S/O Working women and Chassidish

lilies

Thu, Jan 09 2020, 3:59 pm

The working women collapsing thread makes me wonder about misconceptions applied to being chassidish when it is really a generational thing.
Disclaimer; I don't know much about 'der heim' and prewar daily life.
Were chassidish women not helping out financially?

From what I know (and I really don't know much) it seems everyone helped with parnassah. Whether it was washing people's clothes, mending, being in the clothing industry, grocery stores and the like. I always thought women were very much involved, in some way.

If I'm wrong, please enlighten me.
If I'm right, then it would just be the second-generation post-holocaust that might have been able to make do with one income, buy a house at 23 and so on. Those 'chassidishe mothers' stayed home because they could. There was money to spend and save. It's not a culture, it evolved due to financial comfort.

Chayalle

Thu, Jan 09 2020, 4:08 pm

My great-grandmother H"YD was Chassidish, and she ran a sort of general store out of the front room of her home in Czekoslovakia.

Actually, as a young wife her husband was drafted into the army (WWI) and she started the business to support herself - army wages were pretty meager. She was successful and continued it to help support the family when he came back.

ETA: Later, my grandmother A"H - her daughter - took a job as a receptionist in a doctor's office. She got there every day by riding a bicycle. Yep, a Chassidish young lady - and she was super tzanua, BTW. Apparently it was considered to be perfectly acceptable back then.

I have Chassidish relatives who work. I'm thinking of several who babysit, and one who teaches.

Last edited by Chayalle on Thu, Jan 09 2020, 4:16 pm; edited 1 time in total

tilot37354

Thu, Jan 09 2020, 4:12 pm

Domestic work for SAHM was a lot more intensive in those days. Laundry was back breaking labor by the river instead of sticking a load into machine and pressing button, food was assembled from scratch, water needed to be drawn from a well or river instead of turning a faucet, heating was shlepping wood and building a fire instead of turning a dial on the oven or pressing a button on thermostat, kids weren't in school all day, clothing was made or mended by hand.... Women didn't exactly sit in rocking chairs sipping tea, even if they weren't "working".

max

Thu, Jan 09 2020, 4:29 pm

Some people are just lucky and are really happy and healthy and having a perfect life and others not so much! It reminds me of a speech I once heard about jealousy. If you envy someone because they seem to have something you want you better be willing to take the whole package! Maybe someone you envy has health issues or Shalom bais issues or problems with children or tremendous debt or mental health issues. My Bubby grew up on the lower east side and she always used to say if everyone hung out all their troubles on a laundry line and you could stand in the courtyard and see you will pull your own line in very fast! You never really know what happens behind closed doors probably somebody envys you right now!

amother

Sapphire

Thu, Jan 09 2020, 6:44 pm

I am chassidish and have 2 kids. We are bh doing great with one income. However, I so want to go back to work. I want to feel that sense of accomplishment that folding laundry and cooking and taking care of the kids all day just doesn't give me. Since I dont have a high school diploma(my school didn't give,maybe I can ask them for it) let alone a degree I can't get a decently paying part time job. With babysitting and transportation it just wouldn't pay. Especially since we dont need the money to survive. Since dh believes that money is bashert and hes doing hishtadlus, then why should I be overwhelmed all the time .When I stopped working my husband started making more.I worked for 6 years and made really nice, its not like I dont have experience. But bh for that, I am greatful . I do struggle with the fact that I am a full time mom and too much time on my hands.

forgetit

Thu, Jan 09 2020, 9:49 pm

amother [ Sapphire ] wrote:

I'm in the workforce for 15+ years and can't remember ever being asked for my high school diploma when applying for a job.
There are plenty of jobs that don't need a degree.
If you really want to work, you can try developing a skill, and proving that you're a dedicated, hard worker, with good ppl skills. There are so many industries where no one cares about your (lack of) degree.
I also know many, many women who no longer use their degree because they found their calling elsewhere.
(I can provide a list of actual names by pm if anyone is really interested.)
Your limitation might be that you only want to work p/t more than anything else. Most ppl who have successful p/t positions have it because they first proved themselves to a company by working full time, and became very valuable so their boss allowed them to cut. That being said, there are opportunities. You may not find it in one day, but they exist.

amother

Coffee

Fri, Jan 10 2020, 2:13 pm

I worked for many years, quit when I was having my 4th child thinking I'll do something myself. I'm not self motivated enough. Also, a big chunk of my salary was going to babysitting, and my house was neglected. Although quitting my job didnt help much with the housework .. eek.

Now I'm ready to go back to work. But, I feel unemployable. I went to a job recruitment place. He asked me who my brothers are, my husband is, my brothers in law, everythign BUT about my employment history and my skillset. When he realized that my husband is financially ok, he's like " oh, you're looking for soemthing to fill your time". I said shopping "fills"time .

I found the whole process humiliating. Finding a job in the secular world is complicated bec. of yomim tovim etc.

forgetit

Fri, Jan 10 2020, 3:14 pm

amother [ Coffee ] wrote:

Wow! That's no ok of the recruiter. Sounds like a very 'heimishe' thing. See if you can connect with frum, professional recruiters on LI. I know a fair amount of really nice ones.
BUT, you have to decide on the narrative before you begin. Make yourself valuable. Show what your skills are. Have your resume highlight your strengths. See a coach, if you feel that you need help deciding what your strengths are, or if you want help beefing up your interviewing skills to be able to control the narrative.
Feel free to pm if you want to discuss further. I'm very passionate about women being empowered in the workforce.

meyerlemon44

Fri, Jan 10 2020, 3:22 pm

forgetit wrote:

He must be heimish--every non-Jewish company I've worked for is overly makpid to not ask anything about your personal life, because it can be construed as digging for information that will be used for discrimination. When I was trained to interview people, we couldn't even ask questions like "Did you have trouble getting to the office?" because they might reveal that they use public transit and later claim they're being discriminated against due to that. It was absolutely forbidden to even reference the interviewee's personal life because women are often discriminated against if they're married or have kids.

lilies wrote:

FWIW, I studied modern European history at the graduate level. Women have always worked, often as an extension of their work in the home, but sometimes independant of it. A woman could easily wash her own family's clothes and other peoples' for extra money, grow vegetables and animals for her family and sell the extra, provide childcare to neighbors for barter, etc. That's to say nothing of women who had independant businesses such as tailoring, baking, brewing, midwifery, doctoring, etc. The idea of women staying in the home solely to care for children is a very modern, 19th century one.

amother

Amethyst

Fri, Jan 10 2020, 3:26 pm

amother [ Coffee ] wrote:

It's complicated but only a bit. Many places don't mind that much, especially if you agree to the tradeoff on being available on their holidays. And others just use their vacation days for Yom Tov.

If you really want this, the obstacles aren't that much in your way. Plenty of heimish people work in the secular world. Just grab the bulls by the horns and go for it!

amother

Purple

Fri, Jan 10 2020, 3:32 pm

I'm chassidish and yes I work! I have kh 7 kids and wouldn't stop.. I love working it gets me going...
I lived in a area for about a yr where most ladies don't work, and couldn't handle it..
Its interesting, my friends that don't work tell me that I accomplish more then them in a day..
Working just gives more structure to my life and I don't end up with more time to spend the money I dont have..lol

amother

Coffee

Fri, Jan 10 2020, 3:36 pm

amother [ Amethyst ] wrote:

Thanks for the encouragement!

amother

Coffee

Fri, Jan 10 2020, 3:40 pm

forgetit wrote:

Thank you.