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Working Mom's Raise Their Kids
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amother
Hotpink


 

Post Tue, Nov 19 2019, 11:28 pm
SixOfWands wrote:
Spoken by someone so craven that they have to say it anonymously.

I took my babies and toddlers to the park. Pointed our flowers. Spent countless hours building Lego and blocks and train tracks. And every other thing you mention. I even taught them to read and write.

That's because I'm a mother.

What I never felt the need to do, however, is to diminish others' parenting in order to make it seem like I'm more worthwhile.


This rudeness is uncalled for and I reported this post.
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ora_43




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Nov 20 2019, 1:09 am
The problem is that if we make this a battle over whether or not working moms manage to do it all, then there's no way to not say something horribly offensive.

If we say that working moms don't manage to do everything with their kids/ at home that at-home parents do, working moms will be offended.

If we say that SAHMs' sacrifices to be home are a complete waste, because they could do literally everything they do at home with the kids and also work if they just worked smarter not harder, SAHMs will be offended.

So why not look at it differently?

I don't do everything an at-home parent does, but I do other things.

My house is a mess, I haven't dusted in eons, there are non-essential doctor's appointments I've been meaning to make for a couple months now, the walls in the living room have needed painting for more than a couple months, and I'm starting to worry that a couple of my friends might be about to forget my name.

On the other hand, I'm in great shape for retirement savings, we were able to send the kids to a fun science camp last summer and they loved it, I'm modeling financial stability for my kids, I'm showing them what it means to get an education and use it, I'm gaining knowledge that I can pass on to my kids (eg on how to build a career).

Everything has its ups and downs.
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ora_43




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Nov 20 2019, 1:19 am
And when my kids were younger, they were in daycare. They liked daycare. They had wonderful carers and enjoyed the other kids.

We missed moments together during those daytime hours, but we have moments together from afternoons and Shabbat, and we're all benefiting now from the fact that dh and I both have degrees and careers.
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amother
Periwinkle


 

Post Wed, Nov 20 2019, 1:41 am
amother [ White ] wrote:
Everyone is mentioning laundry, homework, dishes, supper etc but isn't being a mom so much more than "getting things done"?
You can be the busiest person who gets the most done in the least amount of time, but at the end of the day are your kids getting the best of you? Or are they getting what's left of you?
I don't know why so many people seem to glorify "busy-ness" and "who works hardest". It's not a competition. What matters most is knowing how much you can handle so that you still function as a human being (and a nice one at that).
Whether it means going to work or staying home or having a cleaner, who cares? It shouldn't be about who has the most stressful life but about making sure you're not using up all your energy in the wrong places.


Reading through this thread. By far my best post in this thread!!!

Signed
A daughter of a mom who's energy was spent on the least important things and suffered from it

A working mom who hardly sends her baby out of the house has no cleaning help and doesn't think she's one bit better or working harder than sahm
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mig100




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Nov 20 2019, 1:43 am
allthingsblue wrote:
There are two types of SAHM:
Those who need the money gut sacrifice it so they can be home, giving up on things like cleaning help, or playgroup, or takeout etc. , shopping around town for the best deals...

And those whose husbands make such a good living that they don't need to work- and they are also able to have cleaning help, takeout, order groceries etc.

The first category can be just as stressful as working. The second category has to be less stressful.


As if life was that simple and everyone fit into 2 clear cut categories

Ok I get what your saying..
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amother
Honeydew


 

Post Wed, Nov 20 2019, 2:34 am
SixOfWands wrote:
Spoken by someone so craven that they have to say it anonymously.

Why does anonymity indicate cravenness? And if it does, why is pointing it out any more relevant than any other ad hominem attack?
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amother
Denim


 

Post Wed, Nov 20 2019, 3:00 am
amother [ Azure ] wrote:
Bothers me so much when I hear SAHM complain "do they think I dont do anything all day? I have to buy groceries and make supper and clean the house and make apwpointments and go to appointments, and speak to the insurance companies and pay the bills...."
Working mothers do all that. But they have to do it all after hours.
So they deserve tremendous acknowledgement. Thats just the way it is.


