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Forum -> Chinuch, Education & Schooling
High school chesed programs
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southernbubby




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Sep 24 2019, 12:22 pm
amother [ Turquoise ] wrote:
Actually, whats twisted is a 15 year old kid has to give up her sundays/weekday afternoons to watch her siblings because the mother is not capable of doing it.. The children are the mothers responsibility, not the daughters so if there are ways around it then the older kids shouldnt be burdened with the responsibility of taking care of the younger kids.


I didn't grow up frum and was expected to drive my younger siblings everywhere from the age of 16 to free up my mother. Was every after school moment supposed to be for outside activities or could the mother that provided the home expect some help?
I also worked and went to school.
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little neshamala




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Sep 24 2019, 12:28 pm
ShishKabob wrote:
If I am comprehending this properly, it sounds like a very distorted view.
A mother has to twist herself into a pretzel and make playdates and what not with the younger kids so the 15 year old should be available to do chesed elsewhere?
If this is not insanity what is?


I agree with this.
Ive seen plenty of examples, its ridiculous.
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amother
Tangerine


 

Post Tue, Sep 24 2019, 1:24 pm
amother [ OP ] wrote:
I don't ask them for help because one is dorming, and the other arrives home at 9:30 in the evening.

Curiosity satisfied Smile?


OP, if you feel so strongly about the need for children to help out at home, why dont you complain to your son’s school about the long school hours? I’m curious about why you have a problem with your daughters school requiring an hour of after school time each week, but seem fine with your son staying at school until 9:30.
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amother
OP


 

Post Tue, Sep 24 2019, 1:49 pm
amother [ Tangerine ] wrote:
OP, if you feel so strongly about the need for children to help out at home, why dont you complain to your son’s school about the long school hours? I’m curious about why you have a problem with your daughters school requiring an hour of after school time each week, but seem fine with your son staying at school until 9:30.


Aaahh, so then you haven't connected me to all those threads ranting against the injustice of the yeshivas' hours!!!

And just to point out - you see how easy it is to make assumptions about strangers. Just because I haven't discussed that topic on this thread, does is no way mean I'm fine with it. Lack of evidence for something is by no means proof of that something.
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professor




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Oct 01 2019, 11:02 pm
amother [ OP ] wrote:
Aren't they overlooking that chessed begins at home? To me this sounds like they're teaching the kids to do it for the glory, for the sake of being recognized.

Regardless, either way why can't this program be voluntary.? Let the mothers decide if they do or don't want their kids to participate.

It's actually better. Kids love to play with their friend's little sibling and they treat them much better than their own for some reason. I LOVE this idea!
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FranticFrummie




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Oct 02 2019, 7:15 am
Oysh! 6 pages! This must have really hit a nerve. Forgive me for not having read all of the posts, but I want to offer you validation.

OP, I really hear your frustration, exhaustion, and need for your DD's help.

Children almost never want to help at home, because it is "boring". Helping at someone else's house is a change of pace. Around Pesach lots of families I know "trade teens" to help kasher the kitchen and do general cleaning, and you won't hear a single one of them grumbling about it, because it's "new" to them.

I really don't think it's for the glory, I think that it's good for teens to see what other people's lives are really like. If they think the grass is greener on the other side of the fence, maybe they'll think again and appreciate their own home life.

If you are really stuck for help, maybe you can apply to the school to have one of the chesed girls come to you, while your DD is out at someone else. You should deserve help as much as the next person!

As for the boys, I hope that they are building succot, cleaning cars for Pesach, and doing other things for the community. Mowing an elderly neighbor's lawn would be a good start. The days of the "pampered princes" needs to end! Boys should be expected to sign up at least twice a month to do small home repairs, even if it's just changing a lightbulb in a high ceiling; or mentoring a special needs boy, anything to get them out of themselves.
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southernbubby




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Oct 02 2019, 8:26 am
There are neighborhoods in the frum community where washing dishes and shoveling snow is always done by hired help and parents don't want to put their teens in that category. They might send their sons to learn with an elderly man but expect that someone else tends to his property.
I think that whatever chessed is chosen, it should not be objectionable to the teen or her family or take away from her ability to help her own. Married siblings and aunts should take priority over non-relatives. So should elderly grandparents and great grandparents.
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amother
Ruby


 

Post Wed, Oct 02 2019, 8:29 am
southernbubby wrote:
There are neighborhoods in the frum community where washing dishes and shoveling snow is always done by hired help and parents don't want to put their teens in that category. They might send their sons to learn with an elderly man but expect that someone else tends to his property.
I think that whatever chessed is chosen, it should not be objectionable to the teen or her family or take away from her ability to help her own. Married siblings and aunts should take priority over non-relatives. So should elderly grandparents and great grandparents.


