Mean Kids | Imamother

Motek

Tue, Jun 20 2006, 12:11 pm

In another thread, someone described kids making fun of a child in camp, making her cry, she left camp early.

I so wonder - what kind of homes do these mean kids come from? Are the parents aware of what stinkers their kids are? Are the parents the same way?

I mean, we're talking about frum kids from frum homes!

It's horrible!

gryp

Tue, Jun 20 2006, 12:32 pm

the mean kids come from homes where the parents decide to ignore this kind of bad behavior because kids are kids and will eventually grow out of it.
in the meantime, until their kids grow up (if ever!), there are tens of other miserable classmates and bunkmates.

shayna82

Tue, Jun 20 2006, 12:47 pm

GR I agree, and I also think that the kids coming from homes where the parents sit around and talk lashon harah and not nice th ings about people in the community, end up being snobs and insulting kids, because hey if their own parents talk about so and so, what so wrong about it.

I have seen this over and over again, I see the parents do it, and I see the kids learn and take it all in.

southernbubby

Tue, Jun 20 2006, 12:54 pm

Whenever I was told that my child had been mean, I tried to do something about it. One time one of my sons did not want to let an unpopular boy play with a toy that he had brought for recess. The teacher told me about it and I made him take the toy to the boy's house and let him play with it. I also made him invite the boy to our house to play.

dleah

Tue, Jun 20 2006, 1:09 pm

some parents think "kids will be kids" or "let them work it out"

some parents think that the other children bring it on themselves and it's just too bad for them. example : In another thread a poster described how a child of a well known (but not well regarded) rabbi was treated poorly by other kids in school and when I wrote that it was sad for the school that they allowed this, a poster wrote back that it is the father's fault for behaving the way he does.

some parents do not show respect for people who are different and their children follow them even in situations where the parents would not approve.

some parents are just not aware.

Inspired

Tue, Jun 20 2006, 1:38 pm

I think they come from homes with lots of othering, where racial slurs and the like are tolerated and even encouraged. Where looking down on others is okay and the message that treating people badly because they might be different is given between the lines.

gryp

Tue, Jun 20 2006, 1:57 pm

Quote:

the same kind of parents, btw, ignore when their children bother adults too.
dont ask me how but I know kids who used to be so obnoxiously annoying to be around, and now they are such nice girls/boys.

the kind of parents I referred to in my above post, are the nicest people. I guess they just have different parenting ideas than I do.

Secbeb

Tue, Jun 20 2006, 4:18 pm

I think that a lot of bullying has to do with low self esteem and low self confidence. Sometimes kids are mean to other kids who are less popular because they don't want to be seen as outcasts too. They want to fit in because they are insecure about their position of popularity. This behavior shouldn't be acceptable but at the same time its pretty common amongst children - because their yetzer harahs has a 12/13 year head start on their yetzer hatovs. I myself remember different clicks and changing BFF every other day. . huge fights. . .ahavas yisroel talks from the principal to our class. . .and I was from a class of 4 kids. I can't even imagine schools with hundreds of children finding one's place and feeling secure in it. Parents should make sure to keep on top of their children's middos 100%, but I think that a child being mean comes more from trying to fit in, than just stam to be mean.

Motek

Tue, Jun 20 2006, 4:45 pm

Secbeb wrote:

This behavior shouldn't be acceptable but at the same time its pretty common amongst children

I don't know about that Confused

We can see altruistic, sensitive, loving behavior from tiny tots.

So seems to be a combination of nature and nurture. Some kids are born with fine middos. And chinuch in the home definitely makes a huge difference.

roza

Tue, Jun 20 2006, 4:54 pm

I would like to add something constructive to this thread.

Schools, camps need to give/teach children tools for conflict resolutions / peacemaking.

I saw one school using the STEP method of peacemaking and found it worked great in most cases and eventually greatly freed up a teacher as children became better problem solvers/peacemakers. The best part of it is that eventually children work it out on their own, with adult only helping them if needed. Of cause in the beginning a teacher must practice together with children (as a part of classroom lessons).

Here are the links for the STEP method overview:

http://www.peacelearningcenter.....e.pdf
http://www.peacelearningcenter.....c.pdf

I wish there would be something like that in our schools, it can be connected with the inyan of 'talmidim of Aaron - ochev Shalom verodev Shalom'.

I think we can use these steps at home too. I try to remember that every difficult situation in our children's everyday life is in fact a 'TEACHING MOMENT' , an opportunity for a child to grow and learn, but we as adult need to guide them in this growing process and give them 'tools'. Just like in the garden we can't ignore the garden and think that everything will grow on it's own.

Please post your thoughts and ideas on the subject.

Motek

Tue, Jun 20 2006, 5:05 pm

roza wrote:

I try to remember that every difficult situation in our children's everyday life is in fact a 'TEACHING MOMENT' , an opportunity for a child to grow and learn, but we as adult need to guide them in this growing process and give them 'tools'. Just like in the garden we can't ignore the garden and think that everything will grow on it's own.

sounds right!

Secbeb

Tue, Jun 20 2006, 7:08 pm

Motek wrote:

Secbeb wrote:

This behavior shouldn't be acceptable but at the same time its pretty common amongst children

I don't know about that Confused

altruistic, sensitive, loving behavior. . .but quite limited. Ask a 2 year old to share his or her toy and it would be an exceptional child who would acquiesce. The concept is beyond their grasp at this age.
A large desire of school age children is to be accepted, and to fit in. Children want what their peers have. If all the kids are wearing red shirts, the school age child will want to wear a red shirt. If everyone is picking on or ignoring one child, it would be an exceptional child who would go and befriend this child, or stand up and defend this child (get them alone together without the threat of peer pressure and they'll probably play together very nicely.)
This behavior should be corrected, like I said, and children should be guided, but developmentally, it is very hard for a school age child to understand that its okay to be unique, or different - that so-and-so isn't necessarily right just because he or she is popular.

granolamom

Tue, Jun 20 2006, 8:30 pm

Secbeb, I pretty much agreed with everything you posted. I know a child or two from very decent homes (involved and caring parents who are not afraid to discipline appropriately) who happen to be, well, mean.
I think you hit the nail on the head when you write that

Quote:

its not always a reflection on the parents.

goldrose

Tue, Jun 20 2006, 8:46 pm

GR wrote:

Quote:

the kind of parents I referred to in my above post, are the nicest people. I guess they just have different parenting ideas than I do.

gr, as far as children who are annoying, I think (my perception) that although they come from parents who are "the nicest people" they are lacking attention. I think that is where the annoying part comes in. They arent secure knowing that when they need attention they will get it, and therefore they have to pester people at any opportunity they get, to make sure they get the amount of attn they need. What do you think?