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I TOLD YOU SO
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flowerpower




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Jun 01 2020, 1:26 pm
aliavi wrote:
Could it be that cops are making sure BP businesses and high density areas of children are safe? Why is it we are so fixated on shopping and can see nothing else? PS, shops that are closed have covers of doors or bars on the glass to protect the shops from looting!

The rioting his completely expected. People are stressed to the boiling point. The tolerance of the riots is also expected because of the prescient to protect first amendment rights.

We are suffering a devastating lack of leadership.


I wish! The sheriffs told a someone that they really don’t have patience to yell at store owners and shut the stores down. They don’t agree with it but are just following orders.
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aliavi




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Jun 01 2020, 1:30 pm
flowerpower wrote:
I wish! The sheriffs told a someone that they really don’t have patience to yell at store owners and shut the stores down. They don’t agree with it but are just following orders.


I feel for the NYPD. Their job description is constantly changed by the mayor and they are vilified at every opportunity. Officers aren’t flawless of course. The mayor’s spats with them and the MTA are causing the city to backslide into decades past.
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Cheiny




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Jun 01 2020, 2:50 pm
Mama Bear wrote:
Back in the day before the state of emergency and stay at home orders, I was really worried that if this stretches all the way into summer, there will be full on chaos and anarchy in the streets as people are unemployed, bored, and out of school. I was truly worried about it.

And it has come to pass.

Quicker than I expected, but yes. It's here.

NY is opening just a tad too late.

The U.S. was just a tinderbox waiting for a spark, and it's exploded.

I am truly frightened for my life. way more than during the height of covid.

THIS IS CRAZY AND TERRIFYING.

our country has descended to the lowest of the lows. All this looting plundering and pillaging, raging and violence, is what I would expect a third world country or a war-plagued Middle Eastern country to look like. I mamish cannot believe what it going on.

I AM SO SCARED!!!!

On another note, thank you, crazy protestors, for officially ending this pandemic. If thousands are allowed to gather en masse all over the NYC AND THE POLICE ARE NOT DISPERSING IT, then, hellooooo, we can go back to school, cheder, yeshiva, and day camp. Sorry not sorry, this is the absolute worst double standard. A couple of little kids learning Torah is SOOOO dangerous, and violent teenagers burning police cars, looting stores, injuring bystanders and trashing the streets, is fine!!!! Stores are chas v'sholom not allowed to do business because SOCIAL DISTANCING IT'S DANGEROUS FOR FIVE PEOPLE TO BE IN A STORE AT ONCE OMG OMG YOURE GONNA KILL US ALL, but LOOOOTING those self same stores is FINE!!!!

I am so done. I'm seething, fuming, exploding.

That's it. I hereby declare this state of emergency OVER. You can wear a mask if you want, but goshdarnit, I dont hear a PEEP of outrage from the mayor or the police over these protests, peaceful or not, looting or not. No problem! If rioters and protesters are allowed -- then so should weddings, tenoyims, vorts, day camps and siyums.

That's it!!!

peace out.


Are you at all concerned that with the widespread lack of social distancing with these wild animals running loose, there may be a negative impact on the virus numbers again, c”v?

Einikel wrote:
The point is-if so many people are out protesting and rioting with no social distancing then there is no point in enforcing it anymore.


So in other words, they let the protesters and rioters rule. Got it.


Last edited by Cheiny on Mon, Jun 01 2020, 3:02 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Cheiny




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Jun 01 2020, 2:53 pm
jkl wrote:
Ugh I hate these nonsensical comparisons. It makes it sound like the gov't is sanctioning these rioters. The gov't was trying to curb the spread of a pandemic, and in the midst of it, rioters let loose. The gov't unfortunately is mostly helpless in the face of these masses. Any strong stance will only fuel the fire and cause more harm to society. Unless martial law is declared, their hands are pretty much tied.

The gov't is not supporting these rioters, nor are they supporting messing with their plan to reopen the cities and towns. Why is everyone running with the assumption that the gov't is ok with this?

(And yes, I support opening up everything now with some restrictions in place for protection.)


With the N.Y. Mayor’s daughter herself being arrested in these protests, do you think he’s doing anything to condemn them, much less stop them?
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Cheiny




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Jun 01 2020, 2:57 pm
Mama Bear wrote:
NO ONE IS STOPPING THEM.
they are breaking windows and looting expensive shops in manhattan. NO ONE IS STOPPING THEM.
I seriously don't get it.
yes, the cops are allowing them to riot and protest. They are not being dispersed like Rabbi Mertz's funeral.
My mind is mamish boggled. I'm in despair here. If these riots don't stop, our city and country are gonna descend into levels that are almost impossible to rise from.
I am very very scared for our future.
THIS IS EXACTLY WHAT I PREDICTED BACK IN MARCH. EXACTLY.


The president has a get-tough policy for these thugs, but it won’t be long until Dems start calling him a racist again for it. The dem policy in so many areas (illegal immigrants, no bail for criminals, etc) is benefit the criminal and to heck with the victim.

