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How do you feel when you leave someone outside?
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amother
OP


 

Post Fri, Aug 07 2020, 9:11 am
amother [ Burlywood ] wrote:
Not sure I understand this. DS's friend and his wife were in middle of a vacation when your son texted to say he needed a ride for the last leg of his journey? And the friend said, okay, I'll drive you there, but I have a priority to my wife and we have a full vacation day planned tomorrow so I can drive you in the evening?

And your DS arrived while they were out and had to wait for their return, at which point friend drove him to the destination? How long was the drive to the destination?


You understand it almost. He arrived before they left the house.
His friend drove him for an hour, which I'm very thankful for. I texted him a nice text and also sent with my son a box of chocolates.
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amother
Aqua


 

Post Fri, Aug 07 2020, 9:13 am
When I was a teen I lived 3 hours away from NY. I was in high-school in Canada. The way I traveled home for visits is that I would take the bus to NY , go with another high-school classmate to her house in NY from the bus station , wait on her front steps and my parents would pick me up. The bus usually arrived at 4 or 5 am so all this was in the dark. One day my parents got stuck in traffic and didn't arrive right away.. I was fine with waiting for them outside but my classmates mother who didn't know me at all!! invited me in to her home and let me hang out inside while she and her whole family went back to sleep! So technically I was unsupervised in her home..she could have said well that wasn't the arrangement. That wasn't the deal. The deal is I let you use my front steps as a meeting place for your parents to pick you up. Its not my problem your parents are late. But what kind of a heartless person leaves a kid sitting outside on the steps ? I am so glad the "Jewish strangers" in my life had a heart ! Op those people are the ones that don't sound very normal.
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amother
Denim


 

Post Fri, Aug 07 2020, 9:18 am
I think everyone is partial in the wrong, including OP. It is very easy to not take ownership or responsibility for the situation until after the fact and then be angry or annoyed.
1) theis guy is at least 10, if not 15 years older. He is not a friend. He is not a peer. Either he is a nice former neighbor who was happy to help out-but not overextended himself or if he is more than that there is something wrong and it would be red flags to me.

2) clearly there are communication issues between your son and this man and this man and his wife. The expectations were not clear at any point. Yeah don't worry, we will figure it out-never works. If it works out for you, that means someone else sacrificed.

3) I would not have left him outside the home, but I also would not have wanted him alone in my home either. I would have felt responsible for him and would have canceled my plans. Either stayed home or now taken him with us. I would have been annoyed and angry. I would have tried to hide it from the boy but I am not a great actresses.

Now we have the next question. Do you do hacnasat orchim with a grudge and neglect your self and your own needs or do you leave a boy on your front step who presumably traveled here alone and is advertised as independent and self sufficient?
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amother
Dodgerblue


 

Post Fri, Aug 07 2020, 9:20 am
I feel like there really must be more to the story. A guy who drives 2 hours total to do a chesed for your kid while on vacation with his family probably isn’t heartless and unfeeling. I’m guessing there was a good reason for asking the kid towait outside, which you may or may not be privy to. Excellent DLKZ opportunity.
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amother
Sapphire


 

Post Fri, Aug 07 2020, 9:24 am
amother [ OP ] wrote:
You understand it almost. He arrived before they left the house.
His friend drove him for an hour, which I'm very thankful for. I texted him a nice text and also sent with my son a box of chocolates.


I don't understand. He arrived at their house before the family left and they didn't let him in till they got back home?? This sounds crazy.
But we're only getting part of the story and this seems to be a misunderstanding.
We need to be careful about who we let into our homes unsupervised, but we also shouldn't leave a kid outside alone all day long. It was a family trip, they could've taken him along and he could've stayed in the car sleeping. Just leaving him outside is irresponsible and awful middos.
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mommy3b2c




 
 
    
 

Post Fri, Aug 07 2020, 9:26 am
amother [ Dodgerblue ] wrote:
Is it really unthinkable that different people have different comfort levels? I’m not comfortable with strangers unsupervised in my home, especially teenage boys when we have internet. I was a snoop when I was a kid and would babysit. I would go through people’s drawers in their bedrooms once their kids were asleep. It was horrible of me.


