Food as reward or punishment

amother

Periwinkle

Mon, May 31 2021, 10:37 am

Zehava wrote:

Oish I’m so sorry. AFAIK at this age visitation cannot be forced. Do your teens know that?

they do, but they don't like conflict and have partially normalized this and other controlling behavior.

I am encouraging them to speak up and without encouraging them to not see their father, know they can change things if they want--and they just need to tell me and their dad and there are steps the adults can take to make a new schedule official.

smss

Mon, May 31 2021, 10:38 am

#BestBubby wrote:

All schools use food as a reward - especially with younger kids.

I think many schools are trying to move away from this, now that we know how harmful it can be to a person's relationship with food and also doesn't really accomplish what we wanted it to accomplish (maybe in the short term, not in the long term).

keym

Mon, May 31 2021, 10:39 am

chanchy123 wrote:

Not in my world. No way, especially not in younger ages, my older very occasionally earned a pizza party.
While this is not common in schools my kids attend I don’t consider sweets “food” in this regard. Candy is not and cannot be in the same category as food, it’s just a nice extra to have occasionally in moderation. My children’s schools do not use it as rewards (probably illegal in Israel).

I don't know. A siyum?
That's literally using food as a "reward" for completing the material, doing well as a class on the test.
My kids schools are moving away from the "junk fest" parties. But they're still doing pizza siyum, barbecue siyum, bagel and spread siyum.

amother

Mon, May 31 2021, 12:11 pm

keym wrote:

I think there is a nuanced difference between a party, which intrinstically has food as one component, and directly food. A party also is missing class time to celebrate.

amother

Mon, May 31 2021, 12:13 pm

smss wrote:

Intrinsic motivation is the thing that sticks with you in a positive way for life and builds self discipline, so that would be a very nice move imo.

chanchy123

Mon, May 31 2021, 12:22 pm

keym wrote:

This does not exist in my kids’ (Israeli DL) schools not as a regular thing and especially not in younger grades.
As I said there have been very occasional pizza parties or movie with popcorn and maybe artikm (what do you Americans call them ices/popsicals?)
These are very occasional like once a year, not as a regular educational tool.
It’s a different mindset. And again to me a barbecue, bagel, pizza siyum sound like great ideas- not food as a reward but food as part of a celebration, a meal - not all the same as candy as a reward. Regardless though, these things do not exist in my children’s schools.

keym

Mon, May 31 2021, 12:29 pm

chanchy123 wrote:

So what do your kids do when they finish something significant. A parsha in Chumash? A Sefer of Navi? A masechta of Mishnayos?
Do they celebrate just not with food? Or is it business as usual. Finished Maseches Yuma, onto Sukka?
Curious.

Teomima

Mon, May 31 2021, 1:41 pm

chanchy123 wrote:

Yup, same. My kids (also in Israeli DL schools) never get candy or junk from their teachers. Kids are not allowed to bring junk into school, either. I am shocked when I hear people talking about how much junk food their kids are getting at school (seems to be mostly the American schools?)

amother

Slateblue

Mon, May 31 2021, 2:11 pm

amother [ OP ] wrote:

Ie: You can't have dessert until and unless you finish your dinner, you didn't behave so you don't get dessert, you didn't behave so you do not het to go out with rest of us for said food treat and we won't bring any back for you...... I think it is not uncommon.

This sounds horrible to be honest. I had a very close friend whos parents did this, not finishing your plate. The issue was they’d serve the portion sizes and whenever I went there I was never able to finish. They wouldn’t let me leave the table even if I didn’t finish, and now still to this day I have an issue with overeating, way past the point of being full.

That eventually got worse, when as a teenager we had financial struggles and didn’t always have a lot of food at home. Whenever I had the opportunity to eat a lot I ate waaay more than I needed to, and it kept getting worse. I ended up developing bulimia

Through my experiences I met a lot of girls with eating disorders, and they all developed it from having their food controlled in some way during their childhood. Some the control was for positive reasons, like treats, some negative. I think for most people it would create pretty unhealthy relationships with foods, even if it doesn’t escalate that far to the point of an eating disorder

tweety1

Mon, May 31 2021, 5:17 pm

amother [ OP ] wrote:

My kids want ices. I tell them them they can't have unless they eat dinner first. It's not called a punishment at all. They must eat dinner first. Nothing wrong at all. After the shabbos meal they wanna run out and play with of course ices. I want the dining room clean. Clean up, and then you can have your ices outside. I honestly don't see anything wrong.

amother

Mon, May 31 2021, 5:30 pm

tweety1 wrote:

Psychologically there is a big difference the way you phrase it. Do you see how this sounds different and is taken differently
"You cannot have ices unless you eat dinner first".
"Sure, you can have ices tonight after dinner".

Kiwi13

Mon, May 31 2021, 7:48 pm

I used to be 100% against using food as a reward or punishment, especially since I had an eating disorder when I was younger. As a parent, though, I've found that not too many things are 100% absolutes.

My kids sometimes get an extra end-of-the-day treat before bedtime. Usually it's a small cookie or chocolate kiss or something, but other times it's a sticker or animal figurine that they get to close their eyes and pick from a box. They can earn or lose this privilege based on their behavior during the day. Meals are not like that at all, including desserts. We only do dessert on Shabbos anyway, so if even if they misbehave, they still get a treat in honor of Shabbos. Desserts/treats are never tied to clearing your plate or eating enough of the meal or whatever else. You won't lose it if you refuse to eat chicken or vegetables, but you probably will lose it if you smack your brother a million times during the meal.

Barring extremes, I file this whole thing under the category of things that work differently in different families.

tweety1

Mon, May 31 2021, 8:27 pm

amother [ OP ] wrote:

So now you're getting down to nitty technicalities. It will not effect their mental health or relationship with food. I mean really, Help

Teomima

Mon, May 31 2021, 8:49 pm

tweety1 wrote:

So now you're getting down to nitty technicalities. It will not effect their mental health or relationship with food. I mean really, Help

I disagree. OP is right, there is a difference when it comes to how a child processes the interaction. The first puts food on a pedestal, making it a highly coveted reward for which there is first a price to pay. The second makes it a natural progression of the meal, making no big deal of the treat and giving it no role other than a sweet end to a meal.

chanchy123

Mon, May 31 2021, 9:28 pm

keym wrote:

Generally they’ll finish a Chumash or masechet in a school year.
When they finish a parsha (at a young age) they’ll say chazak chazak and maybe sing a song. These things are not such a big deal.

Iymnok

Tue, Jun 01 2021, 3:04 am

Today my son has a siyum for finishing a parasha. He asked to bring potato kugel. I had him make it yesterday (okay, he put to potatoes through the food processor, opened the eggs and poured the batter).
Its a celebration of accomplishment. He will likely come home with a fancy document stating he finished the parashe, signed by the principal.