Life. | Imamother

HonesttoGod

Wed, Feb 19 2020, 11:27 am

Op if you find a playgroup / babysitter for let’s say $400 a month and In that time you get a job that makes you $600/700 a month that’s $2-300 extra a month towards bills.

I don’t mean to be rude but if you need the extra money you need to get a. Job!
Like another poster wrote, many many families in NYC are living on two salaries with half the amount of kids.

amother

Linen

Wed, Feb 19 2020, 11:43 am

We're ke'ah family of seven (counting parents) living in Lakewood, as frugally as possible, and we make almost 250k a year and some months we are barely SCRAPING by. Both hubby and I work (him crazy full time, me as full time as humanly possible while being mom) and we are desperately seeking third passive income because we're not making it on this!

TBH we do put a little away plus we have a lot of therapy costs but there are some special needs in the family (about $300 a week), supposdly if ppl don't need that they can have some money to put away, that's what DH says but I say that ppl that don't have therapy have tutoring or medical costs or whatever! So there you go.

amother

Burlywood

Wed, Feb 19 2020, 12:18 pm

amother [ Linen ] wrote:

We are a family of 8 in Lakewood.Pay full tuition. Making it bH and saving a decent amount (401k, wedding accounts) at 180 k - we both work FT. But we live in a small home and our mortgage and utilities are lower then avg. also scrimp a lot on clothing and shoes (id do that even if I was a millionaire) and shop food sales.

amother

Natural

Wed, Feb 19 2020, 11:41 pm

amother [ Salmon ] wrote:

Nope. Not an exaggeration.
I h ave a family of almost nine, and you'd laugh in shock if you heard our income

I am shocked that a famy of 9 can make It on less than 100k

Then again if you are below poverty level and getting Medicaid and tuition cuts that's a separate story. I'm not surprised at all then.

amother

Taupe

Thu, Feb 20 2020, 4:14 am

OP can you take kids in to watch during the day? Your toddler will have friends and you'll earn a few dollars.
Even if you take only 3 children, you'll be earning $21-24/hr, you can keep your own child at home, and work way less than if you got a job in a preschool.
There are always mothers looking for small group environments for their toddlers as a training ground before school starts, and BH boro park has no shortage of children.
Or maybe you have a basement or driveway/garage to rent out?

Moving is not very realistic for a large family unless the situation is dire. And food prices if you need certain hechsheirim, and tuition skyrocket out of town compared to in town prices. We also don't own a car which means we save every month on car payments, upkeep, insurance, gas, parking meters, even tickets (welcome to NY), and we don't have the whole headache of having a car in a crowded neighborhood. Living out of town youd probably need 2 cars and pay for that.

banana123

Thu, Feb 20 2020, 5:40 am

amother [ Coral ] wrote:

Make Aliyah. There are many lovely chassidish communities here, with Yiddish speaking schools.

No. Aliyah is not an escape from poverty.
They will still need to pay rent, find jobs, their children will need to learn Hebrew, depending on their ages they may need help integrating - tutors, therapists, social workers, etc.
Many families who make aliya for the sake of making ends meet find themselves disillusioned, frustrated, wishing they had stayed home. They still struggle to pay bills but they are away from their support network and families, in a country which speaks a foreign language, doing everything that they were doing before except with no family around, a strange bureaucracy and medical system, and suddenly their choices for practitioners are very slim because they need someone who can speak their language and the lines are long and travel is necessary.
Plus OP's eldest is 16, which means she has several children who probably won't pick up Hebrew at the drop of a hat and may resist the move, placing them at risk for social and mental issues.

No. If you wouldn't make aliya regardless, don't make aliya because of poverty. It's just an all-around bad idea.

Plus the general guideline is to come with six months' worth of what you'll need in income, in savings. I highly doubt OP can even scrape together half of that right now.

amother

Firebrick

Thu, Feb 20 2020, 5:47 am

amother [ Crimson ] wrote:

Which communities, and how much cheaper is Israeli life than NY life?

We managed to live on about $1000-$1500, even with a toddler and a baby. Is that possible in NY?

But it means making choices and giving up something big in order to do it. We gave up something big - a few somethings big - because we believe in certain things, and what we gave up allows us to live on less and in keeping with our priorities.

amother

Smokey

Thu, Feb 20 2020, 6:24 am

HonesttoGod wrote:

Yes in theory, but you also have to do the math of how much of that salary is going to taxes and if it bumps you off any gov programs to end up costing you money

Rappel

Thu, Feb 20 2020, 6:27 am

amother [ Firebrick ] wrote:

This family has 9 kids, all of whom have friends and lives already.

And they're not going to be living on $1500 anywhere. Food alone would run up to $2500 a month, by my estimate.