Trump unloads on governors over protest response, calls them 'weak'
https://www.foxnews.com/politi.....-weak
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Cheiny




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Jun 01 2020, 3:00 pm
jkl wrote:
Not only are they not allowed, but the police is unable to disperse it unless strong violent tactics are used. Such tactics would only backfired and cause more violence to erupt. The gov't is not allowing anything at the moment, they're just powerless to stop it.

None of this has any bearing if the virus is still contagious or not. If you want to discuss if the danger of the virus is still prevalent, it should be separate discussion in itself - one that doesn't use violent law-breaking rioters of the lower elements of society as an example to compare to.

But, I do agree with your original point. So many weeks of unstructured time can only lead to negative things. It's time to reopen now, albeit with some restrictions in place to protect us in case God forbid the virus rears its head again.


You’re very wrong that the 2 issues shouldn’t both be considered together. You can be sure the lack of SD between these animals rioting and looting and being so close together, and even the peaceful protesters being so close, will unfortunately lead to a spike.... so you’re good with that?

jkl wrote:
These protesters are rioting with one focus in mind, to show the world their anger. It's not a setup to defy De Blasio per se. Our communities' moves were sort of in direct defiance to his rules, so yeah, it's much more personal and a play against his ego.


You mean you believe they’re smashing store windows and stealing everything they can get their hands on, to show the world they’re angry?! Can't Believe It


Last edited by Cheiny on Mon, Jun 01 2020, 3:09 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Cheiny




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Jun 01 2020, 3:08 pm
jkl wrote:
These protesters are rioting with one focus in mind, to show the world their anger. It's not a setup to defy De Blasio per se. Our communities' moves were sort of in direct defiance to his rules, so yeah, it's much more personal and a play against his ego.


You mean you believe they’re smashing store windows and stealing everything they can get their hands on, to show the world they’re angry?! Can't Believe It
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Cheiny




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Jun 01 2020, 3:32 pm
HonesttoGod wrote:
Where do you live? Because where I live there were over 250 arrests within one hour last night. Including De Blasios daughter. And yes she’ll probably get off, privilege of being the mayors daughter.

This thread is so shallow. Comparing apples to oranges. Literally.

But we’ll done OP you predicted it. Congrats on having ruach hakodesh.


This sarcasm is uncalled for. If you think the “Over 250 arrests” is satisfactory, and that this thread is “so shallow, and comparing apples and oranges,” then goody for you. The rest of us are quite understandably concerned about the savages running wild unchecked, and for the most part being allowed to continue looting, smashing, rioting, etc., with a NY Mayor who’s not only showing only sympathy for their so called cause (sorry, but once it turns violent and criminality reigns, there is no more cause), but actually encouraging it with his soft hand... and I’m sure his daughter who got arrested wasn’t being too peaceful, but it’s all good according to her daddy who said he believes her when she said she did nothing wrong and got arrested for no reason.
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OutofTown Girl




 
 
    
 

Post Mon, Jun 01 2020, 9:12 pm
momsrus wrote:
Were the Ferguson riots cross country or only in the area the shooting happened?


Cross country.

I don't have a crystal ball, but the odds are that these protests-turned-riots would have happened even without any Covid-19 lockdowns. There is a deep-seated sense of injustice and prejudice towards people of color in the USA, and I believe this is the tinderbox that exploded with Floyd's murder.
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DrMom




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Jun 02 2020, 6:57 am
OutofTown Girl wrote:
Cross country.

I don't have a crystal ball, but the odds are that these protests-turned-riots would have happened even without any Covid-19 lockdowns. There is a deep-seated sense of injustice and prejudice towards people of color in the USA, and I believe this is the tinderbox that exploded with Floyd's murder.

I don't believe this is true.

I do believe the MSM does its very best to stir up this sentiment.
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southernbubby




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Jun 02 2020, 8:57 am
DrMom wrote:
I don't believe this is true.

I do believe the MSM does its very best to stir up this sentiment.


On some level, it is true. Blacks in America are often treated like second class citizens. I used to live next door to a black couple and they often shared what they had gone through in life and the struggle to go from sharecropper to college graduate.
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exaustedmom




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Jun 02 2020, 9:04 am
southernbubby wrote:
On some level, it is true. Blacks in America are often treated like second class citizens. I used to live next door to a black couple and they often shared what they had gone through in life and the struggle to go from sharecropper to college graduate.


All true. But every minority will have the same story, chinese, indian, hispanic, arab and of course jewish. We should do better. We need to do better. But racism is not unique to black people.
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Mayflower




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Jun 02 2020, 9:08 am
exaustedmom wrote:
All true. But every minority will have the same story, chinese, indian, hispanic, arab and of course jewish. We should do better. We need to do better. But racism is not unique to black people.

That is true of course, but in the US, the (recent) history of institutionalized racism, of segregation, is unique to black people.
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southernbubby




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Jun 02 2020, 9:51 am
exaustedmom wrote:
All true. But every minority will have the same story, chinese, indian, hispanic, arab and of course jewish. We should do better. We need to do better. But racism is not unique to black people.


