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Please help-child support-rich
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amother
OP


 

Post Wed, Dec 04 2019, 8:38 pm
Unfortunately future-ex is unemployed and will probably always be. He plans to 'learn' in kollel for life. He anyways wouldn't be able to hold down a job due to mental health etc issues. We've been separated for awhile already. His parents are mega mega wealthy. They've been sending a teeny tiny amount of child support-way less than just about anyone gives. And they want to continue that way. I would really like decent and even nice support. Thing is would I even gain anything by fighting for more - as ex is unemployed and not really employable. His parents are supporting him and will support him for life, they are SUPER wealthy. But I'm assuming that doesn't translate into me getting more support as they are the grandparents and not the parents...does anyone know the laws and if there's anything I can do? im in ny
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amother
Lilac


 

Post Wed, Dec 04 2019, 8:47 pm
AFAIK there's nothing you can do. Grandparents don't have a legal responsibility to support.
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amother
Babyblue


 

Post Wed, Dec 04 2019, 9:34 pm
amother [ OP ] wrote:
Unfortunately future-ex is unemployed and will probably always be. He plans to 'learn' in kollel for life. He anyways wouldn't be able to hold down a job due to mental health etc issues. We've been separated for awhile already. His parents are mega mega wealthy. They've been sending a teeny tiny amount of child support-way less than just about anyone gives. And they want to continue that way. I would really like decent and even nice support. Thing is would I even gain anything by fighting for more - as ex is unemployed and not really employable. His parents are supporting him and will support him for life, they are SUPER wealthy. But I'm assuming that doesn't translate into me getting more support as they are the grandparents and not the parents...does anyone know the laws and if there's anything I can do? im in ny


Speak to an attorney. If he is getting support, that might be something that could be considered when cold support is calculated. The grandparents may be willing to pay things directly for the GC.
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amother
OP


 

Post Wed, Dec 04 2019, 10:06 pm
amother [ Babyblue ] wrote:
Speak to an attorney. If he is getting support, that might be something that could be considered when cold support is calculated. The grandparents may be willing to pay things directly for the GC.
what does GC mean? thanks
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cbsp




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Dec 04 2019, 10:08 pm
amother [ OP ] wrote:
what does GC mean? thanks


GrandChild(ren)
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amother
Blue


 

Post Wed, Dec 04 2019, 10:14 pm
Our of curiosity - are grandparents providing less for their GC now that GC are not living (I assume) with their father.
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ellacoe




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Dec 04 2019, 10:22 pm
If your husband is employable, meaning healthy, (even people with mental health issues are employable) and fit etc a court could impute income to him, which would effect your child support. In addition if he is living with his parents and they are paying his car lease etc. these benefits could be credited to him when determining child support.

You should speak to a lawyer and get some advice. (If you need a referral you can PM me) You don't have to necessarily go to court, but these are points that could possibly be introduced when calculating child support.

Are you in NY State and are you going through Bais Din, or other channels?

This event may of interest to you. http://divorcespecialistsnyc.com/
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nicole81




 
 
    
 

Post Wed, Dec 04 2019, 10:26 pm
amother [ Babyblue ] wrote:
Speak to an attorney. If he is getting support, that might be something that could be considered when cold support is calculated. The grandparents may be willing to pay things directly for the GC.


I second this. But it depends on how much they give him and if it's somewhat regularly occurring. And whether they want to hide it or not to protect him from having to give the money to the kids.
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amother
Ivory


 

Post Thu, Dec 05 2019, 12:09 am
There's no amount of child support that "just about anyone gives". Some husbands don't pay a penny, others pay less than supposed to. Just saying.
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mirror




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Dec 05 2019, 1:03 am
I don't have any real advice, just a suggestion. Everyone has an ego that needs to be catered to. Try taking pictures of your children with their school projects and toys from home and sending them in an envelope with a friendly letter to your ex-mil each week, sincerely friendly. "I hope you are doing well. This week Sara and Rivka made the following projects in school, while Avraham and Yitzchak built this out of lego." Honestly, stoking your ex-mil's ego may help her want to give more.

I also don't know if you had any relationship with your ex-mil, but you ought to call her every erev Shabbos and have your kids get on the phone to wish her a gut Shabbos. This will make her want to give more. You'll be the best fundraiser ever!
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amother
Aquamarine


 

Post Thu, Dec 05 2019, 1:58 am
ellacoe wrote:
If your husband is employable, meaning healthy, (even people with mental health issues are employable) and fit etc a court could impute income to him, which would effect your child support. In addition if he is living with his parents and they are paying his car lease etc. these benefits could be credited to him when determining child support.