This.
People who think being a sahm is difficult wouldn't even survive a week being a working mom. That's just the truth.
Yet they think everyone owes them respect..
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Ruchel




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Nov 20 2019, 4:41 am
Oy the trainwreck
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amother
Denim


 

Post Wed, Nov 20 2019, 4:57 am
SixOfWands wrote:
I suppose we could discuss the SAHMs I know who could never be bothered to come to their kids' games or to wait at the bus stop, or who expected my sitter to be happy to take their kids off the bus. Or who clearly never looked at their kids' homework or curriculum.

Or we can just put it down to different parenting styles or priorities.



This. My mom was a sahm. She had a cleaning lady come 3 times a week for 4 hours, she had sitters for us.
My parents were NEVER at a teacher parent conference, they never came to any school performance. I spend more time with my kids (working full time) than my mom ever did with us. She was just lazy.
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amother
Powderblue


 

Post Wed, Nov 20 2019, 5:03 am
amother [ Wine ] wrote:
everyone is mentioning laundry, dishes supper..
yes working mothers do all that just in a shorter amount of time. Those are housewife duties.

but you cannot compare actual mothering -actual physical presence with your babies- between a working mother and a stay at home.

SAHM can take their babies and toddlers to the park. Point out the flowers. bake cookies, build lego creations. watch their vocabulary develop, encourage confidence and skills. help them master how to put on their socks, how to zip their coats. read them stories, watch their every fall, be there to kiss them and help them back up. hug them and love them at sll different points throughout the day. for children of working mothers the babysitters do all that, if they even do it. obviously by around age 4 or 5 they're all in school anyway. but you cannot say that a working mother mothers her babies and toddlers in the same way that a SAHM mother does.



Thank you!!!!!
Housekeeping is not motherhood!
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chanchy123




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Nov 20 2019, 5:11 am
amother [ Denim ] wrote:
This.
People who think being a sahm is difficult wouldn't even survive a week being a working mom. That's just the truth.
Yet they think everyone owes them respect..

I largely agree, but not in a mean way. Actually, I'm pretty sure it would work the other way around too. Women who are happy being working away from home moms, **by choice** probably would not enjoy being stay at home moms long term (since I'm assuming most if not all of us have done it temporarily during maternity leave) either.

I am a working mom too, I also find that I'm so much more busy than women who don't work or women who work very part time. But I tend to agree with opinion raised here - I'm not sure that me being constantly in a chase against time trying to keep things together in the work front and home front is beneficial. Not sure I deserve brownie points for running the rat race. Driving yourself crazy is not valuable in itself.

So while I agree it's harder to play both fields I'm just not sure it's better. I don't think it's necessarily worse either. It doesn't mean we're better or worse people or parents. We certainly **do** raise our children. But the mommy wars are pointless. We should all just accept that different parenting models suit different families in different societies and time periods, with different circumstances and conditions.
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amother
Chocolate


 

Post Wed, Nov 20 2019, 5:55 am
amother [ Wine ] wrote:
everyone is mentioning laundry, dishes supper..
yes working mothers do all that just in a shorter amount of time. Those are housewife duties.

but you cannot compare actual mothering -actual physical presence with your babies- between a working mother and a stay at home.

SAHM can take their babies and toddlers to the park. Point out the flowers. bake cookies, build lego creations. watch their vocabulary develop, encourage confidence and skills. help them master how to put on their socks, how to zip their coats. read them stories, watch their every fall, be there to kiss them and help them back up. hug them and love them at sll different points throughout the day. for children of working mothers the babysitters do all that, if they even do it. obviously by around age 4 or 5 they're all in school anyway. but you cannot say that a working mother mothers her babies and toddlers in the same way that a SAHM mother does.


Some of us spend hours researching and pay a bit more for a babysitter who treats our child like their own and does those things (with the added bonus of extra kids for our kids to play with). We fill our weekends and early morning and busy afternoons with those snuggles and activities.

I’ve met SAHM who are so busy with all their activities that they leave the baby with the housekeeper at times to make it to the gym or a shiur. Or their baby comes alone and chills in the stroller so they can go out for coffee every morning.

It all depends on the parent and what they do with the time they have
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mommy3b2c




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Nov 20 2019, 6:58 am
ora_43 wrote:
So what are you imagining SAHMs doing, doing the work 3x slower just to have something to do? Finishing early and staring at the wall?

I work, and I really, but really, don't understand the insistence on saying that working moms do everything SAHMs do. Of course I don't do all of the things a SAHM does. I don't have the magic ability to make more hours in the day. The hours that I spend at work are hours not spent at home. The things I would have done during that time (whether that's cleaning the house, or making a nutritious lunch, or volunteering in the neighborhood, or whatever else) either don't get done, or are done by someone else.

