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Forum -> Inquiries & Offers -> Lakewood, Toms River & Jackson related Inquiries
Pay playgroup Morah for april?
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amother
Dodgerblue


 

Post Sun, Mar 29 2020, 10:22 pm
NPYOB wrote:
I don’t see why it’s a shaila. The Morah did not cancel playgroup because she wasn’t in the mood of teaching the kids. If people stop paying then she will be one more person suffering without a salary. Obviously if people absolutely cannot afford it because they are out of a job that’s a shaila but just to ask the whole imamother what they are doing is ridiculous.


Of course it's a shaila. My playgroup teacher rents a space in someone else's home. Now that playgroup is closed the person whose home it is began using the space again so presumably will have to waive her April's rent. She did prepare a package for me to do with my child but doesn't do conference calls or Zoom. She deserves some money but how much?
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amother
Goldenrod


 

Post Sun, Mar 29 2020, 10:23 pm
My daughter can not afford to pay her child's playgroup now. But my husband and I will pay it as her teacher has a large mishpacha and needs the $ for pesach. ( we live on a tight budget, but I put away some $for clothing which we are now not buying)
In addition, playgroup is done as a yearly tuition spread over 10 months. If you leave in middle of the year you are required to find a replacement.
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solo




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, Mar 29 2020, 10:27 pm
I hope my daughter’s teacher does the right thing and Lowers the tuition for the remaining months
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amother
Amethyst


 

Post Sun, Mar 29 2020, 10:58 pm
Can someone please explain this to me? Tuition is based on ten months of the year pursuant that the teacher teaches if for any reason the teacher doesn’t teach them why should she get paid? If in middle of the year the teacher needs to move even if it isn’t her fault or her mother get sick so she needs to be with her mother if the teacher isn’t teaching then why should she expect to get paid?

I’m trying to understand how a Morah can feel
That she deserves to get paid if she isn’t doing the work?

No one else who isn’t working feels that they deserve to get paid?

Does it say anywhere in the contract that even if she doesn’t work parents need to pay her?
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mommy3b2c




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, Mar 29 2020, 11:04 pm
amother [ Amethyst ] wrote:
Can someone please explain this to me? Tuition is based on ten months of the year pursuant that the teacher teaches if for any reason the teacher doesn’t teach them why should she get paid? If in middle of the year the teacher needs to move even if it isn’t her fault or her mother get sick so she needs to be with her mother if the teacher isn’t teaching then why should she expect to get paid?

I’m trying to understand how a Morah can feel
That she deserves to get paid if she isn’t doing the work?

No one else who isn’t working feels that they deserve to get paid?

Does it say anywhere in the contract that even if she doesn’t work parents need to pay her?


Agree with this. I can’t understand what people are thinking. I run lots of extracurricular programs. I already invested in a ton of equipment, uniforms, and put in hours of work. But now that the kids are not getting the services, of course I need to refund the money. How is this a question??
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amother
Aquamarine


 

Post Sun, Mar 29 2020, 11:09 pm
amother [ Amethyst ] wrote:
Can someone please explain this to me? Tuition is based on ten months of the year pursuant that the teacher teaches if for any reason the teacher doesn’t teach them why should she get paid? If in middle of the year the teacher needs to move even if it isn’t her fault or her mother get sick so she needs to be with her mother if the teacher isn’t teaching then why should she expect to get paid?

I’m trying to understand how a Morah can feel
That she deserves to get paid if she isn’t doing the work?

No one else who isn’t working feels that they deserve to get paid?

Does it say anywhere in the contract that even if she doesn’t work parents need to pay her?


This really isn't comparable to a woman closing her playgroup at her own will.
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mommy3b2c




 
 
    
 

Post Sun, Mar 29 2020, 11:11 pm
amother [ Aquamarine ] wrote:
This really isn't comparable to a woman closing her playgroup at her own will.


We are ALL forced out of our jobs against are will. Why don’t all of us demand payment?
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amother
Aquamarine


 

Post Sun, Mar 29 2020, 11:19 pm
mommy3b2c wrote:
We are ALL forced out of our jobs against are will. Why don’t all of us demand payment?


I don't know who we are ganging up on here.

If I was a business owner with long term contracts, I'd be on my phone with my lawyer trying to figure out what to do here in my best interest.
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amother
Aquamarine


 

Post Sun, Mar 29 2020, 11:25 pm
mommy3b2c wrote:
Agree with this. I can’t understand what people are thinking. I run lots of extracurricular programs. I already invested in a ton of equipment, uniforms, and put in hours of work. But now that the kids are not getting the services, of course I need to refund the money. How is this a question??


I understand what people are thinking. They rely on this income to pay family bills. They are scared.
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amother
Amethyst


 

Post Mon, Mar 30 2020, 12:25 am
amother [ Aquamarine ] wrote:
This really isn't comparable to a woman closing her playgroup at her own will.


It doesn’t matter if it’s her will or not she isn’t working? Why does she feel she should get paid if she isn’t working?