I don't think your answer is truly feasible for them.

amother

Firebrick

Thu, Feb 20 2020, 6:28 am

Rappel wrote:

This family has 9 kids, all of whom have friends and lives already. They're not going to be living on $1500 anywhere. Food alone would run up to $2500 a month, by my estimate. I don't think your answer is truly feasible for them.

I was answering the question of whether it can be cheaper to live in Israel than NY.

amother

Pumpkin

Thu, Feb 20 2020, 6:34 am

amother [ Salmon ] wrote:

Nope. Not an exaggeration.
I h ave a family of almost nine, and you'd laugh in shock if you heard our income

I live in cleveland too with a family of 5 making quite a bit more than 80k and definitely far from rich. Sure, you can live here, get ed choice and not pay a dime toward tuition and have insurance covered 100% through Medicaid. I dont choose to live that way.

Rappel

Thu, Feb 20 2020, 7:48 am

amother [ Firebrick ] wrote:

I was answering the question of whether it can be cheaper to live in Israel than NY.

"Cost" can't only be measured in money.

If you could put a price on the effort involved in uprooting a large family, moving to a different country, adjusting to a new culture healthily, and finding appropriate occupations and putting down roots, then Aliyah stops being for the thrifty.

ora_43

Thu, Feb 20 2020, 8:05 am

If you're living in NYC with seven kids and just one salary, and you can afford to be home full time and have cleaning help, sounds like you're doing pretty well to me!

But yeah, you should worry about savings (also for retirement, do you have retirement savings?).

Like others said, if you worked, you could afford preschool. But if that's not an option, what about working from home? Sometimes businesses are looking for someone to do just 1-2 hours a day of secretarial work. Or you could try a home business of some sort. Eg if you're home with a toddler anyway, would you consider babysitting another toddler or two? Or is there something you're good at making, eg beautifully wrapped gift packages, or invitations? People make businesses out of all sorts of things.

Honestly, I'd recommend a job-job, just to get your foot in the door, so that you can have some income when your kids get older and expenses really pick up. But even a small part-time job could help you save $200 a month or so. Which is better than $0. And if you find you like it, you could try growing your business as you have more time.

And keep in mind that you can't wait for "extra" money in order to save, or you'll never save. Treat savings as equal in importance to the electric bill, or taxes. The money comes out of your salary into a savings account before it hits your checking account. Otherwise it will get spent. Nothing against you personally, that's just how life is for all but the most disciplined 0.1%.

amother

Dodgerblue

Thu, Feb 20 2020, 8:14 am

watergirl wrote:

People love to say this, but it just is not true. When people say get out of the city, they don't mean "Get out of the city and move to Monsey/Lakewood". The US is a massive country, there are many other cities with wonderful frum amenities and low taxes, low tuition, and low cost of living. And where tuition is higher, or higher than the 3k they pay a year in Boro Park, the schools actually want you and work with you on tuition. Property tax in NY/NJ is extremely high.

Where I live, no one pays more than 4k/year in property taxes. Car expenses are the same anywhere, give or take what you would pay for insurance, which is higher in NYC than out. Of course you would have to pay for gas which I suppose BP people don't do? Cost of living is way less out of BP/Monsey/Lakewood because the shtussim just aren't things.

Maybe I should start a spin off, but I think its pretty safe to say, based on my experiences and those of the people I know who made the move, leaving NYC and moving away from that area in general (aka not moving TO Lakewood/Monsey, etc), is absolutely a fantastic way to cut on costs.

Properties in BP are tiny it’s unlikely she’s paying more than $4k a year in RE taxes and I think you’re seriously discounting the difference in tuition cost for 7 children. Sure the schools work with you but if you make a decent salary and you’re in that upper middle class category you’re expected to pay close to full tuition which is almost double Brooklyn. She’d likely just be exchanging a lower mortgage/rent for a higher tuition bill.
That’s not even starting on higher camp and food costs and whether salaries would be comparable and if you’d have to add a commute to get that salary.
Most people I know who make the decision to move OOT do so for the quality of life.

amother

Sapphire

Thu, Feb 20 2020, 8:33 am

I live in monsey and my rent is cheaper then the city but actual expenses are way higher then people living in the city with the same size family. It’s not always cheaper moving out at all. Also uprooting a family is extremely hard. Like others said if she goes and ups her income she probably will not qualify for Medicaid or low income insurances which for the few dollars she will be making and having to pay a sitter and then insurance she will be in a deficit. I would recommend for earning some extra money is to do babysitting by day your home anyways and it actually brings in a decent income.
Regarding savings for the future. I always try to put away for rainy days unfortunately I’ve had to many rainy days and barely have a savings and when my husband speaks to people about it they always tell him most people don’t have a savings they are barely making it. Which I can say is true and not true but I don’t know who lives on credit cards and such and who actually pays there bills.