If someone says working moms aren't raising their kids, or have it easy, or whatever, that's unkind and untrue and obviously I don't agree. But if someone says I don't do everything a SAHM does - well, yeah. Of course I don't.


Umm yes actually. Sah moms have the luxury of taking it much slower. They can make appointments when it’s convenient for them. They can take more time making supper and baking. They can take a longer lunch and do laundry when their kids are in school instead of folding laundry while doing homework with the kids. They can shop in stores instead of online because they have time....
The list can go on.

And of course everyone does have different circumstances. The working mom with a live in nanny and full time cleaning help most likely does have it a lot easier then the SAHM with 13 kids on a very tight budget with no help at all.
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Mommyg8




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Nov 20 2019, 7:16 am
So I'm curious:

From reading through this thread it seems that most women who work, want to work, and those that stay at home, it's because they made that decision.

Am I living in a alternative reality? Almost everyone I know who works while they have small children is working because they have to, not because they want to. Bills have to be paid no matter what, and not always is one salary enough to cover it all.

What's the point in arguing who is a better mother, maybe I really didn't have enough time for my kids when they were little because I was working. But it sure beat living on the streets...
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ora_43




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Nov 20 2019, 7:28 am
mommy3b2c wrote:
Umm yes actually. Sah moms have the luxury of taking it much slower. They can make appointments when it’s convenient for them. They can take more time making supper and baking. They can take a longer lunch and do laundry when their kids are in school instead of folding laundry while doing homework with the kids. They can shop in stores instead of online because they have time....
The list can go on.

Maybe it's like this in some communities.

Me, I only know maybe two people who've been full-time at-home parents even after their kids were all in school. So for me SAHM is virtually synonymous with being home with kids, not with lounging around the house eating long lunches.

(And the two I know who stayed home even after their youngest was in school had 5+ kids and spouses working more than 60 hours per week, so it wasn't like they had extra time during the day, either.)
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zaftigmom




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Nov 20 2019, 7:37 am
Of course working moms raise their kids! A good mother is a good mother. Working or staying at home has nothing to do with it.
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Ravenclaw




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Nov 20 2019, 8:09 am
And... let the Mommy Wars begin.

Seriously, we all work hard. People compare to make themselves feel better, but it’s irrelevant.
SAHMs work hard. Often they do things that WMs don’t get to—like ironing or cooking more elaborate meals.
Working mothers work hard. They have to do all the regular work after hours, and sometimes they even kill themselves to iron as well.
Part time working moms have it hard. They feel the need to keep up with the SAHMs standards while working.
Working mothers with nannies have it hard. They feel guilty and still try to do their best for their child’s development.

Meanwhile people are dealing with their own lives and problems that you don’t know. It’s not a competition. We all work hard, admittedly some harder than others, but trying to figure out where everyone stands in the pecking order of difficulty is unproductive.
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Ruchel




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Nov 20 2019, 8:42 am
Humans first. Whether I'm at home or not I'm not trying to compete or doing elaborate stuff that most of the time isn't appreciated. If you work FT for sure don't iron and do homework
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Ravenclaw




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Nov 20 2019, 8:58 am
Also, I have actually researched this topic pretty extensively, so I will bite and share my findings.
There was so much research both for and against staying home and working. Research seemed to contradict itself. I was trying to find a common thread and figure out why.
Finally I found a study that had isolated one factor: what the mother wanted to do. Turns out that clinched it. Children of mothers who wanted to stay home, and did so, or mothers who were working for fulfillment had the best outcome.
Turns out children feel whether a mother is resentful about how she spends her time and that made the biggest difference.
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Mommyg8




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Nov 20 2019, 8:59 am
Ravenclaw wrote:
Also, I have actually researched this topic pretty extensively, so I will bite and share my findings.
There was so much research both for and against staying home and working. Research seemed to contradict itself. I was trying to find a common thread and figure out why.
Finally I found a study that had isolated one factor: what the mother wanted to do. Turns out that clinched it. Children of mothers who wanted to stay home, and did so, or mothers who were working for fulfillment had the best outcome.
Turns out children feel whether a mother is resentful about how she spends her time and that made the biggest difference.


So children of mothers who work to put food on the table are doomed? (I'm guessing the answer is yes Sad).
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