

Here's the question. If he leaves, could he be easily replaced by a 16 year old.

I suspect the answer is yes.

The answer is yes. Running the canteen is a high profile position

amother

Tue, Jun 18 2019, 2:16 pm

Mollie wrote:

The answer is yes. Running the canteen is a high profile position

Well of course a 16 year old would be happy to volunteer for the position.

But few if any camp directors would trust one to run a canteen.

I don't think you understand what it entails if you think it's so simple.

amother

Pewter

Tue, Jun 18 2019, 2:32 pm

amother [ OP ] wrote:

OP, yes, your son is being taken advantage of.
Now what? Would you calling help? Can he speak up? Can he renegotiate for this year? Can you empower him to?

amother

Gold

Tue, Jun 18 2019, 3:27 pm

amother [ OP ] wrote:

I agree with you - especially if he was lead to believe that the canteen performs better than it actually does.

creditcards

Mon, Jun 24 2019, 12:55 am

I think you can definitely call. I definitely would. It doesn't take away from the fact that he is responsible adult who works hard if he needs help sticking up for himself. I would stick up for my kid.

ectomorph

Mon, Jun 24 2019, 3:20 am

amother [ OP ] wrote:

I know you don't want to hear it, but 16 year olds are perfectly capable of running a canteen. My chesed girl did at 16.

Your son made a mistake, or was misled - none of us know exactly what happened - and he needs to learn to handle it by himself. He is 19 years old. You can tell him what you think he should do, and hopefully next year he won't do it again. But ultimately he has to start cutting the apron strings if you want him to be a. Independent adult.