Please explain this to me? If she was a salesperson and store had to close because of corona she wouldn’t get paid even if she wants to work.

And I
Never signed a contract but the contract is based on a teacher working if she doesn’t work the contract is null and void?
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amother
Aquamarine


 

Post Mon, Mar 30 2020, 12:33 am
amother [ Amethyst ] wrote:
It doesn’t matter if it’s her will or not she isn’t working? Why does she feel she should get paid if she isn’t working?

Please explain this to me? If she was a salesperson and store had to close because of corona she wouldn’t get paid even if she wants to work.

And I
Never signed a contract but the contract is based on a teacher working if she doesn’t work the contract is null and void?


I'm not going to explain other people's feelings to you.

Also not comparable to a salesperson (shop owner??).
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amother
Sapphire


 

Post Mon, Mar 30 2020, 1:03 am
amother [ Amethyst ] wrote:
It doesn’t matter if it’s her will or not she isn’t working? Why does she feel she should get paid if she isn’t working?

Please explain this to me? If she was a salesperson and store had to close because of corona she wouldn’t get paid even if she wants to work.

And I
Never signed a contract but the contract is based on a teacher working if she doesn’t work the contract is null and void?


Halachically it makes a difference if the person stopped by choice or was forced by the govt - not her own fault.
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amother
Amethyst


 

Post Mon, Mar 30 2020, 1:07 am
So do you feel store owners that were forced to closed also have to pay their employees bec it wasn’t the employees fault that the government forced them to close?
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amother
Aquamarine


 

Post Mon, Mar 30 2020, 1:15 am
amother [ Amethyst ] wrote:
So do you feel store owners that were forced to closed also have to pay their employees bec it wasn’t the employees fault that the government forced them to close?


Store owners and employees is an employer employee relationship.

The daycare morah is a service provider - and the parents pay her for a service - under whatever terms they have agreed to.


I don't have feelings about these things. Each employer is figuring this out for themselves. There is a lot to figure out, especially in consideration of what the CARES act is offering.

As for the playgroup Morah - she should be talking to her lawyer and her Rav.
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amother
Amethyst


 

Post Mon, Mar 30 2020, 1:21 am
I’m curious if any Morah made parents sign a contract that even if she doesn’t work parents still have to pay. Because when asking a rav the question and saying you have not tract with parents isn’t correct because most contracts are based on the Morah working.
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amother
Aquamarine


 

Post Mon, Mar 30 2020, 1:27 am
amother [ Amethyst ] wrote:
I’m curious if any Morah made parents sign a contract that even if she doesn’t work parents still have to pay. Because when asking a rav the question and saying you have not tract with parents isn’t correct because most contracts are based on the Morah working.


If you are having a specific issue with your Morah - talk to you Rav for guidance for your specific situation.
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amother
Fuchsia


 

Post Mon, Mar 30 2020, 1:27 am
amother [ Aquamarine ] wrote:
Store owners and employees is an employer employee relationship.

The daycare morah is a service provider - and the parents pay her for a service - under whatever terms they have agreed to.


I don't have feelings about these things. Each employer is figuring this out for themselves. There is a lot to figure out, especially in consideration of what the CARES act is offering.

As for the playgroup Morah - she should be talking to her lawyer and her Rav.


Your second sentence is the most important. She's a service provider. And she isn't currently providing a service. The end. Doesn't matte why.

But for arguments sake... Let's say she was an illegal playgroup (but you were OK with that in September). You gave her 10 head checks. March 30th she gets busted by the state and playgroup closed. It's the end of the year and no one else will take your child. You have to watch him. You'll honestly be Okay with her cashing the checks for April-June?
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gande




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Mar 30 2020, 1:29 am
I was mulling about this situation today and I was thinking that if not for this crisis, the teacher would be getting out of the house, preparing, spending her day with the kids, to earn her pay. I understand that schools are closed and it is metchlich to give them their salary but they should EARN it!
For example in Chassidish schools, playgroups ect… they should call the kids, entertain them a few minutes a day which will be a big help to lighten the mood in the house. They should offer ideas, give the parents the curriculum.... whatever but they should still make themselves useful in any way they could instead of enjoying a paid vacation on the struggling parents dime.
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amother
Aquamarine


 

Post Mon, Mar 30 2020, 1:31 am
amother [ Fuchsia ] wrote:
Your second sentence is the most important. She's a service provider. And she isn't currently providing a service. The end. Doesn't matte why.

But for arguments sake... Let's say she was an illegal playgroup (but you were OK with that in September). You gave her 10 head checks. March 30th she gets busted by the state and playgroup closed. It's the end of the year and no one else will take your child. You have to watch him. You'll honestly be Okay with her cashing the checks for April-June?



Is that your halachic opinion?
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amother
Amethyst


 

Post Mon, Mar 30 2020, 1:33 am
I can’t understand how a Morah thinks she deserves to get paid. Must be a selfish person to even think they should get paid for not working. Who gets paid if they don’t work?
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