Can everyone calm down and stop being mean and bossy?

amother

Mon, Mar 23 2020, 3:14 pm

We're all stressed and scared and anxious and worried. But why are some people taking it out on others with so much anger? On the other thread a healthy amother in her 40s dared to mention that she was having her married kids over for pesach and people went ballistic on the poor woman. Can you all calm the heck down? She didn't say her kids are planning on dancing in the streets or that they're running rampant through grocery stores or that they're even coming in from another state. These are her married kids that have been around her and her family already. So if anything, they're the same as anyone else self quarantining, except with each other.

The world is fragile right now. We were sent this challenge, we don't know why or what to make of it but I think it's up to all of us to do what we can to 1.keep the world as safe as we can and 2. stop thinking that you are in control of this virus by yelling/bossing and insulting everyone else.

amother

Sienna

Mon, Mar 23 2020, 3:21 pm

I don't agree with you. Now is not the time to gather for Yomtov! There are so many health care workers who are putting their lives on the line every day for us, that to disregard the advice from the medical establishment is an aveirah. Ask any Rav.

icedcoffee

Mon, Mar 23 2020, 3:28 pm

Quote:

I think it's up to all of us to do what we can to 1.keep the world as safe as we can and 2. stop thinking that you are in control of this virus by yelling/bossing and insulting everyone else.

Most of the people you perceive as doing the 2nd one are actually trying to do the 1st one.

amother

Jetblack

Mon, Mar 23 2020, 3:32 pm

It is now socially unacceptable to get together with others, even relatives, until the crisis period has passed.

amother

Firebrick

Mon, Mar 23 2020, 3:37 pm

We don't have a license to hurt others.
There's a way to say things and there are times when saying anything will not help anyway.

amother

Saddlebrown

Mon, Mar 23 2020, 3:44 pm

I want to be angry.

I want to be mean.

I want to snap.

But,

I have to be nice to DH,

I have to be nice to the kids.

So sorry imamothers, you will be the dear recipients of my anger, tension and overwhelmed self.

amother

Seagreen

Mon, Mar 23 2020, 3:48 pm

amother [ OP ] wrote:

No one has a right to decide to do what they want, against what the guidelines are, when it will definitely put other people's lives at risk.

Period.

And the people you think are doing number 2, are actually trying to do number 1.

It's the people who AREN'T doing number 1, who think they can do it halfway, who you should be mad at.

ora_43

Mon, Mar 23 2020, 4:08 pm

amother [ Firebrick ] wrote:

We don't have a license to hurt others.
There's a way to say things and there are times when saying anything will not help anyway.

But... "we don't have a license to hurt others" is exactly why people are upset!!

You, and OP - do you not see the irony of being upset at the mean words people are using in response to someone actively, deliberately going against health guidelines meant to save lives? Yes, calling names is bad, but since when is it worse than risking actual physical harm to another person?

small bean

Mon, Mar 23 2020, 4:13 pm

This is supposed to be over in 12 days. Cuomo said today that he is likely to stop the lockdown for the young and healthy. Pesach is 3 weeks away, very likely you will be able to go to family.

And if I don't mind having guest for pesach and we will all stay inside, why would anyone care?

amother

Scarlet

Mon, Mar 23 2020, 4:20 pm

Because I am one of those health care workers whose life is being put at risk.

Because everytime someone does one of those things, MY chances of being exposed increases, no matter how careful I am with PPE (which are in short supply) and taking every precaution that I can.

Because your desire to enjoy yourself trumps my right to safety.

zaq

Mon, Mar 23 2020, 4:24 pm

Joint Statement to the Orthodox Community
Regarding Pesach

Rabbinic leaders and organizations across the Orthodox spectrum have, individually, declared the health threat presented by COVID-19 a mortal threat (sakanas nefashos). We, leaders of major American Orthodox Jewish organizations, join together again to further clarify our shared and firm guidance for our communities.

We have heretofore urged not only full compliance with all health guidance issued by federal, state and local governments, but have gone beyond those pronouncements in urging our communities to remain at home and avoid, to the maximum extent feasible, any outside interactions.

With regard to the upcoming Pesach holiday, we note specifically the following critical mandates, shared in consultation with leading infectious disease and public health experts:

1. We are accustomed to honoring Pesach to the fullest degree, including taking haircuts, purchasing new clothing and tableware, and preparing the fullest menus. This year’s public health crisis mandates us to significantly limit all of the above. Our responsibility is to refrain from any NON-ESSENTIAL outside interactions, including especially in-store shopping. If there is a need for truly ESSENTIAL purchases, send one family member only – who is neither ill, vulnerable, nor of known exposure to COVID-19 – as rarely and as briefly as possible. Stores serving the community should shift to home delivery or drive-by parking lot pick-up of pre-orders, and – to the extent this is not possible – must take substantive steps to minimize crowding, maintain hygiene, and maximize social distancing.

We will truly honor Pesach by limiting our purchases to the truly ESSENTIAL, ensuring that all of us – especially the vulnerable – are able to celebrate Pesach in good health. We must STAY HOME; SAVE LIVES.