My neighbor was successful because his parents, although poor and uneducated, were United in pushing their many children to succeed. The welfare system of the 70's caused the black family to disintegrate. Their family structure now works against them and they don't know how to restructure.
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exaustedmom




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Jun 02 2020, 9:57 am
southernbubby wrote:
My neighbor was successful because his parents, although poor and uneducated, were United in pushing their many children to succeed. The welfare system of the 70's caused the black family to disintegrate. Their family structure now works against them and they don't know how to restructure.


And yet it is the Democrat party pushing for welfare while Republicans are advocating for charter schools. But facts dont matter.
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southernbubby




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Jun 02 2020, 10:12 am
exaustedmom wrote:
And yet it is the Democrat party pushing for welfare while Republicans are advocating for charter schools. But facts dont matter.


Part of what happened was that as black families migrated to cities, black men had trouble getting jobs and welfare was available only to single mothers. Black men, having no job and no hope, often drank and got involved in illegal activities and women felt that they were better off without them. As the families broke up, welfare stepped in. Eventually the majority of black children in those communities grew up with single mothers, half siblings, father's who were in jail or who couldn't support the children who they sired with a succession of women, and children who were abused by the mothers' boyfriends. The mothers were often so busy with their own emotional wounds from growing up this way that they had no emotional reserve left over for their children.
People who teach in inner city schools could write books about the level of child neglect and abuse. These children are the ones who see no problem with destroying a society that did little to help them.
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iyar




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Jun 02 2020, 10:46 am
southernbubby wrote:
My neighbor was successful because his parents, although poor and uneducated, were United in pushing their many children to succeed. The welfare system of the 70's caused the black family to disintegrate. Their family structure now works against them and they don't know how to restructure.


I think it’s a little simplistic to suggest that the welfare system was the cause of families disintegrating. You could make a pretty solid argument that the welfare system was trying to provide food and shelter for children from families that had already disintegrated. Withou arguing whether the chicken or the egg came first, I think we can all agree that children need food, shelter, healthcare, and in instances where there is no parental attention to providing those, the state should step in and offer help. How much help and in what way it’s offered could be a long discussion. Right now when policemen are being run over and wild animals are roaming the streets smashing windows we don’t have the luxury of sitting down and discussing cause, effect, motivations. Maybe when peace is restored (?) to our streets people with cool heads need to sit down and figure out what was done right, what mistakes were made, and what needs to be done going forward.
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DrMom




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Jun 02 2020, 10:46 am
southernbubby wrote:
Part of what happened was that as black families migrated to cities, black men had trouble getting jobs and welfare was available only to single mothers. Black men, having no job and no hope, often drank and got involved in illegal activities and women felt that they were better off without them. As the families broke up, welfare stepped in. Eventually the majority of black children in those communities grew up with single mothers, half siblings, father's who were in jail or who couldn't support the children who they sired with a succession of women, and children who were abused by the mothers' boyfriends. The mothers were often so busy with their own emotional wounds from growing up this way that they had no emotional reserve left over for their children.
People who teach in inner city schools could write books about the level of child neglect and abuse. These children are the ones who see no problem with destroying a society that did little to help them.


Welfare did more harm to Black families than any policy since slavery. It incentivized couples to break apart or have children out of wedlock instead of staying together and raising their kids.

I wouldn't say that society "did little" to help inner city kids, but none of the programs that they tried could counteract the devastating effects of a having a permanent welfare class of single mothers in the inner cities.
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southernbubby




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Jun 02 2020, 12:07 pm
DrMom wrote:
Welfare did more harm to Black families than any policy since slavery. It incentivized couples to break apart or have children out of wedlock instead of staying together and raising their kids.

I wouldn't say that society "did little" to help inner city kids, but none of the programs that they tried could counteract the devastating effects of a having a permanent welfare class of single mothers in the inner cities.


What these people needed was an opportunity to get decent jobs and this was eventually dealt with on some level but the family structure was never repaired and dysfunctional families often produce another generation of dysfunctional families.
Some communities tried to desegregate the schools but that failed in most cities because most white people didn't want their kids bussed to the other side of town. Schools in inner city neighborhoods apparently don't prepare kids to live in "white" society.
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southernbubby




 
 
    
 

Post Tue, Jun 02 2020, 12:11 pm
iyar wrote:
I think it’s a little simplistic to suggest that the welfare system was the cause of families disintegrating. You could make a pretty solid argument that the welfare system was trying to provide food and shelter for children from families that had already disintegrated. Withou arguing whether the chicken or the egg came first, I think we can all agree that children need food, shelter, healthcare, and in instances where there is no parental attention to providing those, the state should step in and offer help. How much help and in what way it’s offered could be a long discussion. Right now when policemen are being run over and wild animals are roaming the streets smashing windows we don’t have the luxury of sitting down and discussing cause, effect, motivations. Maybe when peace is restored (?) to our streets people with cool heads need to sit down and figure out what was done right, what mistakes were made, and what needs to be done going forward.


I explained it in my 10:12 post. I think that the black community is expecting better treatment from the police but many are out of money, out of work, out of options and desperate. Everyone predicted that when they get desperate enough, they will get violent.
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