Yes. In NY there is a minimum income that gets assigned to him regardless of his lack of income. I received a royal sum of $72 per week from my unemployed ex. The figure went up with inflation. Correction, I was supposed to receive $72 per week. And the courts were angry that he was driving a huge, expensive SUV paid for by his parents while unemployed and not paying child support but I don't think it affected his payments.
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seeker




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Dec 05 2019, 2:12 pm
I don't see any clarity on whether OP is currently in court or mediation. To me that would make a HUGE difference. If the divorce is settled or close, I would just kiss child support goodbye and move on with life. But if you're going through heck in court or arbitration anyway, then there's definitely a case to be made - whatever his source of sustenance, whether income or parental support, should be shared with his kids. The argument is strong enough to try if you're in an argument anyway, but not strong enough to get into if you could otherwise move on at this point.
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amother
Coffee


 

Post Thu, Dec 05 2019, 4:27 pm
How many kids do you have? Ages? I would request they pay for children’s education and and give you $ for children’s clothes, food, etc
Good luck!
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ellacoe




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Dec 05 2019, 4:28 pm
What seeker said it very relevant. OP it depends where you are in the process and where it is playing out. In general but not always, Bais Din puts the onus of education on the Father, but isn't always generous with Child Support and Spousal Support. A mediator or arbitrator can be asked to look at the income benefits that one party has and take that into consideration in the calculations. That could be free rent, (in Manhattan one spouse living in a rent controlled apartment can have the value of that taken into account when making calculations), a free car, and other perks that they receive.

Unfortunately, especially in court it is often a matter of luck rather then merit.

Where in the process are you and where is taking place? there are different strategies for each one.
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amother
Powderblue


 

Post Thu, Dec 05 2019, 4:50 pm
Depending on where you live regular gifts from grandparents to the parent can be considered income. And gifts might include paying car loans, rent, educational loans etc. So it will be as if he was earning that money and the state can force him to pay you your children's share of it.
Ask an attorney.
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amother
Red


 

Post Thu, Dec 05 2019, 7:37 pm
amother [ Aquamarine ] wrote:
Yes. In NY there is a minimum income that gets assigned to him regardless of his lack of income. I received a royal sum of $72 per week from my unemployed ex. The figure went up with inflation. Correction, I was supposed to receive $72 per week. And the courts were angry that he was driving a huge, expensive SUV paid for by his parents while unemployed and not paying child support but I don't think it affected his payments.


In NY, remarried, dh receives a grand sum of $25 per month. So it could be worse. And my ex has never made a payment. Ever. Hashem has been good to us that we've been making it ok so far.
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amother
Azure


 

Post Thu, Dec 05 2019, 8:12 pm
as others said you can speak with an attorney who can give you a realistic view of what can be expected in your situation, state, number of children, ages, sometimes length of marriage etc.

unclear as to what "teeny tiny" "decent" and "nice" even mean as far as amounts go

in many states child support is determined by mathematical formula number of children, ages, and spouse income, I don't know how kollel is factored in

typically if not always it is completely irrelevant how much wealth the grandparents do or do not have

probably not much you can do and you certainly do not want to pay legal fees on an unwinnable non starter of an argument --
your attorney can let you know if you are lucky they are paying anything at all or if you have a good chance of a better outcome depending upon your situation - you certainly do not want to do anything to make a not great situation worse chas v shalom

I've seen too many situations where someone thought they were not getting a good deal but in terms of what courts rule and the like they were getting a very good deal -- an honest good lawyer can give you realistic expectations

afaik alimony and spousal support is never paid anywhere anymore

what standard have you been living at when with your husband and what standard is your income at now?

hugs and hatzlocha
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amother
Violet


 

Post Thu, Dec 05 2019, 8:19 pm
Deleted.
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#BestBubby




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Dec 05 2019, 8:22 pm
mirror wrote:
I don't have any real advice, just a suggestion. Everyone has an ego that needs to be catered to. Try taking pictures of your children with their school projects and toys from home and sending them in an envelope with a friendly letter to your ex-mil each week, sincerely friendly. "I hope you are doing well. This week Sara and Rivka made the following projects in school, while Avraham and Yitzchak built this out of lego." Honestly, stoking your ex-mil's ego may help her want to give more.

I also don't know if you had any relationship with your ex-mil, but you ought to call her every erev Shabbos and have your kids get on the phone to wish her a gut Shabbos. This will make her want to give more. You'll be the best fundraiser ever!


OP, this is the best advice. KISS UP, MIL big time. Have the kids call Bubby.
Visit or invite MIL to visit you.

Also, have a Rav tell your MIL you can't pay tuition or for daycamp, new clothes.
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ellacoe




 
 
    
 

Post Thu, Dec 05 2019, 8:32 pm
amother [ Azure ] wrote:
as others said you can speak with an attorney who can give you a realistic view of what can be expected in your situation, state, number of children, ages, sometimes length of marriage etc.

unclear as to what "teeny tiny" "decent" and "nice" even mean as far as amounts go

in many states child support is determined by mathematical formula number of children, ages, and spouse income, I don't know how kollel is factored in

typically if not always it is completely irrelevant how much wealth the grandparents do or do not have

probably not much you can do and you certainly do not want to pay legal fees on an unwinnable non starter of an argument --
your attorney can let you know if you are lucky they are paying anything at all or if you have a good chance of a better outcome depending upon your situation - you certainly do not want to do anything to make a not great situation worse chas v shalom

I've seen too many situations where someone thought they were not getting a good deal but in terms of what courts rule and the like they were getting a very good deal -- an honest good lawyer can give you realistic expectations

afaik alimony and spousal support is never paid anywhere anymore

what standard have you been living at when with your husband and what standard is your income at now?

hugs and hatzlocha


Alimony/Spousal Support is definitely still paid. (also duration of marriage vis a vis alimony is only applicable in some states.)
The standard of living factor is a real concept but it is often hard to get that considered it helps if there is a huge disparity of parental income and the Mother is working if she is capable.

It also all is very dependent on which court you are in.
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