So you acted horribly as a kid. I guess people who behave horribly as kids grow up to be adults that think it’s normal to leave people sitting for hours outside with no place to go.
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momomany




 
 
    
 

Post Fri, Aug 07 2020, 9:26 am
Doing someone a favor by driving them for an hour and then back while you are on vacation is pretty huge .
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amother
Burlywood


 

Post Fri, Aug 07 2020, 9:27 am
amother [ OP ] wrote:
You understand it almost. He arrived before they left the house.
His friend drove him for an hour, which I'm very thankful for. I texted him a nice text and also sent with my son a box of chocolates.


So it sounds like DS wasn't relying on the friend when planning the trip, but called friend while already in middle of it, and friend did agree to help drive him the last leg of the journey, but couldn't cancel his family plans to drive earlier and wife didn't agree to having someone in the house.

It does sound strange to walk outside and leave someone sitting there, but I guess we don't really know the other side. Were they truly taking a vacation, or was that a cover story for something else happening in their lives? Or were they actually taking a vacation but the house was a mess, wife wasn't prepared to have someone over? The same way some people do tons of chessed and can't understand how someone wouldn't, there are also people who are super independent and think a 17 year old would be perfectly fine and have an adventure if left alone for a day.

I was a pretty adventurous teen myself, and sometimes found myself in weird situations when I didn't properly plan things and was relying on someone else to help me (and there were many amazing people who did!). Sometimes people just can't drop what they're doing or accommodate the way we wish they could, and that's a learning experience to plan better in advance. Sounds like your son took it well and didn't have an entitled attitude about it; it's all part of growing.

At the end of the day, the friend did seem to be trying to genuinely help - a 1 hour drive is 2 hours total. We never know what's going on in his marriage. It sounds like he was being pulled in two directions, prioritized his wife, which is the right thing to do, and still helped your son.
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amother
Sapphire


 

Post Fri, Aug 07 2020, 9:28 am
mommy3b2c wrote:
So you acted horribly as a kid. I guess people who behave horribly as kids grow up to be adults that think it’s normal to leave people sitting for hours outside with no place to go.


Right. Even if there's a good reason for not being able to let him into the home, make arrangements for the kid and help him out. Leaving a kid outside all day is cruel and heartless.
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amother
Dodgerblue


 

Post Fri, Aug 07 2020, 9:28 am
Crying Ouch. Did I really deserve that? (referring to the post about kids who behave horribly grow up to be adults who...)
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amother
Denim


 

Post Fri, Aug 07 2020, 9:30 am
amother [ Aqua ] wrote:
When I was a teen I lived 3 hours away from NY. I was in high-school in Canada. The way I traveled home for visits is that I would take the bus to NY , go with another high-school classmate to her house in NY from the bus station , wait on her front steps and my parents would pick me up. The bus usually arrived at 4 or 5 am so all this was in the dark. One day my parents got stuck in traffic and didn't arrive right away.. I was fine with waiting for them outside but my classmates mother who didn't know me at all!! invited me in to her home and let me hang out inside while she and her whole family went back to sleep! So technically I was unsupervised in her home..she could have said well that wasn't the arrangement. That wasn't the deal. The deal is I let you use my front steps as a meeting place for your parents to pick you up. Its not my problem your parents are late. But what kind of a heartless person leaves a kid sitting outside on the steps ? I am so glad the "Jewish strangers" in my life had a heart ! Op those people are the ones that don't sound very normal.

Your situation is completely different. I would have gladly brought you into my home sat with you at the table and fed you snacks. Their DD was getting home the. As well so it is not like you woke them. Also, there was a plan with responsibility and ownership, it was just hiccuped. If this happened every time because your parents didn't leave to get you until after shacharit, and you were left there for 3 hours each time, as the mom, I would be annoyed, but this is completely different.
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mommy3b2c




 
 
    
 

Post Fri, Aug 07 2020, 9:32 am
amother [ Dodgerblue ] wrote:
Crying Ouch. Did I really deserve that? (referring to the post about kids who behave horribly grow up to be adults who...)


