My kids are so cruel. Oh, so cruel

amother

DarkKhaki

Tue, Aug 09 2022, 5:41 am

I just want to say that putting kids in a room together and making them work it out is sickening. Sickening. The stronger person ends up winning, whether its physical force or forceful personality. I was the one who always lost out and I rarely speak to my older sister who was horrible to me and I have a distant, formal relationship with my parents and family overall. To me, both as a child and now an adult, this method is just a ploy to give the parents a break so they didn't have to bother. While yes, parents sometimes are overwhelmed and will need a break, this should never be a preferred method when parents are trying to be mechanech kids.

The adult should be with the kids, the adult should be the one to show them how its done. By demonstrating the right kind of language. Kids can take turns to say to each other when you do XYZ, I feel ABC. Showing how to communicate feelings. Then giving each kid a turn to offer a solution and figuring out what will work. Or offering solutions yourself and let them decide.

This process takes a long time. So a lot of times, the kids just get annoyed and stop fighting already because they have no patience left to work it out and by default just figure it out. But each time, they learn more about how to communicate and how to find solutions that are respectful to both.

If I do anything, anything, in this life, its that I leave children who feel that they care for each other and can rely on each other.

amother

Steel

Tue, Aug 09 2022, 5:53 am

amother [ DarkKhaki ] wrote:

I invite you to our home. Our kids are loving and communicative. They work out their fights themselves and I am firm that there is a "no fighting in front of me" rule. So, if they fight, they are put in a room together or we lock ourselves in our room. We've been consistent so we rarely have to put this into practice.
On the other hand, I grew up in a home where my mother always. Got. Involved. I barely speak to my siblings and we fought horribly all. The. Time.

amother

Gold

Tue, Aug 09 2022, 5:56 am

I have a 12yr old and 8yr old who don't stop fighting. I mostly stay out of their fights and don't take sides. The 12 yr old is much bigger and stronger so I am constantly pulling the 8yr old away so she doesn't get seriously hurt, without blaming or accusing anyone. Now my 12yr old thinks I am always siding with his younger sister.

I feel like you just can't win no matter what you do.

PinkFridge

Tue, Aug 09 2022, 6:32 am

amother [ Steel ] wrote:

You're probably both on to something. Generally, letting the kids work it out for themselves - with the parents noticing if there's an imbalance/too much vatranus - is fine and healthy. But when there's something beyond normal kids knowing how to push each others' buttons, outside hadracha is needed and kids need specific skills and guidelines.

Hatzlacha to everyone and may we all see nachas.

amother

Steel

Tue, Aug 09 2022, 6:41 am

amother [ OP ] wrote:

So many good response , yet also conflicting. I guess there's no one-fits-all rule. Everyone has to see what works in their home.

Also, many of these suggestions are for older kids. My older ones are now in camp so I'm pretty much dealing w a 2, 4, 6 and 7 yo. I guess I'll begin experimenting and see what works.

Same ages as our kids and perfect ages to do this method. Its true that if they are older, there can be an significant imbalance of power in the room, but at these ages its very workable. And honestly, I usually avoid these threads because I'm not here to make anyone feel bad that our kids get along really well. I'm just sharing a method that works. For the naysayers, well....keep doing what you're doing.

Also, we pay a lot of attention to any tiny act of kindness like that was so thoughtful you gave your sister a lick of your lolly (etc). Privately, between ourselves, we call these small moments "yossele the miser" after the shlomo story of the miser who was always labeled a stingy miser until the kotzker rebbe needed to ask him for tzedaka and complimented him profusely on the small rusty penny he gave. You can predict the rest of the story yourself.

In any case, focus on the small gestures. Find them. The microagressions get dismissed with one word "unkind " and look away. The hard lines are no hitting another human even and swift punishment.

Basic fighting out of my sight and in your room together now.

amother

Carnation

Tue, Aug 09 2022, 7:10 am

They are competing for your attention. Show them they don't have to. Bring out their best by complimenting, encouraging, praising every single good thing they do. Make a big deal when they say something nice.
They are still so little. There is no reason for them to be anything other than sweet and kind.
Ignore anything you can to put the emphasis on good behavior.
At the same time, teach social skills. Practice saying the proper response to "my ice pop is better than yours" or "I don't like your dress."
Get down to eye level and show them how their sibling's face looks when they're hurt. Practice reading each other's facial expressions.

Bnei Berak 10

Tue, Aug 09 2022, 7:22 am

amother [ DarkKhaki ] wrote:

I grew up in a household which I felt was very unfair and wanted to change it. I took a parenting course that emphasized creating a home that speaks the language of shalom.

There are strict rules about hitting. You.are.not.allowed.to.hit.anyone. And they don't. Because we just don't do that. Do sometimes kids hit? Yeah, everyone's normal. But they stop fast.

We talk about shalom like a joke is only funny if its funny for both people. We use the word "also" like instead of I'm better than you, we can use also. I'm also good at it. Stuff like that.

Agree with the no hitting rule. It's simply not acceptable. Full stop.

amother

Begonia

Tue, Aug 09 2022, 12:11 pm

amother [ Ginger ] wrote:

I wish I had an answer for you. I just wanted you to know you're not the only one. If dh raises his voice to tell our ten year old he did something he shouldn't have our five year old starts crying. My sil's kids are just like yours. Dh and I see how mean they are to each other it and it bothers us but they're not our kids so we're just grateful we don't have to deal with it. I don't think it's because we're amazing parents and sil is doing everything wrong. I think some kids are just born more empathetic and some with more of a mean streak. It's figuring out how to raise them that's important. I hope you get some good help.

So nice that you recognize that! As a very capable and wonderful (if I may say so myself) mother of some very challenging children, I wish more people would realize that!!

ora_43

Tue, Aug 09 2022, 1:14 pm

amother [ Steel ] wrote:

I don't doubt that this works for you, but you're pushing it pretty hard considering that it's a method that can go VERY wrong in the wrong circumstances.

I'm all for having kids work it out themselves but the parent can't just step out of the picture. You need to be there in the background making sure that one kid isn't always the one giving in (or being bullied into giving in).

There are also different kinds of fights. If two kids are fighting over nonsense, yes, by all means, force them to work it out themselves. OTOH if one kid hurt the other for no good reason, the last thing they need is to feel like their parents are going to force them to deal with it alone.

clarity1

Tue, Aug 09 2022, 1:46 pm

ora_43 wrote:

I agree. if kids dont have the skills to work it out, throwing them into a room to figure it out on their own wont educate them. you can teach them negotiation skill by modeling it, by helping them word their requests, being their coach in learning how to use words instead of hands and how to problem solve.