Why are we too good to wash dishes and shovel snow?
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southernbubby




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Oct 02 2019, 8:42 am
amother [ Ruby ] wrote:
Why are we too good to wash dishes and shovel snow?


Does Baron Trump do domestic and yard work? There are families who are wealthy enough to have help for these activities and I did hear one older lady say that "our girls are not the help".
The two times that the mitzvah of reloading a donkey appears in the Torah apparently only applies to someone who routinely handles donkeys and those who are not in that category (Torah scholars and the wealthy) are exempt. If you know more about the mitzvah than I do, please post it.
Do you think that teens who never wash dishes or shovel snow should be forced to do it for someone else? Encouraging it is one thing but I don't know how many of the parents will be on board with making it into a requirement.
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FranticFrummie




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Oct 02 2019, 9:30 am
southernbubby wrote:
There are neighborhoods in the frum community where washing dishes and shoveling snow is always done by hired help and parents don't want to put their teens in that category.


And so we create the next generation of entitled people with no life skills.

Don't act surprised when DD's new husband refuses to take out the trash or diaper the baby. Don't sympathize when DS complains that his new wife leaves piles of dirty dishes in the sink all week.

If a teen is healthy enough to shovel snow, let him do it! Everyone needs exercise. If he does it with a friend, they could have a lot of fun.

It never killed anyone to wash a dish or two. What if her chosson is not wealthy? The girl's first apartment might not have a dishwasher, and she needs to know how to keep her home neat and clean without hired help.

I was not raised with the concept of "Get a [non jew] to do it." Having help is a luxury, and if you can't do it yourself then you need to get help, but it's not an automatic given.
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amother
Ruby


 

Post Wed, Oct 02 2019, 9:34 am
FranticFrummie wrote:
And so we create the next generation of entitled people with no life skills.

Don't act surprised when DD's new husband refuses to take out the trash or diaper the baby. Don't sympathize when DS complains that his new wife leaves piles of dirty dishes in the sink all week.

If a teen is healthy enough to shovel snow, let him do it! Everyone needs exercise. If he does it with a friend, they could have a lot of fun.

It never killed anyone to wash a dish or two. What if her chosson is not wealthy? The girl's first apartment might not have a dishwasher, and she needs to know how to keep her home neat and clean without hired help.

I was not raised with the concept of "Get a [non jew] to do it." Having help is a luxury, and if you can't do it yourself then you need to get help, but it's not an automatic given.


Thank you!!!
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amother
Dodgerblue


 

Post Wed, Oct 02 2019, 9:37 am
I d think that there is a benefit to all children learning how to clean. Someone I know likes to tell ( hope I'm telling it over correctly) how when she was growing up her mother would say even though *I* have a cleaning lady it doesn't mean that *you* don't need to clean. I hope for your sake that when you grow up you will also be able to have cleaning help but in case you can don't I want you to know how to clean. She's living a different lifestyle then her parents and definitely cleans here own bathrooms. She's appreciative that she was taught how to.

That being said I don't think that that is the school's job to make sure every child has washed a dish and folded a towel. I personally would prefer my kids learn to do chessed by joining my dh when he goes to do chessed as opposed to washing someone else's dishes.
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southernbubby




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Oct 02 2019, 10:36 am
FranticFrummie wrote:
And so we create the next generation of entitled people with no life skills.

Don't act surprised when DD's new husband refuses to take out the trash or diaper the baby. Don't sympathize when DS complains that his new wife leaves piles of dirty dishes in the sink all week.

If a teen is healthy enough to shovel snow, let him do it! Everyone needs exercise. If he does it with a friend, they could have a lot of fun.

It never killed anyone to wash a dish or two. What if her chosson is not wealthy? The girl's first apartment might not have a dishwasher, and she needs to know how to keep her home neat and clean without hired help.

I was not raised with the concept of "Get a [non jew] to do it." Having help is a luxury, and if you can't do it yourself then you need to get help, but it's not an automatic given.


My DD was very afraid of animals because she was nearly thrown from a horse when she was 8. Friendship Circle sent her to a house with a large dog and she couldn't handle it. Should she have been forced to stay and deal with the dog? Whose place was it to decide that she must make peace with the dog? How would forcing her to be with the dog make her feel about doing chessed later?
Friendship Circle handled the school chessed program and I was the type of mother that wanted my way so it was goodbye doggie.
I think that if a kid wants to shovel snow, wash dishes, or take care of the dog, by all means give him or her that opportunity but this is an area where the teen and his or her family should have choices.
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