I hope not. I hope you are not really the type that would leave a kid stranded outside all day.
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number




 
 
    
 

Post Fri, Aug 07 2020, 9:34 am
mommy3b2c wrote:
So you acted horribly as a kid. I guess people who behave horribly as kids grow up to be adults that think it’s normal to leave people sitting for hours outside with no place to go.
What was that story about the rav who knew the man was a thief because he suspected others of stealing?
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amother
Seafoam


 

Post Fri, Aug 07 2020, 9:36 am
amother [ Dodgerblue ] wrote:
Crying Ouch. Did I really deserve that? (referring to the post about kids who behave horribly grow up to be adults who...)

No many teenagers would do that.
My friend told me (when we were teens) that she always finds the master bedroom door locked in so-and-so’s house whenever she babysits.
I thought to myself even as a teen that they’re very smart. Because If she tried the door to their master bedroom (for no reason, it’s not like she went to check on a sleeping baby) then it just proves that they were smart for locking it.
And whatever interesting thing she did find she would tell me about.
And she was a very nice girl!
And an amazing person as an adult.
Now as an adult I also lock my bedroom door when babysitters come, and I make sure to put anything private in there.
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amother
Dodgerblue


 

Post Fri, Aug 07 2020, 9:37 am
I’m going to bow out of this discussion. I thought it was just an imamother thread but it became personal and I feel hurt. I don’t know why it hurts but I think it’s because your impression on imamother is that you’re a kind and caring person and it feels weird to be judged so harshly by someone who is generally very nice. Wow.
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FranticFrummie




 
 
    
 

Post Fri, Aug 07 2020, 9:41 am
number wrote:
What was that story about the rav who knew the man was a thief because he suspected others of stealing?


It's like the story of the husband who is always coming home unexpectedly and checking under the bed to see if his wife is hiding a lover.

He's probably hidden under more than a few beds himself.
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naomi2




 
 
    
 

Post Fri, Aug 07 2020, 9:43 am
I'm also shocked that so many people think it's ok to leave a friend's child outside your house all day/night. Just wow. Where is the chessed?
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amother
Denim


 

Post Fri, Aug 07 2020, 9:46 am
amother [ Sapphire ] wrote:
I don't understand. He arrived at their house before the family left and they didn't let him in till they got back home?? This sounds crazy.
But we're only getting part of the story and this seems to be a misunderstanding.
We need to be careful about who we let into our homes unsupervised, but we also shouldn't leave a kid outside alone all day long. It was a family trip, they could've taken him along and he could've stayed in the car sleeping. Just leaving him outside is irresponsible and awful middos.

Legal taking him and letting him sleep in your car as opposed to him loitering outside you house is a huge difference. I would never let him stay in the car.
What if he overheated? Do you leave the keys in the ignition? Doe he have a license? He is a 17 YO boy! Is he insured to drive? What if the car gets rear ended. That would be a nightmare.
Nope. We are now paying for the boy to do the activity on our family trip. Once you take him in you are responsible.
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amother
Denim


 

Post Fri, Aug 07 2020, 9:48 am
OP where were you in all of this? Did you know his plans and how they were ironed out?
If he is old enough for you to be hands-off, than he is old enough to be responsible and the ownership is not on the "friend".
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mommy3b2c




 
 
    
 

Post Fri, Aug 07 2020, 9:48 am
amother [ Dodgerblue ] wrote:
I’m going to bow out of this discussion. I thought it was just an imamother thread but it became personal and I feel hurt. I don’t know why it hurts but I think it’s because your impression on imamother is that you’re a kind and caring person and it feels weird to be judged so harshly by someone who is generally very nice. Wow.


I apologize. I can be very harsh in my words when I feel like someone is being treated unfairly and people are defending the “perpetrators.” And for the record, I’m not judging you for the snooping. I only judge you if you would actually do something as mean as leave a teenager outside all day with no explanations, no apologies, and no food. I just can’t see a way to be dan lkaf zchus.
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