2. The Pesach plans of many have been completely upended. This creates severe difficulty for so many. We are deeply sympathetic to this enormous difficulty. Nevertheless, public health demands strict adherence to the current guidance. Travel to other cities must be cancelled, whether to vacation venues (Florida, etc.) or to family. Everyone must plan to celebrate Pesach where they are currently.

Individuals living alone or those absolutely unable to prepare for Pesach may choose to self-quarantine for 14 days, and then – if asymptomatic – may join with a welcoming local family that is similarly asymptomatic and that has been disciplined in staying home and limiting their interactions outside the home to the absolute minimum as described above.

These guests may join one family only for the duration, without additional company, and must carefully observe the mandated standards of scrupulous hygiene and social distancing. The elderly and high risk must seek medical advice before considering this.

STAY HOME; SAVE LIVES

We urge one and all – while strictly maintaining the prescribed guidelines – to look out for each other by reaching out to and providing for each other, especially those living alone.

We hope and pray that our sincere tefillos (prayers) and chassadim (acts of kindness) will move Hashem to swiftly remove this plague from the world and bless us all with health, peace and tranquility.

Rabbi Chaim Dovid Zweibel, Executive Vice President, Agudath Israel of America Rabbi Mendy Mirocznick, Executive Vice-President, Igud HaRabbanim - Rabbinical Alliance of America
Rabbi Shmuel Blech, Chairman, Rabbi Moshe Chaim Weisberg, Co-Chair, The Lakewood Vaad
Farley Weiss, President, National Council of Young Israel
Moishe Bane, President, Allen Fagin, Executive Vice President, the Orthodox Union Rabbi Daniel Korobkin, President, Rabbi Mark Dratch, Executive Vice President, Rabbinical Council of America

zaq

Mon, Mar 23 2020, 4:26 pm

If you won't listen to ordinary intelligent people, would you supposedly religious people listen to the leaders of ALL the major Orthodox organizations ACROSS THE SPECTRUM?

amother

Dodgerblue

Mon, Mar 23 2020, 4:29 pm

small bean wrote:

I am not able to find where Cuomo said he's lifting the restrictions food the thing and healthy in 12 days. Provide a link.

It's incredibly selfish and stupid to plan a Pesach get together. It makes Jews look like they are flaunting the law - rules don't apply. Get over it and skip Pesach gatherings beyond family who lives on the same house.

I watch my neighbors all going back and forth between houses and am disgusted that they can follow rules designed to save lives.

watergirl

Mon, Mar 23 2020, 4:31 pm

small bean wrote:

Because there is no chance you will all stay inside for the duration of the chag. But if you insist - keep everyone inside your house for 14 days following pesach as well.

small bean

Mon, Mar 23 2020, 4:31 pm

I personally am staying home and have no skin in the game. I always stay home. I still think this is a major overreaction on everyones part including the OU. If come pesach there is no lockdown rules, then everyone can do what they want.

Being a healthcare worker means putting your life at risk. It was a choice you made when you went into this field. I think healthcare workers are heroes but don't complain that your life is at risk.

I think any statements about pesach is premature.

small bean

Mon, Mar 23 2020, 4:46 pm

watergirl wrote:

Because there is no chance you will all stay inside for the duration of the chag. But if you insist - keep everyone inside your house for 14 days following pesach as well.

I have a 5 acre property and no neighbors. Where exactly are we going?

Unless of course shul is open but then so would everyone else be at shul and guest wouldn't make a difference.

small bean

Mon, Mar 23 2020, 4:50 pm

amother [ Dodgerblue ] wrote:

He said it today on CNN. He said it is not feasible to keep this going much longer both from an economic stand point and from a people following the rules standpoint. He didnt say it is forsure going to end but it ws done with the intention of 15 days and not longer and that has not changed.

amother

Scarlet

Mon, Mar 23 2020, 4:51 pm

small bean wrote:

How dare you!
Healthcare workers are typically not at risk and many jobs in healthcare there is no risk and we did not sign up for a job with the risk. Maybe, maybe one could argue that about someone who goes into infectious disease, but a social Worker, lactation consultant, diabetic nutrition educator, a secretary at a doctors office...the list goes on. Don't tell me that they signed up for a job knowing and agreeing to risks. You're full of ----. We are still being required to come, and pitching in ways much different than our job description. Even if our jobs are "known to be at risk" that does not give anybody the right to increase our risk.

amother

Dodgerblue

Mon, Mar 23 2020, 5:00 pm

small bean wrote:

Wow! Did you really say the bolded? All I can say is WOW. I have heard a lot of self serving jurisdictions on this site, but you win hands down.

I will check CNN. But I am not holding my breath.

small bean

Mon, Mar 23 2020, 5:01 pm

amother [ Scarlet ] wrote:

I'm sorry a secretary in a doctors office is taking a risk. People come in with all kinds if contagious air borne illnesses all the time. I think it is great people who made this their profession. But to pretend you are not alwaya at risk of contagious disease is silly. This is not the first contagious disease. There have been contagious diseses forever. I'm happy you didn't think about it until now.

ETA. My sister is a nurse at a regular clinic in Israel and has caught many things over tgr years. Routinely gets bloodwork donw to check for immunity. And is not complaining now nor does she think all these lockdowns will make her less at risk for anything.