Da’as Torah | Imamother

amother

Brown

Thu, Feb 20 2020, 2:51 pm

I was raised like you, ema of 4. I thought everyone was like my family. Then I met dh. He asks rabbanim/rabbeim EVERYTHING

Dh is the youngest in his family. His parents were very trusting and naive. His parents home had tv, magazines, unfiltered internet access. He was in the mainstream yeshiva system as a teen learning all day and then walking into a trap of taavos. He clung on to his rabbiem to guide him and formed life long relationships.

On one hand its excessive. He barely makes a decision on his own. On the other hand it makes for a pretty good marriage as we have someome always available and happy to help of there is conflict. I want to defrentiate thou- a rebbi will guide him and a rav will answer shailos. Some people have one person doing both for them. Dh has differnt people for different style shailos. Business, raising children, shalom bayis.

A lot of you will feel this is crazy and over the top like I orginally did but truth is, I made my own decisions on my own. If dh needs help making his he has who to turn to. Hes indecisive so its probably for the best...

amother

Mustard

Thu, Feb 20 2020, 3:06 pm

My DH is the opposite.

He never wants to ask a Sheila and thinks he could figure it out himself by learning the sugya - which is sometimes ok and sometimes not Sad

He also sometimes doesn't even realize there's something to ask.

I have to literally beg him to ask a Rav sometimes, and sometimes I just call and ask myself.

It really bothers me a lot Sad

Ema of 5

Thu, Feb 20 2020, 3:29 pm

amother [ Seagreen ] wrote:

We ask da'as torah before making any major decisions. Naming a baby, regarding which schools to send to, when moving to a new home, medical decisions. It calms me down to know we're doing the right thing.
And of course we ask any halacha/hashkafa questions we may have.

My husband got spoke to his rebbi before we bought our house. When we couldn’t agree about where to send one of our kids, we went to speak to someone about it. The only time we spoke to someone regarding naming a child was when we had two grandparents who shared one name but it the other, and couldn’t decide what to name our child. I don’t think we have ever spoken to a rav about a medical issue.
My husband is much more “I have to speak to my rebbi” than I am. I really believe in looking things up, and using your seichel. That doesn’t negate asking when needed, but I just don’t think that every singe thing needs to be asked.
Also, I believe that there is a big difference between asking for hadracha and asking for a psak.

Mommyg8

Thu, Feb 20 2020, 3:42 pm

This is what I found so far from a quick search on the web:

From the Yated, by Avrohom Birnbaum:

"According to Rav Elchonon Wasserman, daas Torah is reserved for a very small group of exalted individuals who are so permeated with Torah knowledge that their thought processes become saturated with Torah and they are endowed with a special degree of Divine assistance. Therefore, they are most qualified to give advice and set policy even on matters not directly related to Torah. The Torah has answers to everything (see Kovetz Maamarim, vol. 1, page 227).

Most of the time, when people consult with what they call daas Torah, they mean that they are consulting a rabbinic figure who has more Torah knowledge than they have, with the understanding that he is more likely to have seichel hayoshor and a legitimate approach based in Torah knowledge than they have. I don’t think it means that every rebbi with whom one consults has reached the level of his intellect being akin to the Torah’s intellect. That, indeed, is an exalted level reserved for the yechidei segulah of each generation (ibid.)."

https://yated.com/a-thought-about-daas-torah/

This is why I just don't understand when people throw out the term "daas Torah" lightly. Your neighborhood Rav may be a good poiseik, and he may even be a great person to be sho'al eitzah from, but according to the above, he is NOT da'as Torah.

Another interesting link:

http://dafyomireview.com/artic.....d=277

Mommyg8

Thu, Feb 20 2020, 4:03 pm

Ema of 4 wrote:

We ask our Rav halachic shaylos. And we speak to our Rav or really any Rav about situations that we have a question about, but we don't feel that it's a psak that we must follow, and we certainly don't ask such questions such as which school to send to (unless there is a problem of some sort). When I ask a Rav a non-halachic shayla, I feel that I am asking him for an aitzah, but of course, as good litvaks, almost everything is a halachic shayla Wink

.

My husband and I are really in agreement about this, fortunately, and we both don't think every single thing we do needs to be asked.

I'm really curious where this "Which school should I send my kid to" and "What should we name our child" came from, neither my husband or I grew up that way - and I wonder what the source of this would be??? And when did it start? Because it seems like a recent invention (we're in our late 40's).

I know Chassidim ask their Rebbe everything, but we're not Chassidish so... just wondering.

amother

Seagreen

Thu, Feb 20 2020, 4:10 pm

Mommyg8 wrote:

.

My husband and I are really in agreement about this, fortunately, and we both don't think every single thing we do needs to be asked.

I'm really curious where this "Which school should I send my kid to" and "What should we name our child" came from, neither my husband or me grew up that way - and I wonder what the source of this would be??? And when did it start? Because it seems like a recent invention (we're in our late 40's).

I know Chassidim ask their Rebbe everything, but we're not Chassidish so... just wondering.

We don't ask which school to send to or what name should we give. DH just talks over our decisions with his Rebba.

amother

Seagreen

Thu, Feb 20 2020, 4:10 pm

Mommyg8 wrote:

.

