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Convert to Judaism arrested and abused by PA



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BadTichelDay




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, Oct 27 2019, 7:39 am
It was in the news already a few days ago, but I can't stop thinking of it:
There is this Palestinian man from Hebron who converted to Judaism in Israel very recently. According to the news reports, he was arrested by Palestinian Authority forces security forces over two weeks ago and has been held in custody ever since. He claims to have been tortured during that time on multiple occasions, which left his limbs badly burned.
The 50-year-old worked at a supermarket in the Jerusalem area. He converted on erev Rosh Hashanah at the strict Haredi court of Rav Nissim Karelitz זצ"ל, in Bnei Brak. Unfortunately, he has no Israeli citizenship yet.
I really hope he gets out of that alive. The Palestinian Authority is notorious for torture of people they consider "traitors" and there have been cases of prisoners dying of sudden "heart attacks" during interrogations before. Some Israeli organizations are attempting to help him. Maybe one should try to involve US organizations as well. I mean, this man is a Jew now and going through all this because he's a Jew. More than that, apparently his grandfather saved the lives of Jews during the Hebron massacre of 1929. I'll take to saying tehillim for him (bli neder). As we don't have his name, it would be Ploni ben Avraham Avinu.

https://www.ynetnews.com/artic......html

https://www.bhol.co.il/news/1041099
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FranticFrummie




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, Oct 27 2019, 7:43 am
Unfortunately, the Rabbanut does not recognize Haredi conversions. The Jewish Agency only goes by who the Rabbanut says is Jewish, and so this poor man is going to be hung out to dry. I doubt the Israeli government will lift a finger to help him.

If civilian groups can help, that is the only hope he has.
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professor




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, Oct 27 2019, 8:28 am
Could yad le'achim help?
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PinkFridge




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, Oct 27 2019, 10:29 am
badtichelday, thank you for letting us know. I said some Tehillim now and will try to have in mind next time I say Matir assurim.
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shabbatiscoming




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, Oct 27 2019, 11:15 am
This story seems a bit fishy. And I am not saying its made up or anything and I feel horrible for this man, if he is a convert or not, but the story just does not add up. I mean, if Israel knows about him being a convert, why are they not helping him? And there are organizations that help such people. Something just is not adding up, in my mind.
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PinkFridge




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, Oct 27 2019, 11:19 am
shabbatiscoming wrote:
This story seems a bit fishy. And I am not saying its made up or anything and I feel horrible for this man, if he is a convert or not, but the story just does not add up. I mean, if Israel knows about him being a convert, why are they not helping him? And there are organizations that help such people. Something just is not adding up, in my mind.


In a way, reading this, I feel very relieved!
I do hope we get to the truth of this and meanwhile, I'm sure any tefillos will not be a waste.
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BH5745




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, Oct 27 2019, 12:48 pm
PinkFridge wrote:
In a way, reading this, I feel very relieved!
I do hope we get to the truth of this and meanwhile, I'm sure any tefillos will not be a waste.


Sorry if I misunderstand you, but you feel relieved reading that because somebody says maybe this story isn't legitimate, ergo now you don't have to feel upset? Well I feel sad and outraged because what the rabbinut is doing is morally reprehensible, and it's supported by the State. Why should the rabbinut get to deny a Jew the right to make aliyah? Halacha allows rabbis to set up Battei Dinim and make converts at the will of the Beis Din doing the conversion.

The inconvenient and sad truth is this: Ploni ben Avraham Avinu is 100% Jewish now, because he converted via Rabbi Nissim Karelitz. The State of Israel, which cares so much about the welfare of every Jew, won't let Ploni ben Avraham, in addition to Rav Nissim Karelitz's other converts, make aliyah (look up Mark Halawa, a man who did a giur l'chumra via Rabbi Karelitz's beis din). The government-paid rabbis at the Israeli rabbinut don't like conversion courts which operate outside their control, even though they know the halachic ones among those perform valid conversions. This is about power. That's why many chutznik Haredi rabbonims' conversions won't be accepted by the rabbinut either. The rabbinut wants absolute power or at least as much power as they can get.

Not only should we daven for the Jew Ploni ben Avraham, we should daven that Hashem stop allowing the rabbinate to wreak havoc on the lives of innocent Jews such as Ploni ben Avraham and Mark Halawa.
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BadTichelDay




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, Oct 27 2019, 3:31 pm
The story was published in several well known news outlets, both in Hebrew and English, among them the websites of the Jerusalem Post, Ynetnews, Israel National News, Kikar and be'chadrei Charedim. How do we ever know if news are true, I mean?
And in this case, there are some "real world" connections: it says that he studied for his giyur in Machon Meir, which is a well known yeshiva, my dh himself studied there long ago. One could call them and ask them. Also, the articles say that he was in contact with Chaim Perg of the Jewish community in Hebron - again, a real person whom one can easily track down,call and ask. The Jewish community in Hebron isn't that big. If it was a fake story, these references would probably not be there (or the persons involved would protest to have them removed).
So, it does sound authentic to me.

The other thing is, I don't think one can blame the Israeli Rabbinate in this case. He converted on erev Rosh Hashana. He was forced into a car and abducted on erev Yom Kippur. That means there was no time for him to go through the application process for Israeli citizenship or recognition of his giyur. There was also no time for anyone to deny any application of his in case he started at all.

Edit to add: As far as to Israel not helping him - it's presumably not so easy. So far, he has only the citizenship of the Palestinian Authority. And their law enforcement arrested him. So he is a Palestinian citizen under arrest by Palestinian police for an alleged assault on Palestinian family members of his. That makes it legally difficult for Israel to just walk in and bomb him out of the prison he's held in. And keep in mind, it took Israel 5 years to get Gilad Shalit who was an Israeli citizen and soldier out of Gaza (different case, I know, but just saying, it's not so easy.)
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PinkFridge




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, Oct 27 2019, 4:28 pm
BadTichelDay, I didn't open any links. I took ShabbatIsComing at face value, figuring she has facts on the ground, and maybe wishful thinking on my part.
It sounds like a very sad situation, and I'm glad I didn't daven mincha yet - this was a good reminder to daven.
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BadTichelDay




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, Nov 24 2019, 7:17 am
Arutz 7 posted a brief update in their newsflash about him today:
(can't copy the link because it's a flash item only, not an article)

---------------

Convert captured by PA partially released
Sunday, November 24, 2019
David, the convert to Judaism who was captured by PA security forces, was released to house arrest in Hevron. Attempts by the PA to persuade him to withdraw his conversion continue.

The convert, who underwent a conversion process in Rabbi Karelitz's conversion court but has not yet completed the Israeli citizenship procedure at the Interior Ministry, was arrested last Yom Kippur eve after arriving in Carmi Tzur in Gush Etzion to meet his son.
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Ruchel




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, Nov 24 2019, 7:33 am
I reaaaaally hope they'll help him. But yes, it's not always "the ultra" who don't accept others. I'll be praying.
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PinkFridge




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Dec 18 2019, 8:31 am
I'm assuming this info is correct. Someone sent me a challah request for
"David Ben Sarah Imeinu for Pidyon Shvuim. He is the Palestinian who converted, and was subsequently jailed and tortured by the PA. He was released, but was then forced to turn himself in again when the Hamas threatened to torture and kill his family. He is now being held by Hamas."
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Petra




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Jul 06 2020, 9:46 am
Found this thread.

Any updates on this man?
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