Is it not lady like?

penguin

Tue, Jun 16 2020, 7:59 pm

I remember seeing a woman a the gym who poured her water into a cup instead of drinking from the bottle.

It stuck me as a refinement. But after seeing that video above (although I would have appreciated a warning that it contains four-letter words) I am not so sure. Might be part of the plot against women.

malki2

Tue, Jun 16 2020, 8:29 pm

zaq wrote:

so much so that I put my hand on my own crown on the rare occasions when I swig. or maybe I'm just keeping my cranium in place in case one of the cotter pins came loose.

Lol. So that’s what the creaking sounds are from. Maybe I should use some WD-40.

ra_mom

Tue, Jun 16 2020, 8:54 pm

zaq wrote:

There is nothing socially off about drinking soda from the can unless you offer a sip to someone else after doing so. Just don't keep it in an opaque bag because then people will assume it's beer. Drinking from a can or bottle is not precisely elegant but neither are many things in real life. just because you wouldn't do it at a wedding doesn't mean you mustn't do it at all. We don't eat corn flakes at weddings, either.

I suspect that many ultra-RW people will consider it a no-no because when the vessel is nearly empty, you have to throw your head way back to get the last little bit out. This exposes the underside of your jaw and stretches your neck and I'm sure some people consider that provocative. The question of "looking for things to consider not tzanua" aside, the solution to that problem is simple: use a straw.

Thanks for the visual of what some people might consider provocative!

imasoftov

Wed, Jun 17 2020, 7:05 am

malki2 wrote:

Thank you very much, I stand corrected. You did state one thing that I think is inaccurate. I think that it’s still stealing to take less than a peruta, it’s just that you can’t take someone to bais din for it.

Tosafot on Kiddushin 40b, divrei hamatchil ויש אומרים אף פסול לעדות asks if one who grabs from vendors is a thief, and answers that he is not if the thefts are worth less than a peruta or the owner doesn't mind, but the next opinion, of a R Eliyahu (I've found two Tosfatists named R Eliyahu, one from France and another from England, I don't know which this is) is that he's tasting, which seems to me is with the approval of the sellers, and the question about stealing isn't asked about that.

malki2

Wed, Jun 17 2020, 8:34 am

imasoftov wrote:

I think that there’s a Midrash that says that the Aveira of Chamas of the generation of the Mabul was that everyone would go to a storekeeper and take less than a peruta from his merchandise until he would be impoverished. So it could be that it’s called Chamas, which is when you take without approval of the owner, but not outright stealing.

Ora in town

Wed, Jun 17 2020, 8:43 am

malki2 wrote:

I also would interpret this as meaning that taking less than a pruta is not stealing.

I suppose the reason it was chamas is the cunning & hypocrisy, when the whole community bands together to deprive people of their property in a way that is apparently "legal", so the proprietor has no way of defending himself.

healthymom1

Wed, Jun 17 2020, 8:47 am

Nothing to do with being a 'lady' or not. My brother in law never drinks out of a water bottle and always pours a cup and tells his kids to do the same.

malki2

Wed, Jun 17 2020, 8:52 am

Ora in town wrote:

I think that you are correct. Chamas would be different from Gezel. For example taking merchandise without permission and throwing money at the vendor is Chamas, not Gezel. But both would still be assur.

Ora in town

Wed, Jun 17 2020, 9:27 am

malki2 wrote:

From the example you brought, you can learn that it is acceptable to take less than a pruta - unless it is done in a concerted way that will leave the proprietor with nothing...

Taking less than a pruta is not stealing.
Tasting samples that are destined for tasting is not stealing.

malki2

Wed, Jun 17 2020, 10:04 am

Ora in town wrote:

It’s only acceptable if it’s acceptable. If the vendors are makpid on it, then it’s assur. Even if it’s not actual stealing. Even if it’s not done in a concerted way. It’s still punishable בידי שמים.