My husband and I are really in agreement about this, fortunately, and we both don't think every single thing we do needs to be asked.

I'm really curious where this "Which school should I send my kid to" and "What should we name our child" came from, neither my husband or me grew up that way - and I wonder what the source of this would be??? And when did it start? Because it seems like a recent invention (we're in our late 40's).

I know Chassidim ask their Rebbe everything, but we're not Chassidish so... just wondering.

Double post

essie14

Fri, Feb 21 2020, 12:54 am

Mommyg8 wrote:

We're the same age as you and agree. I didn't grow up with people asking rabbis where they should send their kids to school. DH and I feel we know our kids best. We may ask other parents about a school to get info but how in the world does our shul rabbi know where we should send our kid to?
This just isn't done in our community. No one asks a Rav what they should name their child.
I ask my Rav halachic questions. Naming a child and sending my child to school has zero to do with halacha so it would never enter my mind to ask a Rav.

shabbatiscoming

Mon, Feb 24 2020, 7:39 am

Ema of 4 wrote:

What does da’as torah mean to you, and what role does it play in your life?

To me, da’as torah means letting the torah guide my life, and speaking to a rav when needed- for hadracha, if I have a shaila I don’t know the answer to....

The first and only time I ever heard the term Daas Torah was here on this website. I have never heard that term in my real life in day to day living.
So, it does not play a role in my FRUM life and has no meaning for me.

I ask rabbanim questions that have to do with halacha that we dont know the answers to. Full stop. Other than that, we use our common sense and sfarim to figure things out and talking about things between myself and my husband. Many many many many FRUM jews live their Frum Jewish life that way.

Ema of 5

Mon, Feb 24 2020, 9:17 am

shabbatiscoming wrote:

I went to BY, so I’ve definitely heard the term before, but I’m with you. Use your brain (I’m pretty sure that’s why we have one) and ask a shaila when needed.

keym

Mon, Feb 24 2020, 9:34 am

Mommyg8 wrote:

I'm a bit younger than you. Late 30s.
"Daas Torah" was starting. My parents spoke to their Rav as to what name to add when they named after people who were sick or died young. But my parents did take this Daas Torah thing to an extreme. If the Rav said to add a name of Bracha or life, they literally would only name Chaim or Baruch or ask a Rav to add a different name
But my parents were raised more "modern" and moved to the right, so they probably felt the need to find out all the "rules".
They did discuss what school to send us to. But it was more like should we send to the BY school or Day School. Not like Lakewood should we send to Bais Faiga or Tiferes.

amother

Saddlebrown

Mon, Feb 24 2020, 9:41 am

Ema of 4 wrote:

I went to BY, so I’ve definitely heard the term before, but I’m with you. Use your brain (I’m pretty sure that’s why we have one) and ask a shaila when needed.

Many Rabbonim hold like you.
Come for shailas, halacha or even hashkafa
But don’t make like you can’t decide anything yourself.
Sometimes there are details that can change a decision in halacha or even hashkafa so then one should ask.
But other times people just want someone else to decide for them, to put the weight of the decision on someone else’s beard.

shabbatiscoming

Wed, Feb 26 2020, 4:36 am

amother [ Saddlebrown ] wrote:

But is that really a good thing? Why should this be something to aspire to?

Ema of 5

Wed, Feb 26 2020, 8:59 am

shabbatiscoming wrote:

But is that really a good thing? Why should this be something to aspire to?

It’s not necessarily something to aspire to, it’s a way to do it. Like “this is a very heavy decision, and I might make the wrong decision. I will put it in the rabbis shoulders, and then it will be on him.” Many people believe that when you go to a rabbi, what he says is IT, so if he makes a decision, that’s the answer, and you don’t have to worry about t being wrong, because the rabbi said it. I’m totally describing it wrong, but it’s way too early for me to be awake (even though it’s 9:00AM....)

shabbatiscoming

Wed, Feb 26 2020, 10:23 am

Ema of 4 wrote:

Ema of 4, no, I understand the concept, but I truly dont get why it is a good thing or why people would do that. I would hate to have someone else decide things for me and "live with that". I like making my own decisions and knowing why those decisions are the way they are. I dont want to put that burden on someone else. I think that takes away so much autonomy.

Ema of 5

Wed, Feb 26 2020, 10:48 am

shabbatiscoming wrote:

I don’t either get it, but I think it’s a way of displacing the burden. Like “well, the rabbi told me I should do this, so it will be on him and not on me if I’m doing something wrong.” I like making my own choices, and like you, I wouldn’t want someone else to live with the consequences of voices made regarding my life, but there are people who just don’t want that burden.

amother

Saddlebrown

Wed, Feb 26 2020, 10:53 am

shabbatiscoming wrote:

Many agree with you, including me.
The only exception for me would be when a decision is so Huge that it feels completely impossible for any human to decide, then I’d go ask a real big daas Torah, not any corner shul Rabbi, But a world class gadol hador type of giant, for an eitza and a bracha to go along with it.
I’ve done that around twice in my life so far.
Otherwise we just ask regular shailas of halacha which sometimes border on hashkafa but I know Rabbanim still hold those qualify as shailas.

ETA: I don’t at all look down at anyone who asks Rabbanim/ Mentors for eitzas, it can be a great thing and a wonderful support for many people, to each their own.