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Forum -> Chinuch, Education & Schooling

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amother

Fri, Dec 21 2007, 12:37 pm

The olympic games do not accept professional athletes. If you get paid for your skill, the success does not belong to you, but, to those who paid you. The same is true for learning Torah. Aren't we all told how important it is to support those who learn Torah all day?

Well, those who learn Torah and get paid for it, the Torah they learned is no longer theirs. It belongs to those who support them. So, those who learn Torah for money, don't have any Torah which they own.

On the other hand, those who work all day and learn a little, learn less Torah than those who get paid for it, but, they own it all.

So, how should we educate our children? Learn Torah all day and own none of it, or, go to work, learn in your free time, and own all of it?

Ruchel

Fri, Dec 21 2007, 12:59 pm

The trend is new. A few decades ago people worked, with of course some exceptions.

I have never heard if you're paid the merit is not yours. It's weird. A doc is paid to heal people, isn't the merit his??

I don't think I know people paid to learn Torah. Unless you mean by that, that the wife works.

We should educate children to do what is for them. If the first son is a Torah genius, he should not have to work! he should have the occasion to be helpful for the whole Jewish people. But if second son is an average Joe, he has nothing to do all day in kollel unless he is single/rich.

amother

Sat, Dec 22 2007, 8:15 am

Learn Torah so he can teach torah-become a Rabbi or a teacher so he can be immersed in Torah and share it with others.

BeershevaBubby

Sat, Dec 22 2007, 8:15 am

Why does it have to be 'either/or'?

Why can't a person learn part time and work part time?

shabbatiscoming

Sat, Dec 22 2007, 8:48 am

I agree with kemilion, why cant ppl just find a balance between the two. also what ruchel said, the trend to be learning all of teh time is a pretty new thing. a few generations ago, only the VERY VERY chashuve rabbanim or talmidim of such rabbanim were the ones that were learning all of the time, not the majority of ppl, like today.
I believe that HaShem wants everyone to be able to live and not just survive, by that I mean, that every person has to make the decision as to what is the correct balance for them.

Akeres Habayis

Sat, Dec 22 2007, 9:38 am

my husband learns in kollel, I see the advantage of it, the brochos come revealed for us BH. our home is geared towards Torah(not that ones who DH is not learning in kollel don't also).At some point we will have to readdress the issue. I dont know if its possible to do both,when he is learning something you can actually hear "tearing his eyes"from the page.
In this day and age,its seems even more imp to learn Torah to combat the influences of today's world.

shalhevet

Sat, Dec 22 2007, 10:24 am

amother wrote:

Well, those who learn Torah and get paid for it, the Torah they learned is no longer theirs. It belongs to those who support them. So, those who learn Torah for money, don't have any Torah which they own.

On the other hand, those who work all day and learn a little, learn less Torah than those who get paid for it, but, they own it all.

What you wrote is not true.
Ner l'echad, ner l'meah. If someone supports Torah, ALL the reward goes to him, and ALL the reward goes to the person who learns. (Hashem is not limited in how much He can give.)

There are many opinions that a person only gets the full reward if he gives a Torah scholar, half his salary, or at least enough for the talmid chacham to live on.

Not only that, but if the person who is learning has mesirus nefesh (eg has physical strain by learning long hours or suffers financially) from his learning, the person supporting him does not get the reward for those things.

Ruchel

Sat, Dec 22 2007, 11:38 am

I don't understand how someone can support his family + a kollel family. Especially since frum families have often 5 + children! Are you supposed to pay food, house, tuition for 10 + children on ONE working person?? Ok here the govt helps a lot for large families... but still!

amother

Sun, Dec 23 2007, 9:20 am

I have a proposal for all the Kollel families:

How about your DH going to work, so that my DH can sit in the Kollel and learn all day?

amother

Sun, Dec 23 2007, 3:31 pm

amother wrote:

I have a proposal for all the Kollel families:

How about your DH going to work, so that my DH can sit in the Kollel and learn all day?

Who doesn't let him?? Confused

What does it have to do with my dh?

amother

Sun, Dec 23 2007, 5:13 pm

Ruchel wrote:

There are some very wealthy people around who can, although in the majority of cases where they are supported somewhat, it is by a community fund set up for that purpose.

Quote:

I have a proposal for all the Kollel families:

How about your DH going to work, so that my DH can sit in the Kollel and learn all day?

Does your DH want to learn in kollel all day, and do you really want him to? It involves long hours, much more than eight hours a day usually. Look, if your DH has the potential to become a great talmid chochom, then I'll consider it.

And who exactly do you expect to be the great rabbis of the next generation if no one learns in Kollel?

It is like Ruchel said, those who have a particular strength and desire to learn Torah should do so, and others should work.

Atali

Sun, Dec 23 2007, 5:16 pm

Sorry, that wasn't meant to be anonymous, it was me.

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