Is the internet dangerous for adults ?

FranticFrummie

Tue, Aug 09 2022, 6:23 am

A while back, one of my cats knocked over a glass of water, and some of it got in my computer. It was beyond repair, and it took me a while to find a second hand one that I could afford.

When I finally got another one, you know what was the most depressing thing I found on the internet?

IMAMOTHER.

The intolerance, hatred, bigotry, ignorance, and petty arguing. IMHO, it's more damaging to my soul than any p0rn. I hadn't even realized how stressful and toxic this place could be, until I was forced to take a break from it.

I'll still check back now and then, but the second things get nasty I click right back out again.

I'd rather watch nature documentaries or learn a new crafting skill on YouTube.

PinkFridge

Tue, Aug 09 2022, 9:45 am

shabbatiscoming wrote:

I follow the torah, but I do not live by daas torah. This conversation happens so often on this site. Living by daas torah is something that is done in the charedi communties, not all frum communities live that way. Yes, our community has a rav, a wonderful rav, but I dont ask him about everything in my life, not even close. If I have a question that is a halachic based question that I dont know the answer to or that myself and/or my husband could not find the answers if we look it up, then we go to our rav. Other than that, no, I dont. I would never in a million years think to ask a rav about the internet.

So, your premise is only true in your community that accepting daaas torah equals following the torah.

Let the tomatoes fly!!!!!

Are there rabbanim in your community who ever speak about hashkafa? Not as in you must do this but the world is changing, are you using all the tools you can? What's informing your decisions? That kind of stuff.

PinkFridge

Tue, Aug 09 2022, 9:45 am

salt wrote:

Also it says in the Torah

עַל־פִּ֨י הַתּוֹרָ֜ה אֲשֶׁ֣ר יוֹר֗וּךָ וְ/עַל־הַמִּשְׁפָּ֛ט אֲשֶׁר־יֹאמְר֥וּ לְךָ֖ תַּעֲשֶׂ֑ה לֹ֣א תָס֗וּר מִן־הַדָּבָ֛ר אֲשֶׁר־יַגִּ֥ידֽוּ לְךָ֖ יָמִ֥ין וּשְׂמֹֽאל׃

But I agree this is also open to discussion as to how far it goes and in what fields one has to listen to rabbinical authorities.

But just wanted to say that this is where the idea of daat torah comes from.
Not only from pirkei avot - aseh lecha rav.

And I want to add that there is asking shailos, and turning to wise people for insight.

shabbatiscoming

Tue, Aug 09 2022, 12:11 pm

PinkFridge wrote:

Im sure there are rabbanim in my community who talk about hashkafa. And?
But no, the rabbanim are not talking about the things you asked. I grew up and am now as well, in a community where learning is important. I do not go to a rabbi to find out what information should be helping me in a decision for things. Thats not what I go to a rav for. And thats why my communnity and the charedi community differ in daas torah and asking rabbanim questions when we have halachic questions.

PinkFridge

Tue, Aug 09 2022, 3:25 pm

shabbatiscoming wrote:

I heard a very chareidi rosh yeshiva say that people ask too many questions. That they should be able to think for themselves. But that doesn't mean that people don't seek counsel (eitzos, not necessarily shailos) at all.

amother

Maroon

Tue, Aug 09 2022, 3:55 pm

amother [ Junglegreen ] wrote:

Please show me where anyone called someone an apikores.
And it’s also rude and hurtful to make false statements.

No false statement.
I can’t even count the amount of times I and other posters have gotten both of these statements on imamother.

Not hating another Jew and not shaming another Jew are more important in the Torah than having a filter.

I hope you at least know these basics.

amother

Winterberry

Tue, Aug 09 2022, 4:10 pm

I really don’t view this as a daas Torah thing necessarily.
In my opinion it’s more that rabbonim are often the first port of call in crisis involving the internet, even before therapists, and so they have a more generalized view of how it’s privately impacting individuals and families.

shabbatiscoming

Tue, Aug 09 2022, 4:12 pm

PinkFridge wrote:

Not sure of your point exactly, but even that, going to rabbanim for advice, thats more so a charedi thing and not so much a MO thing.

amother

Oxfordblue

Tue, Aug 09 2022, 4:16 pm

Just a few of my own thoughts on this discussion:

1) The internet, like anything, can be used for both good and bad. It's the person using it that holds the cards.
2) IMO, the shallow, self-absorbed, depression-causing lifestyles that one is constantly exposed to on the internet via social media and the news is far worse than any inappropriate content one may be viewing. At least a person watching p0rn knows it isn't healthy. But people seem to think that showing off their vacations / wardrobes / etc. is totally fine, and even empowering. We're constantly exposed to ideals and lifestyles that are so the opposite of wholesome and meaningful, and we don't even realize it until we ourselves are caught up in it too. And these are things filters don't necessarily block.
3) The concept of "daas torah" is so subjective, it has become a basically worthless term. Anyone's cousin's uncle's Rav can be called "daas torah", regardless of how well versed they are in the particular details of a given topic, and then their word is considered like the word of G-d. I think it's a destructive term that should be replaced with "your Rav", "your mentor", and sometimes "a professional" when talking about things outside the jurisdiction of halacha.

zaq

Tue, Aug 09 2022, 5:39 pm

amother [ Oxfordblue ] wrote:

Just a few of my own thoughts on this discussion:

people seem to think that showing off their vacations / wardrobes / etc. is totally fine, and even empowering. We're constantly exposed to ideals and lifestyles that are so the opposite of wholesome and meaningful, and we don't even realize it until we ourselves are caught up in it too. And these are things filters don't necessarily block.

There's such a thing as personal responsibility. One can use the internet without signing up to any social-media sites. Filters are fine for blocking unwanted material, but relying on them exclusively is a copout. You don't need a filter to block Instagram et. al. You have a brain. Nobody's forcing anyone to join these sites, and you don't get hooked on them by accident. You have to join, and you have to log in. It's not at all like getting a p@rnographic popup on your screen. And FTR, I've seen the ads in frum pubs like BP Shopper, and if they aren't gashmiyus p@rn, I don't know what is.

skyeblue

Wed, Aug 10 2022, 12:35 am

ora_43 wrote:

IMO having a filter is like putting the corn chips on a high shelf instead of leaving the open bag in front of your face.

If you have no self-control, a filter won't help.

If you have perfect self-control, you don't need a filter.

But if you're in the other 90% of humanity, it makes it a little bit easier to make good decisions without burning through your daily dose of self-discipline.

What a great post